Consensus on this overtaking stretch
Discussion
Ladies & Gents, long time lurker here but finally just got round to signing up, so hello from me. To start off, a question that's been on my mind for a while about an overtaking stretch, here's a street view link (A46 north of Evesham):
https://www.google.es/maps/@52.2080284,-1.8570763,...
Now recently I was travelling along this stretch, nothing infront nor behind. Caravan coming towards me in the opposite direction, with a VW Caddy beginning to pull out to overtake it. As we passed, the Caddy was pretty much level with the caravan, so we were effectively three-abreast. So my question is, given the width of the road could easily accomodate 4 maybe 5 vehicles abreast, but is a single carriageway with only one marked lane in each direction, am I expected to move to the left to accomodate these overtakes? Obviously self-preservation says yes, don't fancy a head-on but equally shouldn't the overtakee wait until it's clear, or there's just "space"?
Apologies if this topic has already been done, not yet worked out the search function.
Muddle
https://www.google.es/maps/@52.2080284,-1.8570763,...
Now recently I was travelling along this stretch, nothing infront nor behind. Caravan coming towards me in the opposite direction, with a VW Caddy beginning to pull out to overtake it. As we passed, the Caddy was pretty much level with the caravan, so we were effectively three-abreast. So my question is, given the width of the road could easily accomodate 4 maybe 5 vehicles abreast, but is a single carriageway with only one marked lane in each direction, am I expected to move to the left to accomodate these overtakes? Obviously self-preservation says yes, don't fancy a head-on but equally shouldn't the overtakee wait until it's clear, or there's just "space"?
Apologies if this topic has already been done, not yet worked out the search function.
Muddle
This isn't a serious question is it? You're actually asking whether it is acceptable to pull out to overtake on a single carriageway road directly into oncoming traffic such that there would be a head-on collision unless the oncoming traffic moved over, for which there happens to be sufficient room for because its a wide road?
On the road in question, it might be just about acceptable if the the long lay-by was empty and the caravan slowed right down and moved over into into it somewhat but otherwise, in your position, I would have made my displeasure very clear and reported them for dangerous driving.
On the road in question, it might be just about acceptable if the the long lay-by was empty and the caravan slowed right down and moved over into into it somewhat but otherwise, in your position, I would have made my displeasure very clear and reported them for dangerous driving.
I've been down there a few times and unless the oncoming vehicle has already moved over in their lane I wouldn't Overtake. If I see a slow moving vehicle coming the other way to me and its clear to do so I do generally move over against the white line on the left to help oncoming cars overtake.
A75 between Annan and Dumfries has a similar wide piece of road. I have seen HGVs overtake each other with another HGV oncoming and plenty of room to do so.
I am of the opinion that if the slow car is over to the left and the oncoming car is also to its left then it is perfectly safe to stradle the white line and go up the middle. I always indicate to show that I'm overtaking and I'm always on the look out for someone doing likewise coming the other way, but I've never seen an accident on this stretch of road in my 28 years of driving.
https://goo.gl/maps/46ALY
I am of the opinion that if the slow car is over to the left and the oncoming car is also to its left then it is perfectly safe to stradle the white line and go up the middle. I always indicate to show that I'm overtaking and I'm always on the look out for someone doing likewise coming the other way, but I've never seen an accident on this stretch of road in my 28 years of driving.
https://goo.gl/maps/46ALY
Never make 3 vehicles abreast. Your closing speed could be well over 120 miles an hour. It only takes a moments inattention by either of the other drivers and you are the meat in the sandwich.
It's no use lying in hospital with both of your legs amputated staing it wasn't your fault.
I know this section of road very well, having ridden a motorcycle and driven up it regularly. There have been a number of high speed fatalities, involving 3 vehicles abreast, and also the situation where you overtake a vehicle,with a row of opposing traffic and someone pulls out of the row to overtake, meeting you head on.
I witnessed exactly this last week, and the 2 cars almost clipped wing mirrors head on as they both pulled out of opposing moving traffic at the same time.
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
It's no use lying in hospital with both of your legs amputated staing it wasn't your fault.
I know this section of road very well, having ridden a motorcycle and driven up it regularly. There have been a number of high speed fatalities, involving 3 vehicles abreast, and also the situation where you overtake a vehicle,with a row of opposing traffic and someone pulls out of the row to overtake, meeting you head on.
I witnessed exactly this last week, and the 2 cars almost clipped wing mirrors head on as they both pulled out of opposing moving traffic at the same time.
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
Bigdarbs said:
Never make 3 vehicles abreast. Your closing speed could be well over 120 miles an hour. It only takes a moments inattention by either of the other drivers and you are the meat in the sandwich.
It's no use lying in hospital with both of your legs amputated staing it wasn't your fault.
I know this section of road very well, having ridden a motorcycle and driven up it regularly. There have been a number of high speed fatalities, involving 3 vehicles abreast, and also the situation where you overtake a vehicle,with a row of opposing traffic and someone pulls out of the row to overtake, meeting you head on.
I witnessed exactly this last week, and the 2 cars almost clipped wing mirrors head on as they both pulled out of opposing moving traffic at the same time.
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
When were these fatalities?It's no use lying in hospital with both of your legs amputated staing it wasn't your fault.
I know this section of road very well, having ridden a motorcycle and driven up it regularly. There have been a number of high speed fatalities, involving 3 vehicles abreast, and also the situation where you overtake a vehicle,with a row of opposing traffic and someone pulls out of the row to overtake, meeting you head on.
I witnessed exactly this last week, and the 2 cars almost clipped wing mirrors head on as they both pulled out of opposing moving traffic at the same time.
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
Bigdarbs said:
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
Somewhere around the Evesham bypass/A44, there was a section IIRC which did have the "fictious central lane" marked off with solid lines and chevrons, but recently had the chevrons removed and remarked to show just one, very wide lane in each direction, but only for about a 300m stretch.. This was exactly what happened here:
Fatal road collision, A46, Oversley Green near Alcester
Incident 129 May 16 - Fatal RTC, A46
PC 509 Miles Birch is appealing for witnesses to a fatal road collision involving five vehicles.
The collision happened at 09 35 on Tuesday May 16 on the A46 at Oversley Green about half a mile from the road island junction with the A435 near Alcester.
A silver Cherokee Jeep, a Scania articulated lorry, A scania Box van with Argos livery, a silver VW Passat and a white Honda CRV car were involved.
The driver of the Jeep Cherokee, a man who has not yet been identified, died at the scene of the crash.
The Cherokee was travelling on the A46 from Oversley Hill toward the road island.
The Cherokee collided head on with the Scania articulated lorry travelling in the opposite direction before spinning and colliding with the Argos box van. There was a further collision involving the articulated lorry and the VW Passat and Honda car.
There were no other serious injuries. The driver of the Scania artic, a 53 year old man from Kent, suffered cuts to his head, a dislocated shoulder, whiplash and was treated at the Alexandra Hospital in Redditch.
The 35 year old woman driver of the Honda car suffered shock and was treated at the scene by paramedics.
The road was closed until 17 30 while accident investigators worked at the scene and the vehicles and a load of pineapples from the Scania articulated lorry were cleared.
PC Miles Birch is appealing for witnesses. He would particularly like to speak to anyone who may have seen the Jeep travelling on the A 46 toward the road island junction with the A435.
Fatal road collision, A46, Oversley Green near Alcester
Incident 129 May 16 - Fatal RTC, A46
PC 509 Miles Birch is appealing for witnesses to a fatal road collision involving five vehicles.
The collision happened at 09 35 on Tuesday May 16 on the A46 at Oversley Green about half a mile from the road island junction with the A435 near Alcester.
A silver Cherokee Jeep, a Scania articulated lorry, A scania Box van with Argos livery, a silver VW Passat and a white Honda CRV car were involved.
The driver of the Jeep Cherokee, a man who has not yet been identified, died at the scene of the crash.
The Cherokee was travelling on the A46 from Oversley Hill toward the road island.
The Cherokee collided head on with the Scania articulated lorry travelling in the opposite direction before spinning and colliding with the Argos box van. There was a further collision involving the articulated lorry and the VW Passat and Honda car.
There were no other serious injuries. The driver of the Scania artic, a 53 year old man from Kent, suffered cuts to his head, a dislocated shoulder, whiplash and was treated at the Alexandra Hospital in Redditch.
The 35 year old woman driver of the Honda car suffered shock and was treated at the scene by paramedics.
The road was closed until 17 30 while accident investigators worked at the scene and the vehicles and a load of pineapples from the Scania articulated lorry were cleared.
PC Miles Birch is appealing for witnesses. He would particularly like to speak to anyone who may have seen the Jeep travelling on the A 46 toward the road island junction with the A435.
Essex Regiment Way, just outside of Chelmsford. This road has a few stretches very similar to that in the OP and you'll often see slightly hairy overtakes being performed at all times of the day. The road is easily wide enough for three-abreast, but when they're closing on each other of upwards of 120mph it's not a particularly good idea. It only gets really dodgy, however, when two people travelling in opposite directions try and overtake. 
There's a bit of the A303 just west of Yeovilton that used to be marked as three lanes, with the central one designated for freestyle suicides since overtakers would often pop out to use it from opposing directions.
A few years ago they improved safety dramatically by making it alternating sections of 2+1 lanes, so for the most part there are regular chances to get past the caravans and lorries.
Looks like there's room for that here.
A few years ago they improved safety dramatically by making it alternating sections of 2+1 lanes, so for the most part there are regular chances to get past the caravans and lorries.
Looks like there's room for that here.
Muddle238 said:
Bigdarbs said:
I am quite surprised that this stretch of road hasn't been remarked to reduce the risk of vehicles meeting in the fictitious 3rd central lane.
Somewhere around the Evesham bypass/A44, there was a section IIRC which did have the "fictious central lane" marked off with solid lines and chevrons, but recently had the chevrons removed and remarked to show just one, very wide lane in each direction, but only for about a 300m stretch.. 
It's common practice abroad and I've done it plenty of times. The slower vehicle usually moves to their inside, and the oncoming vehicle moves to their inside so you know they're both anticipating the overtake. It's not something I'd do in the UK though, or indeed abroad if I wasn't confident that all the drivers involved were aware of the overtake.
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