Cat D.... what are the implications?
Discussion
Nick3point2 said:
Bit sensationalist.... Surely a Cat D is normally damaged body work or headlights, hardly structural stuff that needs expert repair.
Every claim is different, if it's a car only worth a couple of grand then yes headlamps and bodywork, but to write off a £30k car would take a lot more.Ive had 3 CAT-D cars and never really had any issues. One was written off due to engine damage after being driven through a puddle, one had been written off due to needing a slam panel straitened, a headlight & a grille and the other was unknown. Never had any problems selling any of the 3 off them and got market value for all of them (granted 2 were older cars so not a big issue). As someone has said the age of the car can make a difference regarding the extent of the repair the car has had, I would be a bit more wary of newer cars that have been written off unless I knew the full extent of the damage and knew that the repairer was a reputable one.
You know a cat d has been damaged - there are many non-recorded cars that will have had equally bad or worse damage but you'll have no clue unless you happen to spot evidence of repairs.
Another key factor is when the car was damaged. If it was 2 years old, the chances are that the damage was reasonably significant. If it occurred at 10 years old, it could be nothing more than a dented panel.
As for price, no you're not going to sell a Cat D for the price of a straight car but as long as you didn't buy it for the price of a straight car then it's all relative.
Another key factor is when the car was damaged. If it was 2 years old, the chances are that the damage was reasonably significant. If it occurred at 10 years old, it could be nothing more than a dented panel.
As for price, no you're not going to sell a Cat D for the price of a straight car but as long as you didn't buy it for the price of a straight car then it's all relative.
I think I saw something about some garage which inspects the car to ensure it is completely as new (damage wise) and if it passes the inspection is is reclassified to say it was a write off but is now in pretty much new condition. I think the article said that a lot of cars on the road would fail the test it is that rigorous.
my old E36 M3 was a cat D, never suffered any issues which could have been caused by the accident other than trying to sell a cat D.
IMHO the most important thing is to check how old the the car was when it was written off, In my case the car was 7 or 8 years old and worth around £11k so any claim over £7k would have written it off, not that major damage as the SMG pump which cost 1/2 of that was damaged in the accident. Looking at the car, had the same accident had happened a couple of years earlier it would have been repaired and later owners would never have know. Other cars I looked at when buying mine had had bigger accidents but where HPI clear.
Now had the car been written off at 6months old when it was still a £30k car I'd have been more concerned about the amount of damage.
Only other thing is I'm not sure how often you get all of the service records.
IMHO the most important thing is to check how old the the car was when it was written off, In my case the car was 7 or 8 years old and worth around £11k so any claim over £7k would have written it off, not that major damage as the SMG pump which cost 1/2 of that was damaged in the accident. Looking at the car, had the same accident had happened a couple of years earlier it would have been repaired and later owners would never have know. Other cars I looked at when buying mine had had bigger accidents but where HPI clear.
Now had the car been written off at 6months old when it was still a £30k car I'd have been more concerned about the amount of damage.
Only other thing is I'm not sure how often you get all of the service records.
Cat D means "at some point an insurer decided not to repair it for FINANCIAL reasons" (Cat C means exactly the same but they disliked the customer more!!)
The implications are few - basically, the car is harder to sell - so needs to be accordingly cheaper to buy (no set rules but 30-50% cheaper probably isn't far wrong).
You'd inspect the car in the same way you would any other - just because you know there's "repaired" damage doesn't mean there isn't more but at the same time, cars without a category could easily have poor repairs (or even NO repairs to existing damage) so check everything - always.
A Cat D is not 1 iota more or less likely to 'fold up in an accident' or 'have a wheel fall off' or anything else - it's idiotic to assume that a car which has no Category is somehow flawless and undamaged - I'm willing to bet for every Cat C/D on the road there are 4-5 cars with no category which have seen worse damage.
p.s. there is one reason for write-off which is so nasty people often lie about it - and that's flood damage. You can't really 'repair' a car which has been roof-deep in water but you can bodge it and say it had a minor knock instead - so that's something to check for moreso than with other cars - perhaps.
The implications are few - basically, the car is harder to sell - so needs to be accordingly cheaper to buy (no set rules but 30-50% cheaper probably isn't far wrong).
You'd inspect the car in the same way you would any other - just because you know there's "repaired" damage doesn't mean there isn't more but at the same time, cars without a category could easily have poor repairs (or even NO repairs to existing damage) so check everything - always.
