Rose jointed TCA's
Discussion
It's for a ford, capri. Will be using spherical top mounts as well.
I got the tca's for a very good price, but got the rose jointed ones rather than rubber which I was aiming for.
I don't want to ruin the ride too much, I have heard that these tca's can give you a jittery and wandery drive. Indeed Burton power say they should be used for competition only. So I wanted to hear from other users what their opinion of them is.
I got the tca's for a very good price, but got the rose jointed ones rather than rubber which I was aiming for.
I don't want to ruin the ride too much, I have heard that these tca's can give you a jittery and wandery drive. Indeed Burton power say they should be used for competition only. So I wanted to hear from other users what their opinion of them is.
I run a capri with a fully rose jointed adj.compression strut front end,roller top mounts and coil overs
with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
shoehorn said:
I run a capri with a fully rose jointed adj.compression strut front end,roller top mounts and coil overs
with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
That is a very helpful post mate, thanks.with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
I have seam welded the strut towers, and fitted the reinforcement plates on the inner wing tops. Stupidly I forgot to seam weld the rails before fitting the engine, so next time I take it out I'll do this.
I'm hoping to get a roll cage that extends to the strut tops, and then a
removable brace between them.
My concern with compression struts is that they will force removal of the Anti roll bar, which I do not wish to do. There isn't any space for inner wing to bulkhead gussets in the engine bay area, and I'm not sure how effective they will be in the wheelarch space.
I have seen double width kits for anti roll bar mounting, listed for escorts but I'm sure that they can be made to fit? Any drawback to these?
This is a capri too, by the way
captainsmelly said:
That is a very helpful post mate, thanks.
I have seam welded the strut towers, and fitted the reinforcement plates on the inner wing tops. Stupidly I forgot to seam weld the rails before fitting the engine, so next time I take it out I'll do this.
I'm hoping to get a roll cage that extends to the strut tops, and then a
removable brace between them.
My concern with compression struts is that they will force removal of the Anti roll bar, which I do not wish to do. There isn't any space for inner wing to bulkhead gussets in the engine bay area, and I'm not sure how effective they will be in the wheelarch space.
I have seen double width kits for anti roll bar mounting, listed for escorts but I'm sure that they can be made to fit? Any drawback to these?
This is a capri too, by the way
What shell are you using? if its an early non v6 then if possible find a v6 or later shell or car to look at.I have seam welded the strut towers, and fitted the reinforcement plates on the inner wing tops. Stupidly I forgot to seam weld the rails before fitting the engine, so next time I take it out I'll do this.
I'm hoping to get a roll cage that extends to the strut tops, and then a
removable brace between them.
My concern with compression struts is that they will force removal of the Anti roll bar, which I do not wish to do. There isn't any space for inner wing to bulkhead gussets in the engine bay area, and I'm not sure how effective they will be in the wheelarch space.
I have seen double width kits for anti roll bar mounting, listed for escorts but I'm sure that they can be made to fit? Any drawback to these?
This is a capri too, by the way
There are some extra small fillets and reinforcements here and there under the bonnet and inner wings that are very easy to make and worthwhile and take up no room at all that would not intrude on the engine.
As you are obviously stiffening the shell with a cage then some wont matter anyway.
If you are sticking with the arb set up then
Most of the escort stuff just bolts on,my comp struts are designed for escorts as probably are your tca`s.
Out of curiosity why are you set on keeping the anti roll bar,are you aware that the compression strut set up acts as an anti dive kit just by its layout?,
As you progress with stiffening the suspension the shell will take more of the load,cages go as far as the top mounts but the mounting points for the front anti roll bar is miles from there on a capri shell.
the loading from the wheels through the anti roll bar doubling up as a tie rod to the shell are transferred through the small front mountings onto two flimsy,quite long box section rails,the not stiff by any means front panel and large inner wings which are taking some serious forces from what is basically a lever at their outermost unsupported end.
By fitting a double kit you will stiffen the front end but will place more load on the front mountings/front frame and frame crossmember.
I found that their effectiveness doubling up for a tie rod decreases with the demand you place on them where as compression struts offer exactly the reverse plus the increased loads are going to a much stiffer part of the car.
Also he floor pan around the gearbox cross member/prop mount area will distort with too much power/abuse/lack of re-inforcing/2 piece props.
HTH.
It is a mk1 1600 shell.
The main reason I am Keen to keep the anti roll bar, is because the car will ride quite high, and also a bit heavy. An anti roll bar will, I think, help control body roll! Which compression struts do not do.
Although I was under the impression that comp struts attach to the AR bar mountings initially, further research shows me that the go onto the frame rail under the bulkhead which is clearly loads stronger.
I have rebuilt the front crossmember as the original was rotten, this part is no longer a weak link I can assure you!
Adjustablity is taken care of by adjustable tca's, eccentric top mounts and coilovers.
As you say, the crossmember is a long way from the struts. That length can be triangulated by a box section in the arch area, from crossmember side reinforecment right up to the strut tower, and another lengh down the other side from tower to bottom of bulkhead and rail. Also serving as pedal box bracing.
anti roll bar then attached with poly bushes, double width brackets and maybe a central mount too..?
I need to work out tunnel bracing, I already modded the tunnel but it won't be much stronger than the original, just wider.
Can you tell me more about your capri? It sounds pretty sorted
The main reason I am Keen to keep the anti roll bar, is because the car will ride quite high, and also a bit heavy. An anti roll bar will, I think, help control body roll! Which compression struts do not do.
Although I was under the impression that comp struts attach to the AR bar mountings initially, further research shows me that the go onto the frame rail under the bulkhead which is clearly loads stronger.
I have rebuilt the front crossmember as the original was rotten, this part is no longer a weak link I can assure you!
Adjustablity is taken care of by adjustable tca's, eccentric top mounts and coilovers.
As you say, the crossmember is a long way from the struts. That length can be triangulated by a box section in the arch area, from crossmember side reinforecment right up to the strut tower, and another lengh down the other side from tower to bottom of bulkhead and rail. Also serving as pedal box bracing.
anti roll bar then attached with poly bushes, double width brackets and maybe a central mount too..?
I need to work out tunnel bracing, I already modded the tunnel but it won't be much stronger than the original, just wider.
Can you tell me more about your capri? It sounds pretty sorted
shoehorn said:
I run a capri with a fully rose jointed adj.compression strut front end,roller top mounts and coil overs
with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
A very helpful post.with a fully jointed 4 bar rear set up with turrets,coil overs and a watts linkage,the downsides are the lack of noise insulation that rubber bushes give and loss of the slight compliance they offer over small undulations.
although that could be due to the hard set up of 225/250 lb springs on 35% uprated dampers wound right up.
If you are fitting tca`s with just the small inner bush converted then refitting them without first modifying or beefing up the anti roll bar mountings and outer tca bushes is pointless as all the play is in the a/r bar to tca bush and in the anti roll bar its self which triangulates or attempts to triangulate the front end.
Even with up-rated bushes the front wheels will move back and forth under braking,cornering and on bumpy roads.
The only real cure and its not cheap is to fit compression struts which do away with the anti roll bar and jelly outer tca bushes.
many will tell you that they are fine with just the hard bushes and they may be that,just fine but adj.compression struts are a massive leap forward with the added bonus of infinitely in situ adjustable geometry if you buy the adjustable tca`s of course.
A strut brace is a must,those long inner wings flex.
seam weld the inner wings where they meet the frame rails and some extra gussets around the inner wing bulk head area make a difference.
It all makes for a firm ride but a bit of discomfort for decent geometry that stays that way,precise steering,at least 1000% more feedback than standard plus the ability to last more than six weeks without needing new front tyres is a small price.
get the rubber dust covers for them or spend time keeping them clean,if they are not tip top then our less than ideal roads will punish them quickly.
I have a mk3 Capri, originally a 1.6L but now running a 2L turbo.
I am looking to add compression struts. I haven’t been able to find an off the shelf compression strut kit for the capri. I could try a pair of escort compression struts but have heard they won’t fit the mk3 capri. Hence I have a couple of questions.
What compression struts do you use?
Did you retain a sway bar of sorts? If so is it custom?
Do you have any pictures showing the compression strut and sway bar you could post?
Thanks in advance
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