Motorbikes in London bus lanes
Discussion
Just to gather opinion on this topic, I thought I'd post here. Now that Putney bridge has been closed for the next 3 months, traffic seems to be chaotic as everyone tries to get across Hammersmith Bridge instead. I commute to work on a motorbike, and while I hate filtering through traffic, being sat stationary is even worse. I thought I'd ask Richmond Borough about allowing motorbikes access to the bus lane that runs the entire length of the A306, specifically for the coming months because the weight of traffic makes motorcycles quite vulnerable. I thought the reply demonstrates the power of the cyclist lobby.
Original message
"I would like to politely request that motorcycles are permitted to enter more bus lanes in Richmond. Allowing motorbikes in the bus lanes clearly makes sense, because not only does it ease congestion, but it keeps motorcycles out of the dangerous traffic and reduces their exposure to exhaust emissions.
I would like to specifically highlight the A306 / Castlenau in the context of the closure of Putney Bridge. Each day I commute from Putney to Hammersmith hospital, and must therefore now ride the length of this road. This morning it was almost entirely stationary due to weight of traffic. This now necessitates riders filtering through traffic, potentially exposing them to high risk, while there is an unoccupied bus lane running along the length of the road. Allowing motorcycles to use this lane would reduce congestion, improve safety dramatically and shorten journey times.
I understand the concerns that cyclists may have about allowing motorcycles in bus lanes. With that in mind, I support punishment of irresponsible riding, but don’t want the negative behaviour of a select few to adversely impact the large majority of riders, who are responsible and considerate."
Reply
"Thank you for your enquiry regarding motorbikes into bus lanes but I’m afraid I am going to have to decline your request and yes this has much to do with cyclists who are adamant that no one else after buses and taxis use them. It is also worth pointing out that at the e4nds of some bus lanes the arrangements, such as advanced stop lines for cyclists, are such that a motorcyclist would have to leave bus lane before they reach the end of lane anyway. Also we don’t really have that much length of bus lanes across the Borough.
As I write we are also considering reducing the hours of operation of bus lanes, to peak hours, around the Borough and we are decommissioning several as well in Twickenham town centre. We have just reduced the hours of operation to this in the case of Kew Road bus route.
I have had several motorcyclists ask the same question who I have answered in the same way. It is true that different Boroughs have different policies on this but we have adopted our view with the interests of cyclists in mind.
I’m sorry to have to turn down your request.
Ben
Ben Fryer
Principal Transport Planner
Highways and Transport, Environment Directorate
London Borough of Richmond upon Thames
Tel: 020 8487 5037
Fax: 020 8891 7713
Email: ben.fryer@richmond.gov.uk
Web site: www.richmond.gov.uk"
Original message
"I would like to politely request that motorcycles are permitted to enter more bus lanes in Richmond. Allowing motorbikes in the bus lanes clearly makes sense, because not only does it ease congestion, but it keeps motorcycles out of the dangerous traffic and reduces their exposure to exhaust emissions.
I would like to specifically highlight the A306 / Castlenau in the context of the closure of Putney Bridge. Each day I commute from Putney to Hammersmith hospital, and must therefore now ride the length of this road. This morning it was almost entirely stationary due to weight of traffic. This now necessitates riders filtering through traffic, potentially exposing them to high risk, while there is an unoccupied bus lane running along the length of the road. Allowing motorcycles to use this lane would reduce congestion, improve safety dramatically and shorten journey times.
I understand the concerns that cyclists may have about allowing motorcycles in bus lanes. With that in mind, I support punishment of irresponsible riding, but don’t want the negative behaviour of a select few to adversely impact the large majority of riders, who are responsible and considerate."
Reply
"Thank you for your enquiry regarding motorbikes into bus lanes but I’m afraid I am going to have to decline your request and yes this has much to do with cyclists who are adamant that no one else after buses and taxis use them. It is also worth pointing out that at the e4nds of some bus lanes the arrangements, such as advanced stop lines for cyclists, are such that a motorcyclist would have to leave bus lane before they reach the end of lane anyway. Also we don’t really have that much length of bus lanes across the Borough.
As I write we are also considering reducing the hours of operation of bus lanes, to peak hours, around the Borough and we are decommissioning several as well in Twickenham town centre. We have just reduced the hours of operation to this in the case of Kew Road bus route.
I have had several motorcyclists ask the same question who I have answered in the same way. It is true that different Boroughs have different policies on this but we have adopted our view with the interests of cyclists in mind.
I’m sorry to have to turn down your request.
Ben
Ben Fryer
Principal Transport Planner
Highways and Transport, Environment Directorate
London Borough of Richmond upon Thames
Tel: 020 8487 5037
Fax: 020 8891 7713
Email: ben.fryer@richmond.gov.uk
Web site: www.richmond.gov.uk"
It's more the choice of the borough than the "cyclist lobby" since bus lanes that are controlled by TFL allow motorbikes and have done for a few years now.
