Big power...it's not always been this way, has it?
Big power...it's not always been this way, has it?
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Discussion

Garlick

Original Poster:

40,601 posts

270 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Just thinking about a time when my Dad had a white Cavalier SRI which I loved. Why? Because it had 130 written down the side, marking it out as the most powerful of the SRI variants. Felt quick too.

Nowadays 130bhp would be laughed at in a family-sized performance car, but I guess that's the extra weight of cars required to carry all the toys and safety kit demanded today. I don't have much more to add really, but it's funny how times change.

Even today I add 'only' before saying 240 when asked what power the TVR has (and yes, it's been on the dyno)

Alucidnation

16,810 posts

200 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Cavalier Sri 130's were bloody fantastic cars!!!

From memory, those engines were almost bullet proof!!


Shadow R1

3,844 posts

206 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Modern cars need s**t loads of power because they all weigh so much.

rigga

8,806 posts

231 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Alucidnation said:
Cavalier Sri 130's were bloody fantastic cars!!!

From memory, those engines were almost bullet proof!!
Deffinatly not .....

Steve vRS

5,400 posts

271 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
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GroundEffect

13,864 posts

186 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Standards and expectations rise but so do vehicle weights.

E92 M3: 420BHP but 1625kg
E30 M3: 220BHP at 1300kg

Still, the E92 is massively more powerful.

jbi

12,700 posts

234 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
this had 430hp in the late 1960's


Raize

1,476 posts

209 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
My car's 125HP was complained about at release so I guess it has.

danjama

5,728 posts

172 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
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I know what you mean actually.

Garlick

Original Poster:

40,601 posts

270 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
jbi said:
this had 420hp in the late 1960's

Well I never knew that! Very cool

Strawman

6,463 posts

237 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
jbi said:
this had 420hp in the late 1960's

They were fast but that is an American 420 BHP isn't it? i.e. the engine dynoed with all the ancillaries taken off in an engine rig.

blearyeyedboy

6,811 posts

209 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Good question.

For example, a Jaguar E Type Series 1 with the 3.8 litre engine did 0-60mph in 7.1 seconds (The Motor, 1961).

Rather embarrassingly for the once-fastest-sportscar-in-the-world, a 3.0 diesel Jaguar XF will get from 0-60 quicker in the lowest power output form of that engine (6.7 seconds, 236bhp).

Times move on and cars have got a lot quicker.

LHD

17,002 posts

217 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Garlick said:
jbi said:
this had 420hp in the late 1960's

Well I never knew that! Very cool
It only had 420bhp downhill with the wind behind it...

jbi

12,700 posts

234 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Strawman said:
jbi said:
this had 420hp in the late 1960's

They were fast but that is an American 420 BHP isn't it? i.e. the engine dynoed with all the ancillaries taken off in an engine rig.
it was dynoed at 433hp and 472/lb-ft torque on the test rig...


Steve vRS

5,400 posts

271 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
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Double post - sorry!

Futuramic

1,763 posts

235 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Don't forget it's all relative. A Cav Sri - if I remember had an 8v 2 litre - was a quantum leap in normal saloon performance. That was more than a 3.0 litre Capri! So the performance cars of the electronic era were massivley advanced compared to their forebears. In the early seventies 40 or 50 Horsepower was common. Easily obtainable credit saw those previously running fifties and sixties bangers in new cars so to them the gains must have been staggering. Imagine going from a wheezing pushrod, single carb, four speed Leyland lump to an OHC, EFi equipped Vauxhall or SAAB.

One simply cannot do that these days. Even the cheapest car is not technologically different to the most expensive. Everything now has injection, electronic ignition, VVT and even forced induction. It's almost like power has plateaued where useful so the premium makers just add more to set their products apart.

If the chassis is right, is it really possible to use much more than 250 or 300 on a normal road? My humble saloon has 150, which is adequate. Most drivers cannot do anything much with it besides tromping the gas at a green light and pounding the brakes a second later when nerves or obstructions prevent further progress.

Bragging aside massively powerful cars are better off on the drag strip - I think the SRi 130 is pretty respectable given the overall good nature of the package.

slipstream 1985

13,774 posts

209 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
i'v found that as a result of modern cars getting heavier and needing more power to compensate i end up having to had "but the car only weighs 1000kg when people seem dissapointed at my car "only" having 350bhp.

jezhumphrey75

337 posts

178 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
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ive only got 170, oh well

s m

24,479 posts

233 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
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Futuramic said:
Don't forget it's all relative. A Cav Sri - if I remember had an 8v 2 litre - was a quantum leap in normal saloon performance. That was more than a 3.0 litre Capri!
Not more than a 3 litre Essex (138bhp) but certainly better ratio of bhp per litre

Strawman

6,463 posts

237 months

Monday 3rd December 2012
quotequote all
Futuramic said:
One simply cannot do that these days. Even the cheapest car is not technologically different to the most expensive. Everything now has injection, electronic ignition, VVT and even forced induction. It's almost like power has plateaued where useful so the premium makers just add more to set their products apart.
The other advance is traction control and stability control and brake assist, together with more advanced suspension design allowing averagely skilled drivers to use high powered cars more of the time safely. The American Muscle car market from the late 60's was partly killed off by emissions control and partly the high accident rates of those cars leading to higher insurance premiums which dampened the demand.