A Cat D is not 1 iota more or less likely to 'fold up in an accident' or 'have a wheel fall off' or anything else - it's idiotic to assume that a car which has no Category is somehow flawless and undamaged - I'm willing to bet for every Cat C/D on the road there are 4-5 cars with no category which have seen worse damage.
p.s. there is one reason for write-off which is so nasty people often lie about it - and that's flood damage. You can't really 'repair' a car which has been roof-deep in water but you can bodge it and say it had a minor knock instead - so that's something to check for moreso than with other cars - perhaps.
Take two identical looking cars.
Car one is a CAT rated car, you know (in theory) that it has been looked over by a professional, repaired by a professional and deemed roadworthy by a professional, then put back onto the road.
Car two was in an accident but not reported. The owner paid for the repairs but you don't know who repaired it. It could have been a bodyshop or the owners uncle who has a compressor.
Which would you trust?
Car one is a CAT rated car, you know (in theory) that it has been looked over by a professional, repaired by a professional and deemed roadworthy by a professional, then put back onto the road.
Car two was in an accident but not reported. The owner paid for the repairs but you don't know who repaired it. It could have been a bodyshop or the owners uncle who has a compressor.
Which would you trust?
johnpeat said:
Cat D means "at some point an insurer decided not to repair it for FINANCIAL reasons" (Cat C means exactly the same but they disliked the customer more!!)
The implications are few - basically, the car is harder to sell - so needs to be accordingly cheaper to buy (no set rules but 30-50% cheaper probably isn't far wrong).
You'd inspect the car in the same way you would any other - just because you know there's "repaired" damage doesn't mean there isn't more but at the same time, cars without a category could easily have poor repairs (or even NO repairs to existing damage) so check everything - always.
A Cat D is not 1 iota more or less likely to 'fold up in an accident' or 'have a wheel fall off' or anything else - it's idiotic to assume that a car which has no Category is somehow flawless and undamaged - I'm willing to bet for every Cat C/D on the road there are 4-5 cars with no category which have seen worse damage.
p.s. there is one reason for write-off which is so nasty people often lie about it - and that's flood damage. You can't really 'repair' a car which has been roof-deep in water but you can bodge it and say it had a minor knock instead - so that's something to check for moreso than with other cars - perhaps.
That's pretty much it. I always work on a rule of thumb of -33% for a Cat D and -50% for a Cat C and cars offered for sale over the years have borne that out with reasonable accuracy. In addition to the lower price you're able to ask, it will also take longer to sell, price notwithstanding, so be prepared for that, but as said, you're also buying cheaper and with that effect reducing with time (i.e. 33% off a £6k car vs. 33% off the same car at £3k two years later means you're still "ahead" by £1k), it's still to your advantage to do so - subject to the quality of the repair work of course. The implications are few - basically, the car is harder to sell - so needs to be accordingly cheaper to buy (no set rules but 30-50% cheaper probably isn't far wrong).
You'd inspect the car in the same way you would any other - just because you know there's "repaired" damage doesn't mean there isn't more but at the same time, cars without a category could easily have poor repairs (or even NO repairs to existing damage) so check everything - always.
A Cat D is not 1 iota more or less likely to 'fold up in an accident' or 'have a wheel fall off' or anything else - it's idiotic to assume that a car which has no Category is somehow flawless and undamaged - I'm willing to bet for every Cat C/D on the road there are 4-5 cars with no category which have seen worse damage.
p.s. there is one reason for write-off which is so nasty people often lie about it - and that's flood damage. You can't really 'repair' a car which has been roof-deep in water but you can bodge it and say it had a minor knock instead - so that's something to check for moreso than with other cars - perhaps.
As another poster said, check with your insurer. Some will charge more to insure a category recorded car, not that they'll necessarily tell you it is one when you phone up with a reg number for a quote and it is undisclosed by the seller and you haven't HPI'd your prospective purchase.
As has also been said, there are plenty of cars on the roads that have had significanct/extensive body repairs without ever being recorded by insurers - quite often those tend to be vehicles that have had an accident whilst being dealership owned as the excesses on most franchised dealers' policies are such that it is cheaper for them to repair it themselves in most instances, so they effectively self-insure.
Deluded said:
Take two identical looking cars.
Car one is a CAT rated car, you know (in theory) that it has been looked over by a professional, repaired by a professional and deemed roadworthy by a professional, then put back onto the road.
