Making it lap faster

[300bhp/ton]

Ok, here's the hypothetical situation:



1999 Subaru Turbo 2000, 100% stock.


Which do you think would have the biggest affect on lap times (say a standing start on the Top Gear test track driven by the Stig).


Option 1 - uprated suspension, up rated brakes, improved aero, sticky semi-slick tyres.


Option 2 - uprated exhaust, intake, turbo and engine making 300-330hp.




So the question (if it still appears hidden), is:

What makes the biggest contribution to lap times; handling & grip or power?

[mike88]

Trick question.

Depends on the track, Cadwell park would require brakes/handling, and a really fast track like Donnington would be power i assume.

[Scrambled]

Why a Subaru

[braddo]

Option 1 on the basis that you'll be able to do a lot more laps and have more fun.

[Mr Ben]

Scrambled said:

Why a Subaru

I guess as its a fairly good allrounder as standard?

If we were using a 80's Yugo it might be more biased toward POWER!!

[jbi]

depends on track but tyres are a biggie IMO

[varsas]

Sticky tyres will make a huge difference and, certainly after 10-20 mins or so depending on the track/driver, I assume the standard brakes will just give up. More power will just make the brakes overheat even sooner. You haven't mentioned ditching weight, I assume that comes under options 1.

I am assuming we are talking about more then just one lap, and that standard Subaru brakes aren't up to sustained track work.

Edited by varsas on Friday 21st October 11:45

[kambites]

On a track like the top-gear one, option 1.

If your example track had been the 'ring, it would have been a harder question.

[ShayneJ]

Option 1 as all the power in the world is useless if you cannot get it on the ground
or make it go round a corner.


edit because i cannot read !

[wildman0609]

always tyres and suspension first when upgrading for lap time. brakes next but then, over a single timed lap standard ones may be fine. then once the car handles increase the power

[McSam]

Apart from anything else, uprating everything but the power will allow you to learn the car properly. Once you understand it and know how to drive it to its best, then you can think about trying to make it more powerful - don't forget the car isn't the only thing doing the laps!

[Twilight1]

I ran my DC5 Integra way more faster at tracks compared to my Evo's and Impreza's I've had. Sure they are depending on the courses but lets say if there is corners, mechanical grip is way more important than mechanical power. My current 2003 STI is rubbish at track in stock form.

[RobM77]

It's obviously a balance, but it's almost always grip and handling that contribute the most to lap times. I've raced many cars with the same power to weight ratio but with vastly different laptimes, and it's all been down to grip and handling. Grip allows you to brake later, corner faster, and start accelerating earlier.

As an example, look at a current Formula Renault racing car. It has slightly less power and the same weight as a Caterham R400, so circa 400bhp tonne, but it's so much quicker than the R400 that the gap between it and the Caterham is bigger than the gap between the Caterham and a Metro. Within two corners the Renault would be gone. Also - in a straight line, the FRenault will do 0-100 is 4.9 seconds, whilst the R400 would take, I expect, about 9 seconds, and that's not even the downforce, that's just the mechanical grip. Even a Yamaha R1 superbike, with double the power to weight ratio of the FRenault, is considerably slower than that. That's an extreme example, but it is all indeed about grip.

[300bhp/ton]

mike88 said:

Trick question.

Depends on the track, Cadwell park would require brakes/handling, and a really fast track like Donnington would be power i assume.

How's it a trick question? I named a track in the op and a driver.

[Whitean3]

Option 3: driver training.

This will make a far bigger difference than anything else (and I KNOW this would be the first think I would do if I was serious about doing a lot of track days)
Otherwise, I'd say option 1.

And I'm definitely NOT accusing the OP of being a bad driver AT ALL- but for me, the biggest improvement you can get is to extract the most from your car. I know for a fact that my car is 1000x more capable than I am!

Edited by Whitean3 on Friday 21st October 11:56

[Chunkychucky]

Uprated brakes, suspension and stick tyres, i'd fk the aero off in favour of turfing out the back bench and spare wheel

[kambites]

Whitean3 said:

Option 3: driver training.

This will make a far bigger difference than anything else (and I KNOW this would be the first think I would do if I was serious about doing a lot of track days)

You think the Stig needs driver training?

[Jasandjules]

As said above, power is no good if you can't get it down. So Option 1, though another poster with Option 3 has it covered completely.....

[RobM77]

Whitean3 said:

Option 3: driver training.

This will make a far bigger difference than anything else (and I KNOW this would be the first think I would do if I was serious about doing a lot of track days)

Depending on the driver of course. I've seen F1 drivers share cars with lower level Pros and been similar in times, and equally, I've seen Pros share cars with amateurs and there been not much in it either. Coaching is always a great idea, but once you're up to speed you'll be shaving tenths off, not whole seconds. Having said that, some coaching to get two tenths per lap is usually better value than the car mods required to get the same thing. Your point's true for a lot of people though. I once helped out a guy on track days in an ex race car, and whilst he was a fairly decent driver I was comfortable sat next to, his fastest lap time of the day was ten seconds off the back of the grid from when his car raced the previous year. Considering that pole was 3 seconds quicker than that, that's a lot.

[Melvin Udall]

Option 1 first, then option 2 later on down the line.