Elise to Z4M ... or visa-versa?
Discussion
I'm stuck. I love Lotus. I love the brand, the heritage and the company's philosophy. I've been driving for nearly 8 years and throughout each of those years, I've owned a Lotus of some description. Henceforth, I feel as though I need a change and I've struggled to find something that I could accept as a replacement to my Elise.
I've tried an RX-7 (350bhp, but it felt slow!), a TVR Tamora (Scared of the potential rebuild costs!) and more recently, I looked into a Mitsubishi Evo. However I may have found the car I'm actually after ... It's fast, it's comfortable and it won't necessary blow up every time I turn the ignition key; a Z4M.
I test drove one this weekend just gone and first impressions were good. The cabin is spacious and is nicely laid out, with lots of creature comforts. Even though it's comfortable, the sense of speed isn't lost and the tail out action (in a straight line on damp roads) was brilliant fun. The salesman will disagree with me. However there is one thing stopping me; aesthetics. It's just not as beautiful in real life as some of the pictures and the blue colour I was sold on, looks a bit flat in real life. This might've been the lighting in fairness.
I'm torn. As soon as I jumped back in the Elise, the handling ... and the noise (decatted Hayward and Scott system)!
I think I need a Z4M in titanium or black, with a non-OEM exhaust system. Has anyone gone from an Elise to a Z4M, or visa-versa? What did you think? Would you make the choice again in hindsight? Do you miss your previous car? Any thoughts welcome ... I'm not looking to sell/buy until Feb/March anyway
I've tried an RX-7 (350bhp, but it felt slow!), a TVR Tamora (Scared of the potential rebuild costs!) and more recently, I looked into a Mitsubishi Evo. However I may have found the car I'm actually after ... It's fast, it's comfortable and it won't necessary blow up every time I turn the ignition key; a Z4M.
I test drove one this weekend just gone and first impressions were good. The cabin is spacious and is nicely laid out, with lots of creature comforts. Even though it's comfortable, the sense of speed isn't lost and the tail out action (in a straight line on damp roads) was brilliant fun. The salesman will disagree with me. However there is one thing stopping me; aesthetics. It's just not as beautiful in real life as some of the pictures and the blue colour I was sold on, looks a bit flat in real life. This might've been the lighting in fairness.
I'm torn. As soon as I jumped back in the Elise, the handling ... and the noise (decatted Hayward and Scott system)!
I think I need a Z4M in titanium or black, with a non-OEM exhaust system. Has anyone gone from an Elise to a Z4M, or visa-versa? What did you think? Would you make the choice again in hindsight? Do you miss your previous car? Any thoughts welcome ... I'm not looking to sell/buy until Feb/March anyway
I've not owned a Z4M, but I've driven one a fair bit.
I'd say it's about as far from the Elise as you can get whilst still driving a sports car - if the Elise is a scalpel, the Z4 is probably a pneumatic road drill. I liked the Z4M but ultimately it just felt a bit shallow to me - wonderful engine and great fun for a blast in but I think the lack of chassis finesse would drive me mad if I owned one.
The Z4 will sound infinitely better than the Elise if set up comparably. It's truly a gem of an engine.
I'd say it's about as far from the Elise as you can get whilst still driving a sports car - if the Elise is a scalpel, the Z4 is probably a pneumatic road drill. I liked the Z4M but ultimately it just felt a bit shallow to me - wonderful engine and great fun for a blast in but I think the lack of chassis finesse would drive me mad if I owned one.
The Z4 will sound infinitely better than the Elise if set up comparably. It's truly a gem of an engine.
The Crack Fox said:
Thought about an Evora? They look mega value at the mo'.
I had one in my possession for two weeks and absolutely loved it. It's part of the reason as to why I'm now looking for something quick, but comfortable. Basically, the Evora ticks every box ... with the exception to cost. Unfortunately I can't afford one; I think the cheapest S/H example is £28K.kambites said:
I've not owned a Z4M, but I've driven one a fair bit.
I'd say it's about as far from the Elise as you can get whilst still driving a sports car - if the Elise is a scalpel, the Z4 is probably a pneumatic road drill. I liked the Z4M but ultimately it just felt a bit shallow to me - wonderful engine and great fun for a blast in but I think the lack of chassis finesse would drive me mad if I owned one.
The Z4 will sound infinitely better than the Elise if set up comparably. It's truly a gem of an engine.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts, as I know you're a die-hard fan of the Elise too! I'd say it's about as far from the Elise as you can get whilst still driving a sports car - if the Elise is a scalpel, the Z4 is probably a pneumatic road drill. I liked the Z4M but ultimately it just felt a bit shallow to me - wonderful engine and great fun for a blast in but I think the lack of chassis finesse would drive me mad if I owned one.
The Z4 will sound infinitely better than the Elise if set up comparably. It's truly a gem of an engine.
Has anything come close to tempting you away, or considering you still have the Elise, is that a silly question?Also, to add ... Two cars is out of the question!
Pop over to SELOC and ask there.
Mention how you prefer the look of the engine in the Z4 too - that will go down well...!
http://forums.seloc.org/viewthread.php?tid=375332
I went S2-111s like yours to a Boxster S for a little more refinement but got bored and came back to the fold.
Have you considered just swapping into a different Lotus? 111R/Exige or something supercharged?
Also on the man-maths - a Z4 is going to cost a pretty penny more on depreciation vs. the ZERO you are likely paying on the Elise.
Mention how you prefer the look of the engine in the Z4 too - that will go down well...!
http://forums.seloc.org/viewthread.php?tid=375332
I went S2-111s like yours to a Boxster S for a little more refinement but got bored and came back to the fold.
Have you considered just swapping into a different Lotus? 111R/Exige or something supercharged?
Also on the man-maths - a Z4 is going to cost a pretty penny more on depreciation vs. the ZERO you are likely paying on the Elise.
Ikemi said:
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts, as I know you're a die-hard fan of the Elise too! Has anything come close to tempting you away, or considering you still have the Elise, is that a silly question?
Also, to add ... Two cars is out of the question!
I'm not actually that big a fan of the Elise - it's just the best compromise between day-to-day usability and driving pleasure that I've found. If I could live with it, I'd sell the Elise for a Caterham in a heartbeat. Plenty of things have tempted me out of the Elise over the years, but they've all been on the more extreme size of things; I've never considered changing it for something less driver focussed. Has anything come close to tempting you away, or considering you still have the Elise, is that a silly question?Also, to add ... Two cars is out of the question!
With respect to the Z4, it's a lovely car but it really is completely and utterly different. It feels more muscle car than sports car after the Elise - it certainly makes you laugh hysterically when you put your foot down in a way that even the fastest production Elise can't but for me, it was just a bit too one-dimensional to live with.
ETA: Frankly though, if I was in a position where I needed the extra practicality that a Z4 offers over an Elise, I'd be buying a TVR. You could probably fund a rebuild from what you'd save compared to a Z4 in depreciation.
Edited by kambites on Monday 9th December 14:20
I think it depends what you like about the Elise. In terms of driving feel, The Elise, Exige and Evora are in my opinion absolutely the best you can buy. The Boxster and Cayman handle better, but don't offer anywhere near the feel or involvement, the Z4M has an amazing engine and if it's anything like my Z4C, it'll feel very special but lack fluidity down bumpy roads. If it's the driving feel and involvement that you like about the Elise, then you'll miss out with another marque. If it's the performance, balance or handling then you can get better elsewhere if you buy wisely.
I went from an Elise S1 to a Z4M, although I had a few cars in between and it was 4 1/2 years between selling the Elise and buying the Z4 so my memory may be a little biassed towards the Elise.
They are very different cars to drive. The steering feel of the Elise is so much more communicative that it makes the Z4 feel completely numb in comparison. The Z4 is clearly much more powerful, although up to 50 or so mph there probably isn't a huge amount in it. Again, it may be that my memory has faded but the Elise was so much more exciting to drive and I fell in love with it instantly. Having owned the Z4M for 10 months, I am still yet to really love it even though it is so capable.
