Agression from other cars - and scarily Commercials!!

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

Been meaning to post this one for a while - but today's antics reminded me...

Ok. My driving style - ex-racer, ex-mentalist, and ex-multiple ban holder for silly speeds, mostly on bikes but some in cars.

However, also as an ex-track day instructor (and PH member too, natch!) I take vehicle control, professionalism and regard for smooth progress and other road users very seriously.

All my silly driving was all over 10 years ago, and since then (now at 40 years old) I haven't had a nicking or accident, and try to drive well, defensively and smoothly. Especially now, as I am training to be an Ambulance Paramedic, so I try to be even more professional - besides, if I get more than 3 points on my clean licence while I'm at Uni studying medicine, it's goodbye to driving Ambos.

So, to sum up - careful progress is my current style. (Sorry for the long intro, but I think it's relevant to the point I'm gonna make.



Ok, part 2 of the story involves the M25 today, although I've had it recently on other motorways too.

We all know how much of a fag the M25 can be (and any motorway in heavy traffic, or that's had an incident ahead) most people, especially those in lanes other than lane 1, tend to accelerate, then the traffic bunches and stops, and then they have to brake hard, often to a standstill. This 'wave' effect is well known, and yet it seems not many people get it. The variable speed limits on the M25 have helped to eliminate it to some degree, by regulating this accelarate / bunch / brake hard effect a bit, so that you get a more even flow of traffic. I'm sure you all understand this, right?

So, when, like today, I'm on a very busy Motorway where this is going on in mostly lanes 2, 3, and 4 - I just sit in lane 1, in either 1st, 2nd or 3rd gear depending on how bad it is, letting the idling engine pull me along at 10, 20 or 30 mph.

The main factor of this is that it opens up a nice big buffer in front of my car - I like to have maybe 100 metres or so. This way, I never have to slow down or brake to a standstill, and it also means that other cars can either pull into lane 1 in front of me if they desire without me having to react, or if I'm going past a slip road, it allows traffic to easily join in front of me, with the same result that I don't have to brake.

Anyway - getting to the point - oh! This seems to REALLY annoy HGV drivers who may be behind me!! Just today in a 10 mile stretch of slow traffic, I had two artics and one woman in a Volvo sit right up my arse, and respectively flash their main beams in a hectic fashion, or 'beeep beep beep beep' on their horns.

Basically, they couldn't stand the fact that they were behind me and I had a large gap in front of me.

They wanted me to go faster, close the gap up to the next vehicle, and join in with the 'accelerate / brake' stop-start madness. Which doesn't get you any further, but increases wear on the car, makes you work harder driving, and raises the blood pressure.

In all these examples, as soon as they had a chance, they hectically swerved into lane 2 and overtook in a flurry of frustrated revs, and in one example, found time to give me hand gesture abuse

And as you can imagine, once they'd roared past, they very quickly had to top again in lane 2, to which I then serenely wafted back by again at 10 mph in lane 1, with my nice big gap in front of me

Anyone else had this kind of agressive ste?

[Birdster]

Yep. Seriously considering using the train to get to work. Adds a guaranteed half hour to my journey each way.

However after the delays this morning and this evening on the M25 I'm sick of it tbh.

[hesnotthemessiah]

As many people have commented in many, many similar themed threads......

'Most people are just selfish wa*kers' (sic).

So stick to your guns and f*ck the rest...

[Jasandjules]

Ray Luxury-Yacht said:

Anyone else had this kind of agressive ste?

Any journey on DC or motorway...... There are far too many t**ts on the roads these days who appear to have no idea how to drive, they seem to think they are invincible in their metal box.

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

True answers there folks.

I think the thing that annoys / worries me the most, is that these days, due to a hideous kicking from the recession and redundancies, I'm now going back to Uni for 3 years, and as such, am very very skint indeed.

I bought my Skoda VRS last year with my last bit of cash, and have spent money getting it to a lovely standard, with a few nice little handling and performance mods. Despite being 10 years old and worth less than 2 grand, it's a lovely example that I'd struggle to replace, and I certainly can't afford another car this sde of 3 years. So it's gotta last me.

Hence, I don't want any agressive, uncaring or in-attentive dicks damaging it or writing it off. That would cause me some serious grief. And yet it seems that everyone else drives like it doesn't really matter if they force an accident - in a 'who cares, that's what insurance is for' kinda fashion.

I try to drive my little Skoda around carefully with lots of space between me and other traffic - and yet I get 'road raged' for doing so!


It would be easy for me to lose my temper with some of these dicks, and my racing experience means that if I wanted to snap into a 'flat out' attitude, I could actually make these aggressive 'little men' look very silly indeed, and leave them for dust.

