Learning the Limits

[The_Burg]

Despite being a member here for years i've never had much of a PH car.
Best having been a T5 estate, stupidly fast in a straight line.
Alfa 156 2.4 TD, surprisingly quick and well handling.
and now a MGF VVC

How do you find your cars limits, without risking life and limb on the road?

Every corner i come up to in the MGF the car says pussy, you could have gone much faster.
Always worry about spinning / sliding out.
(Legal speeds of course).

Can't imagine it's up to doing a track day, brakes fade after a spirited legal speed drive.

[HustleRussell]

The key is to start with a car with very low limits, which are easily exceeded at everyday speeds- then you just progress from there. Consider a skid-pan day or some kind of simular event where you can exceed the limits in controlled conditions. Your brakes should not fade that easily, replace your fluid and fit mildly upgraded friction material.

[Matt UK]

Deserted out-of-the-way industrial estate with wide roads
6am Sunday morning
Damp weather is helpful

Go have a play.


Or I did a day with these guys back when I had an MX5
http://www.mazdaontrack.co.uk/car-control-days-56-...

[andi_p]

Try a carlimits day at North Weald.

[PUA]

any rear wheel drive car and an empty car park, preferably a little wet = a lotta fun, albeit at the expense of the tyres

[JREwing]

I started properly exploring limits with my old Mitsubishi L200. On roundabouts occasionally choosing the right gear, push the accelerator to the floor and feeling the back end go slightly (it had nowhere near the power to hold it there!)
Then once backing off the throttle in the wet through a corner in my Corsa the tail slid and whilst I was surprised, I did it more and more. 3rd gear, 50mph, let the tail slide and nail the throttle to pull it back in line.

Truthfully it's something I haven't done for a good couple of years......doing that in a Corsa is akin to polishing a turd (as far as the fun of handling goes), and I'm not going to pretend it's an entertaining car.

[Baryonyx]

The_Burg said:

Every corner i come up to in the MGF the car says pussy, you could have gone much faster.
Always worry about spinning / sliding out.

Thats the thing with the MG F (as well as my father-in-law's MG TF and the MR2 Turbo I had before it), mid-engined cars give that sensation. They can display tremendous grip because the back wheels have the weight of the engine sitting over them, and the front is free to steer without interruption. But as soon as you approach that limit of grip, the car may slide away from you, it may even go like a pendulum, fish-tailing down the road, and that is something you definitely want to avoid! The MG TF is a bit stodgy, handling-wise, but treated to a well balance throttle round a corner it can still make good progress.

With experience, you can feel when a car is on the limit without having to know exactly where that limit is and what the car will do when you cross that line. Listen to the tyres squealing, monitor the steering wheel for feedback (my MR2 became very 'light' at the front end under high speed, the Ford Focus I used to have used to 'weight up' mid corner as you approached the amount of load it would take when cornering.

Some cars do have an uncanny ability to continue to perform when it feels like they're going at 10/10ths. They're the ones you have to watch for, as everything you know to be a warning sign may be exhibited in the car's behaviour, yet it still seems to have some reserve of grip before it goes completely.

I often wonder though, about those who recommend going on a car limits day to get a feel for a road car. Sure, you might make use of having a general idea of where the limits are on an open, well sighted road, but I'd generally advocate advanced driver training before that for a better idea of how to actually read a road. That is the key the safer, faster drives than being able to balance your car in a slide for fun.