Euro NCAP to mandate auto-braking in new-car test
Discussion
I expect to see an increase in accidents then, as drivers get complacent in tandem with these systems not working properly.
If the sensor that controls it is roughly the same as the type that controls automatic windscreen wipers, it'll be disastrous.
I've long suspected EuroNCAP has increasingly little to do with safety and more to do with keeping large numbers of bureaucrats in continual employment and brokering deals with European electronics firms to make their expensive new inventions compulsory purchases.
Yet another thing that'll make what should be cheap plastic replacement parts £hundreds and will necessitate a trip to an auto-electrician just to change a bumper.
What on earth happened to common sense? Who was it who said 'idiot-proofing just creates a better class of idiot'?
If the sensor that controls it is roughly the same as the type that controls automatic windscreen wipers, it'll be disastrous.
I've long suspected EuroNCAP has increasingly little to do with safety and more to do with keeping large numbers of bureaucrats in continual employment and brokering deals with European electronics firms to make their expensive new inventions compulsory purchases.
Yet another thing that'll make what should be cheap plastic replacement parts £hundreds and will necessitate a trip to an auto-electrician just to change a bumper.
What on earth happened to common sense? Who was it who said 'idiot-proofing just creates a better class of idiot'?
SSBB said:
It reads like you won't get a rating at all without it.
This is what EuroNCAP's press release said;"Michiel van Ratingen, Secretary General of Euro NCAP says ‘A faster penetration of these technologies into new cars will make it more realistic for the European Union to reach its target to cut road deaths by 50% by 2020. Consequently, Euro NCAP has decided to include AEB assessments as part of the overall star rating from 2014 onwards and hopes that European authorities will soon require AEB as mandatory on all new vehicle types.’"
otolith said:
SSBB said:
It reads like you won't get a rating at all without it.
This is what EuroNCAP's press release said;"Michiel van Ratingen, Secretary General of Euro NCAP says ‘A faster penetration of these technologies into new cars will make it more realistic for the European Union to reach its target to cut road deaths by 50% by 2020. Consequently, Euro NCAP has decided to include AEB assessments as part of the overall star rating from 2014 onwards and hopes that European authorities will soon require AEB as mandatory on all new vehicle types.’"
Are there really lots of people being killed by cars doing under 10mph? Few if any, I reckon. The worst a car doing 10mph will do is break your leg, unless it's an SUV, in which case the problem is dozy SUV drivers with no spatial awareness, which an auto-braking system isn't going to solve.
And once drivers realise their car will brake for them up to 10mph, they'll stop looking where they're going. How long will it be before they stop looking where they're going at 11mph?
Awarding cars big safety ratings for having such a complicated system of such limited effectiveness doesn't make much sense to me. I reckon it's got more to do with the usual routine - ie a firm makes a system, then lobbies the EU to make it compulsory.
To be honest, EuroNCAP's overall star rating has been a load of old balls forever. If you really care about how crash-worthy your car is, dig into the detail for the car you are interested in and figure out which of their individual ratings are important to you. For instance, the overall rating will be marked down for the lack of a seatbelt warning buzzer - if you aren't a complete retard, you probably don't really care about that. If you never transport children, you probably don't care about the tests relating to child injuries. If you are a bit of a misanthrope, you may not have much interest in the pedestrian impact figures. And so on.
Example report:
http://www.euroncap.com/results/bmw/3_series/476.a...
Boo hoo, it doesn't have a driver controlled speed limiter.
Example report:
http://www.euroncap.com/results/bmw/3_series/476.a...
Boo hoo, it doesn't have a driver controlled speed limiter.
Twincam16 said:
Thing is, these systems only work below 10mph anyway.
I don't think this is the case, or possibly only for extremely basic systems. The full fat systems use RADAR, LIDAR and computer vision and are capable of working at normal road speeds. I still think it's a crap idea however.Mr2Mike said:
Twincam16 said:
Thing is, these systems only work below 10mph anyway.
I don't think this is the case, or possibly only for extremely basic systems. The full fat systems use RADAR, LIDAR and computer vision and are capable of working at normal road speeds. I still think it's a crap idea however.Or rather it doesn't, as several accidents befalling cars fitted with the system have demonstrated. I suspect it's only really rigged up to work under the test conditions and offers no guarantee when you're actually out on the road. A bit like Abarth's traction control
There are three types of system - city systems, which only work at low speed, inter-urban systems which work at higher speeds and pedestrian systems which stop you running over squishy things.
Survey here of which manufacturers have which systems:
http://www.euroncap.com/results/aeb/survey.aspx
Survey here of which manufacturers have which systems:
http://www.euroncap.com/results/aeb/survey.aspx
So more people looking at their phones/stereo/nav screen/a book for extended periods because "the car will stop itself if there's a problem".
Fine, but a car can't see a problem developing, only react when it becomes an obstacle, by which time it's potentially too late.
Amazed people cannot see the danger in installing systems like this.
Fine, but a car can't see a problem developing, only react when it becomes an obstacle, by which time it's potentially too late.
Amazed people cannot see the danger in installing systems like this.
Ari said:
So more people looking at their phones/stereo/nav screen/a book for extended periods because "the car will stop itself if there's a problem".
Fine, but a car can't see a problem developing, only react when it becomes an obstacle, by which time it's potentially too late.
Amazed people cannot see the danger in installing systems like this.
For far too many people, computerisation = progress.Fine, but a car can't see a problem developing, only react when it becomes an obstacle, by which time it's potentially too late.
Amazed people cannot see the danger in installing systems like this.
They're so wrong it's unbelievable.
nonuts said:
Wow, so this is going to push, weight, complexity and cost up further for all new cars.
We have millions of cars without this on the roads so why make it mandatory at such short notice?
This is so they can introduce the 'johnny cab' and do away with personal transport......We have millions of cars without this on the roads so why make it mandatory at such short notice?
SSBB said:
This will effectively mean that all new cars will also have radar cruise control.
NO not at all, the system they are referring to is laser based. A unit is mounted in the windscreen. Having worked extensively in this field with various OEM's using it, its very very good. Almost completely infallible & totally unobtrusive. I think there is some data regarding the NCAP frontal test, if switched on some of the vehicles would only hit the wall at 15mph not 40mph.
However it does also work on 904nm which happens to be the same as police laser guns. In case your wondering yes it stops them clocking a disatnce/speed reading, well on LTI 20-20 dodgy scopes it does
Twincam16 said:
Thing is, these systems only work below 10mph anyway.
Wrong: Most manufacturers's quote 20mph, its due to the range of laser unit that measures or sees what is out in front. It is active above that & will reduce impact speeds above 20mph. It also pre-arms the brakes in anticipation, the system however is always on. It will see pedestrians, objects, cars whatever a 904nm light source can bounce off of. You name it we've tried it
cptsideways said:
NO not at all, the system they are referring to is laser based. A unit is mounted in the windscreen.
Having worked extensively in this field with various OEM's using it, its very very good. Almost completely infallible & totally unobtrusive. I think there is some data regarding the NCAP frontal test, if switched on some of the vehicles would only hit the wall at 15mph not 40mph:
How does it outbrake a person to the extent that it can be down to a third of the speed?Having worked extensively in this field with various OEM's using it, its very very good. Almost completely infallible & totally unobtrusive. I think there is some data regarding the NCAP frontal test, if switched on some of the vehicles would only hit the wall at 15mph not 40mph:
And how does it see a situation unfolding (a load shifting off the back of a truck on a motorway as a not very good example, or a car tearing down a side road on a collision course is perhaps a better one)?
And can it swerve around something or is its only option to brake (which might be far less preferable than an avoidance swerve, a child suddenly in the road for instance, which again a human might have seen occurring but presumably a machine can only react to once its there in front of it)?
Surely we're MUCH better off with drivers actually looking for hazards and reacting than relying on machinery to try and solve these, often complex, problems?
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff