The Wankel is dead. Long live the.. erm... ordinary engine
Discussion
Apologies if this has been posted already, but I couldn't see anything from a quick search:
link
Seems to differ slightly from this story on PistonHeads back in August in that they appear to be playing down the possibility of introducing a successor... 'research continuing but production is now not making sense when considering the costs of meeting safety and emissions standards for new vehicles' instead of a definite target date?
link
Seems to differ slightly from this story on PistonHeads back in August in that they appear to be playing down the possibility of introducing a successor... 'research continuing but production is now not making sense when considering the costs of meeting safety and emissions standards for new vehicles' instead of a definite target date?
Sam_68 said:
Apologies if this has been posted already, but I couldn't see anything from a quick search:
link
Seems to differ slightly from this story on PistonHeads back in August in that they appear to be playing down the possibility of introducing a successor... 'research continuing but production is now not making sense when considering the costs of meeting safety and emissions standards for new vehicles' instead of a definite target date?
Hang on - that article states the RX-8 will cease production - however rotary development will continue.link
Seems to differ slightly from this story on PistonHeads back in August in that they appear to be playing down the possibility of introducing a successor... 'research continuing but production is now not making sense when considering the costs of meeting safety and emissions standards for new vehicles' instead of a definite target date?
It is a shame, and a shame to me that I just don't love the RX8 - I never really clicked with the styling. However, I would love to drive one, it must be incredible revving to 9000rpm. However, as an ownership propsition, I would not go there. The fuel consumption is poor for the power achieved and the engines seem to have a short life and all invariably suffer rotor-teeth wear, poor compression etc eventually. Not helped, I'm sure, by casual drivers buying them to tart around in, not fixing failing coilpacks and acelerating the damage.
But alas, it's still very sad as a petrolhead and Pistonheader, to see an icon of of enthusiasts motoring go by the wayside. While not on the same level as Honda giving up on the Type R badge, it is sickening to see the Japanese manufacturers, once the forefront of hardcore, cheap performance cars, forsaking years of dominance and brilliant products to make green crap.
Still, this line from the article sums it up
"Mazda's decision underlines how consumer tastes have changed to preferring green vehicles over sporty ones".
What a funeral.
But alas, it's still very sad as a petrolhead and Pistonheader, to see an icon of of enthusiasts motoring go by the wayside. While not on the same level as Honda giving up on the Type R badge, it is sickening to see the Japanese manufacturers, once the forefront of hardcore, cheap performance cars, forsaking years of dominance and brilliant products to make green crap.
Still, this line from the article sums it up
"Mazda's decision underlines how consumer tastes have changed to preferring green vehicles over sporty ones".
What a funeral.
Mastodon2 said:
But alas, it's still very sad as a petrolhead and Pistonheader, to see an icon of of enthusiasts motoring go by the wayside. While not on the same level as Honda giving up on the Type R badge, it is sickening to see the Japanese manufacturers, once the forefront of hardcore, cheap performance cars, forsaking years of dominance and brilliant products to make green crap.
Still, this line from the article sums it up
"Mazda's decision underlines how consumer tastes have changed to preferring green vehicles over sporty ones".
What a funeral.
100% this. Whilst I don't really get on with the wankel, it was always glad there was a car maker with the balls to make something different from the crowdStill, this line from the article sums it up
"Mazda's decision underlines how consumer tastes have changed to preferring green vehicles over sporty ones".
What a funeral.
The next rotary is coming, Mazda has confirmed development again and again and again after chinese whispers like this every year since the RX-8 started.
The RX-8 is coming to an end, but there will be another rotary engine, it was only a couple of days ago in fact that Mazda themselves confirmed they'd found significant improvements over the current Renesis engine with the new one.
The RX-8 is coming to an end, but there will be another rotary engine, it was only a couple of days ago in fact that Mazda themselves confirmed they'd found significant improvements over the current Renesis engine with the new one.
Max_Torque said:
I never understood why you would pour millions of Yen into a concept that is fundamentally flawed with regard to efficiency. In 1990 maybe, but 20111, i don't think so !!
Like those bloody ineffiecent piston engine thingamabob's they started working on in the 1800's?They were a dead end too...
Mastodon2 said:
"Mazda's decision underlines how consumer tastes have changed to preferring green vehicles over sporty ones".
Sadly, manufacturers are now forced to listen to the sad t
ts who talk about 'efficiency' and 'miles per gallon' as opposed to buyers who are interested in performance and drive quality. Baryonyx said:
Sadly, manufacturers are now forced to listen to the sad tts who talk about 'efficiency' and 'miles per gallon' as opposed to buyers who are interested in performance and drive quality.
Are they really though? Seems like 90% of people see mpg and road tax as the sole deciders when buying a carts who talk about 'efficiency' and 'miles per gallon' as opposed to buyers who are interested in performance and drive quality.PhillipM said:
Max_Torque said:
I never understood why you would pour millions of Yen into a concept that is fundamentally flawed with regard to efficiency. In 1990 maybe, but 20111, i don't think so !!
Like those bloody ineffiecent piston engine thingamabob's they started working on in the 1800's?They were a dead end too...
Why would you want a "range extender" with poor efficiency, any more than you want a conventional engine with poor efficiency ?? Rotaries have a good case for low noise / low NVH, and a partial case for packaging / mass optimisation. But a range extender engine actually needs to be more efficient than one that directly drives the wheels due to the "round trip" energy losses asscociated with electro mechanical hybrid drives and power storage etc.
AVL have a rotary range extender in development, but Lotus , Mahle, GM, BMW, Ricardo et-al all use reciprocating architectures.
AVL have a rotary range extender in development, but Lotus , Mahle, GM, BMW, Ricardo et-al all use reciprocating architectures.
Because, with turbo'd engines, if you optimise the port sizes and timings for a single rpm, along with the plug and injector placement, you can get similar efficency to an optimised piston engine of the same output, even with the chamber size/shape disadvantage, and you have packaging bonuses.
Provided you can nail the reliability down...
Provided you can nail the reliability down...
Negative Creep said:
Are they really though? Seems like 90% of people see mpg and road tax as the sole deciders when buying a car
It's true, when someone gets a new car these days you can bet the first questions they will get asked is "How many miles per gallon do you get?" and "What's the tax like on that?". Buy a performance / luxury / older car and the first thing you will be asked is "I bet that uses loads of petrol".The buyer looking for efficiency might be the 90% of the market buyer now, but that doesn't mean they aren't a dull t
t.PhillipM said:
The next rotary is coming, Mazda has confirmed development again and again and again after chinese whispers like this every year since the RX-8 started.
Except that this is a Japanese whisper, attributed directly to a Mazda spokesperson: Mazda spokeswoman Michiko Terashima said:
...production is now not making sense when considering the costs of meeting safety and emissions standards for new vehicles.
When do you think that considerations of meeting safety and emissions standards will be relaxed to the point where the wankel starts to make sense again, then?PhillipM said:
...it was only a couple of days ago in fact that Mazda themselves confirmed they'd found significant improvements over the current Renesis engine with the new one.
Do you have a link to the announcement - it seems odd that they are making such contradictory press announcements so close together?Sadly, I doubt that Mazda themselves have got all that much choice in the matter... they're now too far into bed with Ford, whose only reputation for innovation is in perfecting the cost-led approach of production line standardisation.
The 'ongoing developement' bit sounds suspiciously like that well-known Japanese tradition of 'face' kicking in?
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff