Front engined vs mid engined at the front RWD
Discussion
Following my discussion about mid engined FWD cars (eg Citroen DS) Kambites asked for a list of front engined RWD.
Mid engined at the front RWD would be where the engine is behind the front axle and weight distribution is appoaching 50:50. Most BMWs, MGBs Caterham ?
Front engine RWD has the engine above or in front of the front wheels so these are??
Mid engined at the front RWD would be where the engine is behind the front axle and weight distribution is appoaching 50:50. Most BMWs, MGBs Caterham ?
Front engine RWD has the engine above or in front of the front wheels so these are??
There are not that many rwd cars where the entire engine is behind the front axle line. I think it needs to be a fairly long car with a short engine to achieve that, at the very least a rearward seating position.
I'm not sure an E36 318is gets there, but I am sure than an E30 318is does not. The Porsche 944 also doesn't have the full engine behind the front axle.
I think recent Corvettes and Aston Martins fit this description. ferrari F12 and SLS AMG also. Caterham 7 too. MX-5 and S2000 are two cheaper options.
Not that many normal cars.
I'm not sure an E36 318is gets there, but I am sure than an E30 318is does not. The Porsche 944 also doesn't have the full engine behind the front axle.
I think recent Corvettes and Aston Martins fit this description. ferrari F12 and SLS AMG also. Caterham 7 too. MX-5 and S2000 are two cheaper options.
Not that many normal cars.
If you're allowing "mid engined" to mean in front of the cabin at all, I think the definition has to relate to the CoG of the engine. Otherwise you need three terms - one for behind the axle, one for over the axle and one for in front of the axle.
I can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
I can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
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If the driving experience and my memory serve correct the TVR wedges have the engine much more over the front axle where as the chim/griff and I assume later TVRs had the engine further back behind the front axle. Certainly the wedge was much more tail happy than the chim and when corner weighted the Chim's weight distribution was pretty much 50/50.
edward1 said:
If the driving experience and my memory serve correct the TVR wedges have the engine much more over the front axle where as the chim/griff and I assume later TVRs had the engine further back behind the front axle. Certainly the wedge was much more tail happy than the chim and when corner weighted the Chim's weight distribution was pretty much 50/50.
Cerberas have the engine a long way back too.I don't think there is any sharp cut-off in benefit from moving the engine closer to the car's centre of mass when it crosses the front axle line, so the term is purely descriptive, and I think should mean simply that the whole engine is behind the centre of the front wheels. Usually means that cabin space is sacrificed - I can't think of many full four seaters with that configuration. There's the RX-8, what else?
otolith said:
I don't think there is any sharp cut-off in benefit from moving the engine closer to the car's centre of mass when it crosses the front axle line, so the term is purely descriptive, and I think should mean simply that the whole engine is behind the centre of the front wheels. Usually means that cabin space is sacrificed - I can't think of many full four seaters with that configuration. There's the RX-8, what else?
Do the four-pot BMWs not have the engine entirely behind the axle? Fastdruid said:
And just look how far in front the RS5 engine is!
It's not bad. Their engines are usually pretty short dimensionally. The older cars have a lot more overhang, and even their winning Trans Am race cars from the 80s had a lot more overhang than the RS5 (or any modern Audi).On that note, the Panamera looks worse than most sport saloons, and probably outhandles them all:
kambites said:
I can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
Only if all front engined cars are RWD, which they are not.Mr2Mike said:
kambites said:
I can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
Only if all front engined cars are RWD, which they are not.
kambites said:
If you're allowing "mid engined" to mean in front of the cabin at all, I think the definition has to relate to the CoG of the engine. Otherwise you need three terms - one for behind the axle, one for over the axle and one for in front of the axle.
I can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
My logicI can't actually think of any RWD cars with the CoG of the engine in front of the front axle line. So does this mean there's so such thing as a front-engined RWD car, they're actually all mid-engined? If that's the case, can we just go back to calling anything with the engine in front of the cabin "front-engined", it's much easier.
Entire block behind front axle = front mid engined
Any part of block forward of the front axle = front engined
Entire block in front of front axle = WTF
Edited by Kawasicki on Monday 8th September 13:57
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