Such cheap cars!
Discussion
Really had my eyes opened recently by my brothers cheap car purchases. His friend works in the motor trade so let's him know when things come up which he may find interesting. He recently bought a 2007 vectra estate elite auto 2.2, immaculate, one owner, 50k miles for £2850, next came a Mercedes S320 on a '51 plate with 101k full mercedes history, needs a bit of very cheap cosmetic tidying (wheels could do with a refurb and a couple of small parking dents) one owner for £1500! And now, to add to the fleet a 2005 Jag x type 2.5 sport 4x4, in silver, full black leather, immaculate, one owner plus demo with full jag service history for just £1350!!!!
This is a guy who two years ago had a brand new BMW 730d and Audi q7! Quite a change but he runs his own business and whilst he is currently doing very well, doesn't want to take on expensive lease deals, actually quite envious!
This is a guy who two years ago had a brand new BMW 730d and Audi q7! Quite a change but he runs his own business and whilst he is currently doing very well, doesn't want to take on expensive lease deals, actually quite envious!
sounds like ex-fleet auction stuff, going for silly prices just cause everyone assumes they have a million miles or are in awful condition! also earlier during my daily walk i saw a mustang being very well driven on an xmas day hoon with the arse hanging out round a greasy roundabout with the driver having a smile going from ear to ear!
Edited by Rowan138 on Monday 26th December 00:44
Anything that costs 400+ a year to tax has really been hit recently. But it throws up some interesting choices. I recently started car hunting with £2000 to spend. Shortlist now includes, 2003 Vel Satis 3.5V6 fully loaded, 2004 Alfa 166 3.0V6, 2005 Saab 9-5 2.3 turbo estate, 1998 Mercedes ML 3.2, 2003 Jaguar x-type 3ltr 4wd, 2003 Legacy 2.5....
Redlake27 said:
Anything that costs 400+ a year to tax has really been hit recently. But it throws up some interesting choices. I recently started car hunting with £2000 to spend. Shortlist now includes, 2003 Vel Satis 3.5V6 fully loaded, 2004 Alfa 166 3.0V6, 2005 Saab 9-5 2.3 turbo estate, 1998 Mercedes ML 3.2, 2003 Jaguar x-type 3ltr 4wd, 2003 Legacy 2.5....
I like the Vel Satis and seriously considered getting one. The thing that put me off was availability of parts. Some parts are shared with Nissan or other Renault models but many are unique to this car, and difficult to get hold of even through a Renault UK main dealer. A colleague of mine waited over 3 months for a front wing before giving up and sending the car to auction.Might be worth checking in with the owners' club to understand the parts situation, before committing.
With Renault downsizing their presence in the UK I expect it to get worse.
Redlake27 said:
Anything that costs 400+ a year to tax has really been hit recently. But it throws up some interesting choices. I recently started car hunting with £2000 to spend. Shortlist now includes, 2003 Vel Satis 3.5V6 fully loaded, 2004 Alfa 166 3.0V6, 2005 Saab 9-5 2.3 turbo estate, 1998 Mercedes ML 3.2, 2003 Jaguar x-type 3ltr 4wd, 2003 Legacy 2.5....
None of those are £400+ for VED. The date for the £400+ is 23 March 2006 and later.
Why would a '51 plate S320 be £1500 for any other reason than 'because its completely borked'? Given fixing the air suspension on these things costs thousands I am failing to see how good this purchase is. Decent ones can and do sell for much more, ditto the 2005 X-Type. 2005 X-Types that are not honking sheds don't sell for £1350.
The BS is strong with this one.
The BS is strong with this one.
Bitzer said:
None of those are £400+ for VED.
The date for the £400+ is 23 March 2006 and later.
TFFT, I've felt like a lone voice for months on that one, even among car-minded folk. The date for the £400+ is 23 March 2006 and later.
It's even incorrectly asserted in BMW Car's E60 530i buying guide this month who seem to think the early M54 engined cars attract the £445 rate, which they do not since they were superseded for the 05MY, a good year before the change and also why later cars have lower emissions and are taxed at £260, a mere £45 more than a 530d if memory serves.
Unloved kit through the trade can be buttons. At auction similar values can be had on low desirability/high bork options.
We picked up a 3 year old 50k mile loaded Laguna at an open auction for £2350+ fees a few years ago. Undesirable chod but bought to do the same job it's first owner spunked 18k on.
Why you'd want any of those three in a fleet I'm unsure. "Which underpowered if high spec heap to take today"
We picked up a 3 year old 50k mile loaded Laguna at an open auction for £2350+ fees a few years ago. Undesirable chod but bought to do the same job it's first owner spunked 18k on.
Why you'd want any of those three in a fleet I'm unsure. "Which underpowered if high spec heap to take today"
Fox- said:
Why would a '51 plate S320 be £1500 for any other reason than 'because its completely borked'?
It depends on the mileage, but ones which haven't been repaired from the inevitable rust and with a few miles and wrong spec really aren't worth much more than that in the trade.Look at it this way: you wouldn't want to retail a 51-plate S320 with under £1500 margin in it and you're never going to be able to sell one with a few miles for over £3000 so it has to be £1500 trade price.
Glass's puts a 90k miler - this one was only slightly over at 100k - at £3k trade £6k retail...
Must have been a particularly suspect example, in which case buying a suspect S class full of bork isnt worth singing from the roof tops about. It's like saying buying a heavily indebted company for £1 is a bargain...
Must have been a particularly suspect example, in which case buying a suspect S class full of bork isnt worth singing from the roof tops about. It's like saying buying a heavily indebted company for £1 is a bargain...
Fox- said:
. 2005 X-Types that are not honking sheds don't sell for £1350.
It depends on the mileage, but, say a 2005 2.5 SE with about 50k is worth about £2500 in the trade so if it is a bit tatty and done 100k and someone wants shot £1350 is not impossible.A 2.5 X-Type is the kind of car most dealers have cold sweat nightmares about and will offer very low px on and be desperate to shift via trade contacts. Slow + awful fuel consumption means no one wants them.
Surely the trade value of these cars reflects the desireability of them so this sort of stuff is taken into account. Otherwise why do dealers waste thousands a year on automotive intelligence from CAP and Glass's if the value system doesnt take into account the relative undesireability of say a 2.5 X-Type or S320?
Sure I appreciate there are factors affecting this sort of stuff but half trade book has to scream bork right?
Sure I appreciate there are factors affecting this sort of stuff but half trade book has to scream bork right?
Fox- said:
Surely the trade value of these cars reflects the desireability of them so this sort of stuff is taken into account. Otherwise why do dealers waste thousands a year on automotive intelligence from CAP and Glass's if the value system doesnt take into account the relative undesireability of say a 2.5 X-Type or S320?
They do, to a degree, but guides are very poor on some cars. The going rate on ebay (which is sometimes a better guide!) for tidy 2000/2001 S320's with around 100k is £2500. For a slightly tatty px one which a dealer is desperate to shift £1500 is plausible.I know they could send it to auction, but unless they are a major dealer group with their own auction section they'll never get close to CAP or Glass's in a general sale.
The going rate on Ebay is £2500?
This one is at £2100 already with 2 days to go, 260,000 miles and being sold as Spares or Repair! Sure it's a diesel but at this mileage and this status I'd imagine thats more of a turnoff than a turnon. The satnav doesnt work, the gearbox is borked, the heater is broken, the bumper is falling off...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2001-51-MERCEDES-S320-CD...
Yet still far higher than £1500..
IMHO the bork is so strong with any 51 plate S Class that only sells for £1500 that its value is irrelevent.
When you are dealing with a car where any fault can be 4 figures+ to rectify unless it's in perfect working order the actual value of it is irrelevent. A cheap car isn't cheap if it requires a £4000 airmatic refurbishment. It's actually expensive
This one is at £2100 already with 2 days to go, 260,000 miles and being sold as Spares or Repair! Sure it's a diesel but at this mileage and this status I'd imagine thats more of a turnoff than a turnon. The satnav doesnt work, the gearbox is borked, the heater is broken, the bumper is falling off...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2001-51-MERCEDES-S320-CD...
Yet still far higher than £1500..
IMHO the bork is so strong with any 51 plate S Class that only sells for £1500 that its value is irrelevent.
When you are dealing with a car where any fault can be 4 figures+ to rectify unless it's in perfect working order the actual value of it is irrelevent. A cheap car isn't cheap if it requires a £4000 airmatic refurbishment. It's actually expensive
confused_buyer said:
They do, to a degree, but guides are very poor on some cars. The going rate on ebay (which is sometimes a better guide!) for tidy 2000/2001 S320's with around 100k is £2500. For a slightly tatty px one which a dealer is desperate to shift £1500 is plausible.
I know they could send it to auction, but unless they are a major dealer group with their own auction section they'll never get close to CAP or Glass's in a general sale.
^^^ this the operative word is guide. I've not been in the trade for some time but I'd guess anyone buying bargey stock at book wants their head looking at. In fact apart from specialists, who will only be after the cream and most likely not source from auctions so they can make sure it is bork free. I'm sure the rest of the trade are steering well clear regardless of the price.I know they could send it to auction, but unless they are a major dealer group with their own auction section they'll never get close to CAP or Glass's in a general sale.
Therefore I can imagine there are some bargains at auction, not sure I'd be brave enough though you could end up with a very expensive lemon
Edited by waterwonder on Monday 26th December 12:08
Fox- said:
The going rate on Ebay is £2500?
Look through the finished items, there are several petrols. Cars like these are easily available for £2000-£2500 at auction, ebay wherever - I see them day in day out.Early petrols W220's have virtually zero retail appeal - they're going to hit the sub-£1k point for decent examples very soon. Late facelift examples with sensible mileage, nice spec and good history are easily found for under £5k.
Anyone who pays more than £5k for a petrol W220 of any type needs their head examined. W221's are getting down to £7k.
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