As a commuting cyclist I was a bit nervous about motorbikes using bus lanes but to be fair, it has not been an issue. Everyone has just got on with it.
As a commuting cyclist I was a bit nervous about motorbikes using bus lanes but to be fair, it has not been an issue. Everyone has just got on with it.
Unfortunately, there is a small element of motorcycle and scooter riders who act unacceptably around cyclists, and this tiny minority ruin it for everyone.
When on my way into London on my motorbike, I go via Wandsworth, and there is a bus lane there open to motorcycles, but also has a lot of cyclists too. I was carefully passing an old lady on a bike in the bus lane there, passing as slowly and as wide as I could, and some halfwit on a scooter passes flat-out between me on my motorbike and her on her bicycle. I would have had a word with him at the lights if he had actually stopped at them.
Like I say, it’s a small minority, but sadly, they ruin it for the 99% of motorcyclists who are capable of riding safely. They’d rather you crash into a car than a cyclist, which, although it sounds perverse, actually makes sense to a certain degree.
Taxis being allowed in bus lanes is the thing that I really don't understand!
When on my way into London on my motorbike, I go via Wandsworth, and there is a bus lane there open to motorcycles, but also has a lot of cyclists too. I was carefully passing an old lady on a bike in the bus lane there, passing as slowly and as wide as I could, and some halfwit on a scooter passes flat-out between me on my motorbike and her on her bicycle. I would have had a word with him at the lights if he had actually stopped at them.
Like I say, it’s a small minority, but sadly, they ruin it for the 99% of motorcyclists who are capable of riding safely. They’d rather you crash into a car than a cyclist, which, although it sounds perverse, actually makes sense to a certain degree.
Taxis being allowed in bus lanes is the thing that I really don't understand!
anonymous said:
[redacted]
A bus or a taxi is (in theory) stuck behind the cyclist whereas motorbikes can force their way past at speed.In practice though, most cyclists using this kind of route would be perfectly able to cope. It's not like there is a calm oasis of dedicated cycle-lanes waiting for them at the end of the road!
Mr Gear said:
Unfortunately, there is a small element of motorcycle and scooter riders who act unacceptably around cyclists, and this tiny minority ruin it for everyone.
When on my way into London on my motorbike, I go via Wandsworth, and there is a bus lane there open to motorcycles, but also has a lot of cyclists too. I was carefully passing an old lady on a bike in the bus lane there, passing as slowly and as wide as I could, and some halfwit on a scooter passes flat-out between me on my motorbike and her on her bicycle. I would have had a word with him at the lights if he had actually stopped at them.
Like I say, it’s a small minority, but sadly, they ruin it for the 99% of motorcyclists who are capable of riding safely. They’d rather you crash into a car than a cyclist, which, although it sounds perverse, actually makes sense to a certain degree.
Taxis being allowed in bus lanes is the thing that I really don't understand!
Is that sound logic though? I mean, there are a fair number of pretty unacceptable cyclists. I don't really think anyone disputes that, but it can be disputed that that's a good reason to make things worse for all cyclists. You've have to prove some unique, disproportionate danger that can only be fixed by a collective safety measure, I'm not sure that exists. Same should go for motorcyclists.When on my way into London on my motorbike, I go via Wandsworth, and there is a bus lane there open to motorcycles, but also has a lot of cyclists too. I was carefully passing an old lady on a bike in the bus lane there, passing as slowly and as wide as I could, and some halfwit on a scooter passes flat-out between me on my motorbike and her on her bicycle. I would have had a word with him at the lights if he had actually stopped at them.
Like I say, it’s a small minority, but sadly, they ruin it for the 99% of motorcyclists who are capable of riding safely. They’d rather you crash into a car than a cyclist, which, although it sounds perverse, actually makes sense to a certain degree.
Taxis being allowed in bus lanes is the thing that I really don't understand!
Indeed, cycling advocates usually want safety in numbers - at least one reason for this is that humans are better at spotting things if they're used to seeing that thing around (so more cyclists = people more likely to see cyclists). Reasonable given the frequency of SMIDSYs. Motorbikes and bicycles have fairly similar visual signatures...
Edited by paranoid airbag on Monday 21st July 12:47
I fully agree with all that's been said. There are definitely individuals on scooters/motorbikes and push bikes whose behaviour on the road shows no consideration for others. I just don't like the fact that the safety of motorcyclists seems to be prioritised much less than that of cyclists, especially in the case of the reply from Richmond, with little evidence to back it up. He suggests that 'cyclists are adamant' as if their's is the only opinion that matters.
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