But I don't, much as I would maybe like to.


I dunno what the answer is - I despair. It does seem like Driving Licences are found in Cornflakes packets these days

[WhoseGeneration]

Ray Luxury-Yacht said:

True answers there folks.

I think the thing that annoys / worries me the most, is that these days, due to a hideous kicking from the recession and redundancies, I'm now going back to Uni for 3 years, and as such, am very very skint indeed.

I bought my Skoda VRS last year with my last bit of cash, and have spent money getting it to a lovely standard, with a few nice little handling and performance mods. Despite being 10 years old and worth less than 2 grand, it's a lovely example that I'd struggle to replace, and I certainly can't afford another car this sde of 3 years. So it's gotta last me.

Hence, I don't want any agressive, uncaring or in-attentive dicks damaging it or writing it off. That would cause me some serious grief. And yet it seems that everyone else drives like it doesn't really matter if they force an accident - in a 'who cares, that's what insurance is for' kinda fashion.

I try to drive my little Skoda around carefully with lots of space between me and other traffic - and yet I get 'road raged' for doing so!


It would be easy for me to lose my temper with some of these dicks, and my racing experience means that if I wanted to snap into a 'flat out' attitude, I could actually make these aggressive 'little men' look very silly indeed, and leave them for dust.

But I don't, much as I would maybe like to.


I dunno what the answer is - I despair. It does seem like Driving Licences are found in Cornflakes packets these days

www.pistonheads.co.uk/xforums/topic.asp?h=0&f=24&t=1191189&mid=76053&nmt=A+Challenge+to+PH++Tower.

Nope, all think they are the best driver there is.

Edited by WhoseGeneration on Friday 31st August 20:06

[kentmotorcompany]

I love the way when people post about a driving incident there has to be 2 or 3 paragraphs of defensive waffle to counter any possible chance of someone having a go and blaming the OP.

Shame PH makes posters feel like that sometimes, it must stop a lot of people from posting at all.


Anyway back on topic:
I think the OP is entirely correct in what he was doing, and it makes total sense to drive like that in those circumstances.
Personally I wouldn't drive like that because I would feel too conspicuous. Its a case of can't beat them, join them.

[drivin_me_nuts]

I see this on the M25 on pretty much every journey and I have formed the view that no rules apply on that particular road. Traffic can one minute being doing near the lepton and then the next a big fat zero. I tend to do the same as you and sit in lane 1 and 2 for as much as I can. I am also acutely aware of foreign lorries. I have seen so many sideswiped cars sitting on the bridge anticlockwise just over the M3 exit. I do find it quite eye opening sitting in those left lanes watching just how close together those faster cars are to each other. Today they were passing at I guess 90+ with less than a small car's length between them. They have no chance to avoid an incident around them.

[sjg]

100 metres when you're going at 20mph? You can keep a safe gap, avoid needing to brake and accelerate much and NOT look like a dithering imbecile by keeping less than a quarter of that.

Doing it on busy motorways is just encouraging the impatient to nip into your lane to try to make a few seconds progress - which takes away your safety buffer anyway.

And since when you needed a medicine degree to drive a big white taxi?

[WhoseGeneration]

kentmotorcompany said:

Personally I wouldn't drive like that because I would feel too conspicuous. Its a case of can't beat them, join them.

In their collision in many cases. Which explains so many RTCs.
I give up, if those here cannot appreciate how to drive safely, there is no hope.
Enjoy your ever lower limited roads.

[TheLordJohn]

hesnotthemessiah said:

As many people have commented in many, many similar themed threads......

'Most people are just selfish wa*kers' (sic).

So stick to your guns and f*ck the rest...

Generally down south, mind. I actively change my driving style between the north and south of the country. And again in Germany.

[kentmotorcompany]

WhoseGeneration said:

kentmotorcompany said:

Personally I wouldn't drive like that because I would feel too conspicuous. Its a case of can't beat them, join them.

In their collision in many cases. Which explains so many RTCs.
I give up, if those here cannot appreciate how to drive safely, there is no hope.
Enjoy your ever lower limited roads.

Sorry just to clarify (PH defensive mode on)

When I say can't beat them join them, I don't mean to say I drive in lane 3/4 right up the chuff of the next car.

In the driving conditions described I tend to drive in lane 2 with a sensible gap.
Whilst I appreciate the OP's point I just wouldn't make it in such obvious terms as to wind up other road users. You can't change everyone else's attitude with overly sensible driving, most people won't have a clue what your'e doing.

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

sjg said:

100 metres when you're going at 20mph? You can keep a safe gap, avoid needing to brake and accelerate much and NOT look like a dithering imbecile by keeping less than a quarter of that.

