Cheap runabout - 944, GTV, 205 1.9...

[gt69]

I'm drawing up a shortlist of cars for my wife to learn to drive a manual (already has auto licence, needs to get a proper one). Idea is she drives it on present insurance 3rd party (international licence), so it has to be 'disposable' - I will cover it 3rd party on mine. Budget started a grand, man maths took that up to 2.5 quite swiflty. OK, 3k tops. Here's the shortlist:

Porsche 944 S2
Peugeot 205 GTi 1.9
Golf GTI Mk1
Alfa GTV (3.0 V6, obviously)
Honda Integra Type-R
Renault Williams Clio

Obviously tempted by the Porsche, but I'm sure I'll scratch the Stuttgart itch at some stage anyway. I forgot about the Alfa for 2 or 3 weeks, but when else will I get to own a proper Alfa V6? And I mean a proper one, not some interloper from GM. Type-R - clearly brilliant, but budget is at low end. Having said that, compared with an Alfa, what could possibly go wrong? The 'dogs' seem to have a bit of wheelarch rust and dodgy batteries.

Anything I'm missing?

[Conian]

you put the 944 at the top of the list for a reason, you know its the right thing to do

[wackojacko]

944, would go earlier than an S2.... S2's are more complex than they are actually worth.

[Waynester]

I know this PH's but, is having a sport(s) car as a 1st manual to learn with priority?

Toss up between Porsche & Pug GT-I 1.9 for me. Getting on a little to these cars..

[johnhenry]

out of the whole list of cars, have come into contact and own (205 1.9 gti) with most of them. the most reliable car on the list for us was the alfa v6...never missed a beat in over a year (not long i know).
205 needs pretty much constant pampering, and can/will come over all french and just be difficult.

[AV12]

wackojacko said:

944, would go earlier than an S2.... S2's are more complex than they are actually worth.

Interesting. Why is that? What is a good alternative 944 do you think?

[gt69]

Waynester said:

I know this PH's but, is having a sport(s) car as a 1st manual to learn with priority?

Toss up between Porsche & Pug GT-I 1.9 for me. Getting on a little to these cars..

How hard can it be? It's got to be interesting, or I'll find the whole lesson thing tedious. Had thought of E21 3-series, but decided to steer away from classic cars.

I suppose there just might <cough> be the prospect of me using it on the odd trackday, as well as the general amusement factor.

have to say 944 has been consistent favourite. Yesterday it was the 205 vs 944, today the Alfa. There's a strong case to be made for all of them.

I guess the underlying theme is heritage or icon with affordability

Oh yes, had considered MX-5, MR2 (latest - what a bargain), but need rear seat for the bairn

Edited by gt69 on Thursday 8th December 23:13

[wackojacko]

AV12 said:

wackojacko said:

944, would go earlier than an S2.... S2's are more complex than they are actually worth.

Interesting. Why is that? What is a good alternative 944 do you think?

Something to do with cam chain tensioners etc iirc. I was going to buy an S2 as a winter hack but then after speaking to various people the outcome was to go for an early one or not at all.


OP have you considered a MK2 MR2 ?

[McSam]

Turn up your speakers

Hope this helps

[wackojacko]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PORSCHE-944-LUX-IMMACULA...

[Buff Mchugelarge]

Cheap runabout..
Mk5 Ford Escort 1.8D


NOT cheap runabouts..
Porsche 944 S2
Peugeot 205 GTi 1.9
Golf GTI Mk1
Alfa GTV (3.0 V6, obviously)
Honda Integra Type-R
Renault Williams Clio


All relative I suppose..

[gt69]

Buff Mchugelarge said:

Cheap runabout..
Mk5 Ford Escort 1.8D


NOT cheap runabouts..
Porsche 944 S2
Peugeot 205 GTi 1.9
Golf GTI Mk1
Alfa GTV (3.0 V6, obviously)
Honda Integra Type-R
Renault Williams Clio


All relative I suppose..

Obviously meant cheap to buy. If something goes wrong can just chuck it away - 3rd party insurance, remember

With the Alfa, I'd clearly just be buying an engine with a car attached

It's a bit like being in my early 20s again with the same budget, when I'd think 'If I had 2 grand to spend on a car (or 3 - wow!), I'd get one of these. What's ace is that I'm looking at cars in my old budget range because that is the genuine budget for this purchase - it's like meeting the hottest girl at college all over again, and she's still 22

[Sbloxxy]

Ran a 944S2 last year. Very impressive car.
Absolutely not cheap to run. Relatively complicated compared to most stuff of a similar age and required constant tinkering.
Even so well worth owning at some point. I've a few 944S2s and quite a few earlier 944s and they are like night and day. The S2 is light years ahead in every area.

[gt69]

Heaviness of steering or clutch may be an issue, as my wife isn't going to have much patience for anything 'difficult'. Porsche itch may be scratched anyway by a 924 Carrera GT I've got my eye on. She won't be driving that just yet, though

[McSam]

gt69 said:

Heaviness of steering or clutch may be an issue, as my wife isn't going to have much patience for anything 'difficult'. Porsche itch may be scratched anyway by a 924 Carrera GT I've got my eye on. She won't be driving that just yet, though

Just tell her all clutches are like that

In seriousness, the harder/less assisted the car she learns in, the better off she'll be. The amount of new drivers I've seen who've learnt in some year-old 207 and can't actually stop when they discover the brake pedal of their newly purchased Escort requires some pressure to use..

[Sbloxxy]

Actually now you mention it, that was an issue on my last 944S2. I'd convinced myself that it would be an ideal daily driver but its a bit too much of an 'event' for that. Even getting in and out of the car isn't the easiest (mine had the seats with the big side bolsters)so for short journeys where it wasn't even getting warmed up properly, the whole thing turned into a bit of a carry on.
I changed it for a Golf GTi (the 20v 1.8Turbo version) which was a doddle to use every day (and nearly as quick).

[Johnboy Mac]

Get her a Suzuki Swift for 3k. Buy & drive.

[205alive]

Non power steering could be an issue, maybe?

[aka_kerrly]

Wouldn't a 924s or 944 8valve be a saver bet as they are noticeably cheaper to run than the 16v variants and far simpler to work on should any engine related issues occur.

Also add to the list a Clio 16v and a Golf mk2 16v

[SturdyJ]

GTV V6 all day long.

Easy to drive, clutch isn't heavy, steering isn't heavy, it's FWD (predictable), and it is one of the best engines ever made.

The body is a composite so doesn't rust. The engine is rock solid provided it is serviced when it should be.

Plus you're buying her what is effectively a 2 seater Italian sportscar, with a wonderfully crafted leather interior, beautiful styling and an engine that sings. As opposed to a cheap seat in the 'I've got a Porsche' club...

Reasons she might not like it? It doesn't have a turning circle, and it doesn't have any ground clearance.

Edited by SturdyJ on Friday 9th December 10:53