Car two was in an accident but not reported. The owner paid for the repairs but you don't know who repaired it. It could have been a bodyshop or the owners uncle who has a compressor.
Which would you trust?
It doesn't help the decision making process.Car one is a CAT rated car, you know (in theory) that it has been looked over by a professional, repaired by a professional and deemed roadworthy by a professional, then put back onto the road.
Car two was in an accident but not reported. The owner paid for the repairs but you don't know who repaired it. It could have been a bodyshop or the owners uncle who has a compressor.
Which would you trust?
Car one may ALSO have had an accident and not reported (as well as the reported one).
Inspect car, check everything etc and make as informed judgement as you can.
"repaired and deemed roadworthy by a 'professional'", yeah right
There are loads of poorly repaired cars out there that's had a 'professional' give it the all clear.R0B. said:
Nick3point2 said:
Bit sensationalist.... Surely a Cat D is normally damaged body work or headlights, hardly structural stuff that needs expert repair.
Every claim is different, if it's a car only worth a couple of grand then yes headlamps and bodywork, but to write off a £30k car would take a lot more.Years ago a boy on a forum I used to be on bought a Vauxhall Senator from a salvage auction that was written off. The damage? Someone had tried to break into it and knackered the door handle/lock. The part was no longer available new so the car was written off by the insurance company. One door handle from a scrappy and he was away. An extreme case perhaps but a CAT C or D status should not mean avoid, just be aware and inspect it properly.
As with any 2nd hand car a thorough inspection is necessary, just because it isn't registered as CAT D or C it doesn't mean it hasn't been crashed. Stick "not recorded" into ebay and look at the results, a large number of these cars will be repaired and sold on without the fact they have been crashed being advertised.
As before, I'd want to see post accident pictures to see the damage.
And yes, I have put my money where my mouth is
As with any 2nd hand car a thorough inspection is necessary, just because it isn't registered as CAT D or C it doesn't mean it hasn't been crashed. Stick "not recorded" into ebay and look at the results, a large number of these cars will be repaired and sold on without the fact they have been crashed being advertised.
As before, I'd want to see post accident pictures to see the damage.
And yes, I have put my money where my mouth is
My first car ended up being a cut and shut. Two Astra GTEs welded down the middle. Only realised when I was told by a garage fitting a bodykit (I was young) that there was a weld seam, but they did say that it was a very impressive job. Drove that around for more than 3 years at various speeds without it missing a beat.
If you are prepared to accept the corresponding knock-on loss on sale price and smaller buyer market, and can find out to a degree of certainty what the damage was then I don't see why you wouldn't consider it. I personally wouldn't buy one now without knowing the circumstances of how it became Cat D unless it was already cheap enough to be worth a punt anyway.
If you are prepared to accept the corresponding knock-on loss on sale price and smaller buyer market, and can find out to a degree of certainty what the damage was then I don't see why you wouldn't consider it. I personally wouldn't buy one now without knowing the circumstances of how it became Cat D unless it was already cheap enough to be worth a punt anyway.
I've had a couple of Cat Ds. One of which was a 6 month old MX5 which we wouldn't have ever bought if it was a straight car as they were retailing for over £15k at the time (late 2006, it was an 06 plate).
I bought it for £4k and had it repaired by a guy I know. We used all new parts but sourced from a Mazda dealership in the states where the prices were less than half price of uk dealers.
It only needed 2 headlights because they were cracked and bumper had a crack, pre-tensioners and dash top plus two air bags.
Cost me 2k to repair and it was mint. Kept it 3 years and still sold it for £7k with photos of damage and repair bills.
Im not sure I'd want to buy a repaired one unless I saw the exact damage with photos then inspected the areas myself as I know people that have been selling damaged cars and pointed out the wrong part of the car to inspect so people think its ok!!
I bought it for £4k and had it repaired by a guy I know. We used all new parts but sourced from a Mazda dealership in the states where the prices were less than half price of uk dealers.
It only needed 2 headlights because they were cracked and bumper had a crack, pre-tensioners and dash top plus two air bags.
Cost me 2k to repair and it was mint. Kept it 3 years and still sold it for £7k with photos of damage and repair bills.
Im not sure I'd want to buy a repaired one unless I saw the exact damage with photos then inspected the areas myself as I know people that have been selling damaged cars and pointed out the wrong part of the car to inspect so people think its ok!!
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