Doing it on busy motorways is just encouraging the impatient to nip into your lane to try to make a few seconds progress - which takes away your safety buffer anyway.

And since when you needed a medicine degree to drive a big white taxi?

Well, the gap is big I agree - but it's not just a safety gap or a buffer to avoid stop / start - it's also good for, I find, letting people into the lane in front of me, or letting traffic join from a slip road on the left, without me having to brake (and induce yet another 'wave' behind me in my lane)

So as you say, even the 'impatient' (who would probably barge their way in if there was no gap anyway) can come into my lane, without me having to touch my controls - and most of all, raise my blood pressure, even by a teeny amount!

And as for Ambo qualifications - yes, I could maybe get a job driving white Taxis as an 'Ambulance Technicain' (i.e. a van driver with a bit of first aid knowledge) but I am going down the full Para route...the role is the important direction for me - the Ambo piloting is a secondary necessity that comes with the responsibility.

Although, ultimately (and a bit O/T) with all my years of bike experience, both on the road and racing Nationals plus instructing - I am aiming for fast response Medibike pilot. My dream job, bar none. Wish me luck

[WhoseGeneration]

kentmotorcompany said:

WhoseGeneration said:

kentmotorcompany said:

Personally I wouldn't drive like that because I would feel too conspicuous. Its a case of can't beat them, join them.

In their collision in many cases. Which explains so many RTCs.
I give up, if those here cannot appreciate how to drive safely, there is no hope.
Enjoy your ever lower limited roads.

Sorry just to clarify (PH defensive mode on)

When I say can't beat them join them, I don't mean to say I drive in lane 3/4 right up the chuff of the next car.

In the driving conditions described I tend to drive in lane 2 with a sensible gap.
Whilst I appreciate the OP's point I just wouldn't make it in such obvious terms as to wind up other road users. You can't change everyone else's attitude with overly sensible driving, most people won't have a clue what your'e doing.

Apologies, I didn't get your meaning. It's just I'm a bit miffed at the moment about this 'site and its owners and employees atitude to safe driving, they thinking that encouraging such, especially by example, might lead to less traffic.
Then, I can always fk off, they won't give a toss.

[BadRotorFinger]

I think you'll find Ambo tech is abit more than van driver with first aid skills, just saying.

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

BadRotorFinger said:

I think you'll find Ambo tech is abit more than van driver with first aid skills, just saying.

Lee, was being a bit facetious just for the sake of concise thread comment

[Wills2]

I get where you are coming from Ray, but I think 100 yard's is too big a gap, I believe you can achieve your aims with a smaller gap.

I hate that kind of traffic too especially if you are in lane 3 or 4 with the traffic surging then braking constantly so I can understand where you are coming from.

[BadRotorFinger]

Ray Luxury-Yacht said:

BadRotorFinger said:

I think you'll find Ambo tech is abit more than van driver with first aid skills, just saying.

Lee, was being a bit facetious just for the sake of concise thread comment

Stretcher monkey too

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

Wills2 said:

I get where you are coming from Ray, but I think 100 yard's is too big a gap, I believe you can achieve your aims with a smaller gap.

I hate that kind of traffic too especially if you are in lane 3 or 4 with the traffic surging then braking constantly so I can understand where you are coming from.

Well, I know the gap sounds big Wills - and when the traffic has accelerated away from me in a 'spurt' then it may well look excessive.

However.

There's nowhere in the Highway Code or on a driving test that implies or teaches that a gap to the traffic in front is too large and should be closed down. Indeed, for the protection of my car's integrity, the safety of any passengers on a crowded and agressive motorway, and my own stress levels, the gap is quite acceptable and adequate, providing my vehicle is moving at a speed relative to the other traffic (which it is - and see my earlier posts about the fact that I am often travelling faster than the traffic in lane 2 to my right)

And as also mentioned, this gap seems about right to allow other traffic to frustratedly nip into my lane in front of me, without me having to brake, plus allow slip road traffic on too.

And most of all, I find that the gap opens out to around this distance as I said, when the traffic in front of me is on an 'accelerative spurt' but once it then inevitably has to brake to a standstill and then sit stationary for 15 or 20 seconds, then my vehicle trundling along at it's constant speed, very quickly catches the back of the line in front anyway, so the gap then closes to 50, 40, 30 feet or less - but importantly for me, never less than that, forcing me to brake to a standstill like all the other agitated lemmings.

See what I mean?

[HeatonNorris]

If everyone left a 100m gap between them and the car in front... what do you think it would do for road capacity?

That's far too big a gap for such a low speed, so I'm not surprised other drivers get hacked off about it.