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down. The roof comes off or on in 10 seconds or so compared to building the Elises for 5 minutes, the heaters in the Z4 are fantastic, the seats are comfortable, you can hear the radio etc etc. Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
I have to say though, everytime I see an Elise S1 I want one again......
They are very different cars to drive. The steering feel of the Elise is so much more communicative that it makes the Z4 feel completely numb in comparison. The Z4 is clearly much more powerful, although up to 50 or so mph there probably isn't a huge amount in it. Again, it may be that my memory has faded but the Elise was so much more exciting to drive and I fell in love with it instantly. Having owned the Z4M for 10 months, I am still yet to really love it even though it is so capable.
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down. The roof comes off or on in 10 seconds or so compared to building the Elises for 5 minutes, the heaters in the Z4 are fantastic, the seats are comfortable, you can hear the radio etc etc. Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
I have to say though, everytime I see an Elise S1 I want one again......
bencollins4 said:
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down. The roof comes off or on in 10 seconds or so compared to building the Elises for 5 minutes, the heaters in the Z4 are fantastic, the seats are comfortable, you can hear the radio etc etc. Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
To be fair, apart from the engine bit all of that is true of the S2 Elise as well as the Z4. bencollins4 said:
The steering feel of the Elise is so much more communicative that it makes the Z4 feel completely numb in comparison.
The Z4 is clearly much more powerful, although up to 50 or so mph there probably isn't a huge amount in it.
Again, it may be that my memory has faded but the Elise was so much more exciting to drive and I fell in love with it instantly.
Having owned the Z4M for 10 months, I am still yet to really love it even though it is so capable.
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down.
Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
Completely agree with all of thisThe Z4 is clearly much more powerful, although up to 50 or so mph there probably isn't a huge amount in it.
Again, it may be that my memory has faded but the Elise was so much more exciting to drive and I fell in love with it instantly.
Having owned the Z4M for 10 months, I am still yet to really love it even though it is so capable.
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down.
Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
kambites said:
bencollins4 said:
As an every day proposition though, the Z4 wins hands-down. The roof comes off or on in 10 seconds or so compared to building the Elises for 5 minutes, the heaters in the Z4 are fantastic, the seats are comfortable, you can hear the radio etc etc. Plus, that engine is a masterpiece!
To be fair, apart from the engine bit all of that is true of the S2 Elise as well as the Z4. 
It was the S1 Elise that took five minutes; there was no 'building' the hood with the Elise, it popped on pretty quickly. The only annoying thing compared with modern cars is that you really need to stop and get out to do it. The main issues for me with the Elise and its everyday usability were the noise, vandalism (happened to me once), and lack of carrying capacity.RobM77 said:
It was the S1 Elise that took five minutes; there was no 'building' the hood with the Elise, it popped on pretty quickly. The only annoying thing compared with modern cars is that you really need to stop and get out to do it. The main issues for me with the Elise and its everyday usability were the noise, vandalism (happened to me once), and lack of carrying capacity.It takes maybe seven or eight seconds to take off if you already have the windows open; probably 10 if you don't. Certainly fast enough to do while stopped in traffic or at lights. Probably 20-30 seconds to put back on from the driver's seat depending on whether the fastners want to play ball; and you have to take off the seat-belt to do it. If you have a passenger you have to shove it down between the seats, which adds a few seconds to the removal process and means you can't use the rear-view mirror until you've put it somewhere sensible.
VXT to Z4M. Not the same as an Elise but about as similar as it gets...
No regrets at all. Yes, you need a few modifications (exhaust and intake is a good start) to open up the character of the car, but it seems you've done this on your Lotus anyway, so not averse to it.
I've also lost count of the number of owners I've seen on here and on the Z4 forums that have made the same transition (Lotii to Z4M), so sure you'll get some more repsonses very shortly!
No regrets at all. Yes, you need a few modifications (exhaust and intake is a good start) to open up the character of the car, but it seems you've done this on your Lotus anyway, so not averse to it.
I've also lost count of the number of owners I've seen on here and on the Z4 forums that have made the same transition (Lotii to Z4M), so sure you'll get some more repsonses very shortly!
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