Should drivers of "fast' cars have tougher test to pass ?
Should drivers of "fast' cars have tougher test to pass ?
Author
Discussion

Cyrus1971

Original Poster:

855 posts

269 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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I am constantly aware that the driving test is a minimum standard to keep the roads "safe" and allow people and goods to move about the country.

This leads me to wonder if, due to the constantly increasing performance of cars and the nannying of the state, in principle, there is a need for a higher standard of driving test for such cars. I say "in principle" because I know the workability of such an extra test would be a pain.

Personally I think so. Based on a formulae of BHP / FtLB / Tonne. That one could only own and run, tax and use such a car if you had passed said test. Surely this principle is precisely the way Motorbike and HGV / specialist vehicle licences already work and we are in-consistant with that re cars ?

irob

121 posts

180 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Yea, great idea!
My first car is going to be a Ferrari so I'm doing my lessons in an F430.

Six Fiend

6,067 posts

245 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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What's the proportion of "fast" cars involved in crunches compared with "slow" cars?

Compulsory Pass Plus for all car drivers perhaps with a performance restriction similar to that faced by bike riders makes the most sense to me.

Ved

3,949 posts

205 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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I'd have to say no. The driving test as a whole should be tougher and more appropriate (motorways etc) as a bad decision at 30 in a 1.4 Polo is can be just as hazardous in a v10 Audi at 70.

BHP makes next to no difference. Not driving beyond the conditions or like a tool does.

anonymous-user

84 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Nope, everyone should be made to pass a tougher test in the first place. That way, driving standards might begin to improve.

Jasandjules

72,622 posts

259 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Ved said:
I'd have to say no. The driving test as a whole should be tougher as a bad decision at 30 in a 1.4 Polo is can be just as hazardous in a v10 Audi at 70.
This.



kambites

71,565 posts

251 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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I suppose you could argue for drivers to need to take an advanced car control test in order to drive higher performance cars, but in practice I wouldn't be surprised if the boost in confidence that that gave was actually greater than the increase in control, leading to more accidents not less. A better option might be to limit the power and/or performance of the cars that you can drive for a given time after passing your test - maybe three years?

On the whole, however, I'd just like to see the test made harder and more appropriate, and perhaps strengthened further with compulsory retests.

Erijaso

505 posts

285 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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+ 1 above.


kambites

71,565 posts

251 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Ved said:
BHP makes next to no difference. Not driving beyond the conditions or like a tool does.
I think insurance statistics would beg to differ, although of course the statistics don't tell us whether the bad driving is caused by the fast car or vice versa... it's perhaps more likely that dangerous drivers are simply more likely to buy a fast car in the first place.

paulwirral

3,828 posts

165 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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exactly that , bad driving causes accidents , not fast cars .

julian64

14,325 posts

284 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Err why. Not sure you have thought this through.

High performance car with giant tyres and giant brakes built for motorsport gets to do 70mph in this country.

2CV with virually no brakes and god awful ability to take a corner gets to do 70mph in this country.

Are you suggesting that the speed limit gets raised for the better driver/car combination, or are you really suggesting the high performance car driver above should go to the expense of doing further tests to be able to do the exact same speed as the driver who hasn't.

Captain Muppet

8,540 posts

295 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Six Fiend said:
What's the proportion of "fast" cars involved in crunches compared with "slow" cars?

Compulsory Pass Plus for all car drivers perhaps with a performance restriction similar to that faced by bike riders makes the most sense to me.
I suppose the difference is that I can pop out and buy a 600bhp/ton bike for a grand, and that bikes tend to fall over if either end loses grip. High performance cars are much less accessable, and tend not to fall over.

I know this means that Jonny-rich-dad can pop out and get a GTR when he's 17, but I think that's rare enough that we can discount it when it comes to making changes that affect everyone (and potentially warp the specifications for new cars sold in the UK). Plus I can't think of any car at any price that has the crash potential of a 20 year old Fireblade.

Although I see rubbish driving every day I can't remember the last time I saw rubbish driving which was related to vehicle performance. So maybe for cars just make the training better/harder for everyone (I've no idea how, as the problems mostly seem to be caused by not knowing things that are already in the test).

Captain Muppet

8,540 posts

295 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
quotequote all
julian64 said:
Err why. Not sure you have thought this through.

High performance car with giant tyres and giant brakes built for motorsport gets to do 70mph in this country.

2CV with virually no brakes and god awful ability to take a corner gets to do 70mph in this country.

Are you suggesting that the speed limit gets raised for the better driver/car combination, or are you really suggesting the high performance car driver above should go to the expense of doing further tests to be able to do the exact same speed as the driver who hasn't.
My first car was a 2CV. I definitely did all my most dangerous driving in that car, and not because 0-60 in 29 seconds was too fast. All of the rubbish driving was down to me being rubbish, not the extreme performance of the car.

Would 17 year old Private Muppet have been more likely to be dangerous in an 80's 911 turbo? I think so, but most of the risk would still be down to me being rubbish.

LuS1fer

43,539 posts

275 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Not really necessary as insurance costs tend to apply a filter to how fast people can go and the accident statistics for particular types of car show how much of a risk that is.

What some people don't appear able to comprehend is that you can actually drive a fast car slowly and a slow car fast.

thinfourth2

32,414 posts

234 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Before we debate this any further i think the OP should take my Nissan Micra and drive it into a very large tree at 20mph

When he gets out of hospital

Then we can have a debate about the advantages of restricting high performance cars to new drivers

1e35

903 posts

238 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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julian64 said:
2CV with virtually no brakes and god awful ability to take a corner gets to do 70mph in this country.
Downhill with a tailwind perhaps.

Taking corners in 2CVs has a huge Fun/BHP ratio though.

Rolls

1,502 posts

207 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
quotequote all
LuS1fer said:
Not really necessary as insurance costs tend to apply a filter to how fast people can go and the accident statistics for particular types of car show how much of a risk that is.

What some people don't appear able to comprehend is that you can actually drive a fast car slowly and a slow car fast.
Yeah - the accelerator is progressive. It's not a on/off switch...

kambites

71,565 posts

251 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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I think everyone understand that the accelerator is an analogue device, but I doubt that many people buy a 300bhp car intending to never use more than 150bhp of it. Generally speaking, people buy fast cars to drive them faster than it would be possible to drive slow cars, at least occasionally. I know I do.

I don't think I know enough to decide whether a graduated licence system would be worthwhile (I doubt anyone does, to be honest), but I can certainly see the arguments in favour of it.

Chrisw666

22,655 posts

229 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
quotequote all
Ved said:
I'd have to say no. The driving test as a whole should be tougher and more appropriate (motorways etc) as a bad decision at 30 in a 1.4 Polo is can be just as hazardous in a v10 Audi at 70.
This.

If it were to include anything other than driving I'd say a tougher more common sense testing theory exam too, we need to stop people who can't make decisions effectively being allowed to drive anything.

kambites

71,565 posts

251 months

Tuesday 22nd January 2013
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Lets not forget that overall the standard of driving in the UK is very high compared to almost anywhere else in the world. I think the only country I've been to where it's significantly higher overall is Germany and I've driven in a lot of countries where it's much, much worse. Of course that doesn't mean that we shouldn't work to improve it further, but I think it does need to be put in context.