Konfigurator says no...

[pistonheadforum]

So I'll admit to not taking my Ritalin this morning, but have just spent a confusing 20mins on the BMW website configurator tool thing and unless I'm missing something it now appears impossible to get a 5 series touring (or saloon) with a 6 cylinder diesel engine in a manual transmission.

As soon as you choose 6 cylinders it goes to automatic transmission. Bad configurator, bad.

Rear wheel drive
a diesel
6 cylinders
decent engine size (ideally 3 litres)
manual transmission

Is the above really now mission impossible amongst the German marques? I can't afford an M/AMG series and I don't want an Audi.

It does appear that the trusty e39 was indeed a bit special...

[Cupramax]

Welcome to my world, but with Audi. None of their performance models bar S3 and TT which i dont want are available manual.

[Dave^]

Manual available upto and including 525d, anything more is auto only...

[MrBarry123]

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

[kambites]

MrBarry123 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

I'm sure it's not beyond BMW's considerable engineering ability to make a manual gearbox capable of coping with any of the engines available in the 5-series if they thought there was enough of a market to make it worth the effort.

[aeropilot]

pistonheadforum said:

So I'll admit to not taking my Ritalin this morning, but have just spent a confusing 20mins on the BMW website configurator tool thing and unless I'm missing something it now appears impossible to get a 5 series touring (or saloon) with a 6 cylinder diesel engine in a manual transmission.

As soon as you choose 6 cylinders it goes to automatic transmission. Bad configurator, bad.

Rear wheel drive
a diesel
6 cylinders
decent engine size (ideally 3 litres)
manual transmission

Is the above really now mission impossible amongst the German marques?

Gonna be mission impossible with most marques within a short time.

People seem to be ignorant of the fact that with ever more electronic systems integration of the whole vehicle (for good or bad) putting an old fashioned non-electronically controlled gearbox in the middle of all that - creates a black hole.
Also, these modern diesels are hugely benefiting from the introduction of 8/9 speed auto/dual clutch 'boxes, so hooking up an antiquated 6-speed manual to them with huge ratio gaps is just a pointless exercise in the need to meet legislation regarding emissions and whatnot.

Just as carbs, manual steering (and even hyd PAS) and crossply tyres and old sorts of other old tech has fallen by the wayside, so will the manual transmission within a decade or even sooner.

[Claudia Skies]

MrBarry123 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

^^^ Yup, that's the one. The capability of high torque engines to eat clutches and drivelines is well known. That's why Merc went "auto only" with their big AMGs a along time ago.

[GetCarter]

I've just been configuring a 335i M sport manual touring. Was after the XDrive but that's only available in auto.

If you manage to do it, make sure you find the discount on 'DriveThe Deal.com' as you can use that to annoy the BM salespeople and get a good deal.

[Rawwr]

What annoys me with most configurators is that you seemingly can't have two completely different options in the same configuration.

For example, you can't have brown leather seats without having privacy glass. How in the name of frig did that come about? Oh, you want electric folding mirrors? Yes? Well, you'll need to have 19" wheels and the glovebox dildo storage.

[oobster]

Rawwr said:

What annoys me with most configurators is that you seemingly can't have two completely different options in the same configuration.

For example, you can't have brown leather seats without having privacy glass. How in the name of frig did that come about? Oh, you want electric folding mirrors? Yes? Well, you'll need to have 19" wheels and the glovebox dildo storage.

Everything is a "pack" - Comfort pack, sport pack, appearance pack etc. PITA when you only want one option from the 'pack'.

[Rawwr]

oobster said:

Everything is a "pack" - Comfort pack, sport pack, appearance pack etc. PITA when you only want one option from the 'pack'.

Don't even get me started on packs. They should at least be honest with the naming of them:

The 'make it look like I bought a more expensive model' pack.
The 'make my interior look like a branch of Dixons' pack.
The 'make my car look like really, really awful' pack.
The 'make the ride really uncomfortable' pack.

[aeropilot]

Rawwr said:

What annoys me with most configurators is that you seemingly can't have two completely different options in the same configuration.

For example, you can't have brown leather seats without having privacy glass. How in the name of frig did that come about? Oh, you want electric folding mirrors? Yes? Well, you'll need to have 19" wheels and the glovebox dildo storage.

Yeah, these 'pack' and option combo's are a pain in the arse these days. The problem is they are being determined by non-car marketing people, which is why they make no sense to most of us on here.

When I configured my 135i when I bought it 4 years ago, there were no packs, only individual options - great!
When I test drove a M235 with a view to changing, I couldn't spec a M235 to a similar spec to my 135i without having a load of other guff I didn't want!
I specced my 135i with the top tint windscreen which is great, but I couldn't spec that as an individual option on the M235 without combining it with privacy glass - which I hate.
This issue with the spec was one reason (there were lots of others as well to be fair) that I walked away from the M235.

[Matt UK]

I guess the demand for that combo is so low, it's not worth developing for production.

[Rawwr]

aeropilot said:

I specced my 135i with the top tint windscreen which is great, but I couldn't spec that as an individual option on the M235 without combining it with privacy glass - which I hate.

And rightly so. I can't f*cking stand privacy glass. I don't get it. What the hell are you doing in the back of your car which needs privacy? Unless you're taking a dump or fapping yourself into a frenzy, you really, really don't need it. It just makes your car look awful.

[Matt UK]

Rawwr said:

And rightly so. I can't f*cking stand privacy glass. I don't get it. What the hell are you doing in the back of your car which needs privacy? Unless you're taking a dump or fapping yourself into a frenzy, you really, really don't need it. It just makes your car look awful.

Totally agree. When searching for a used car it's one of my first 'scroll one' signals.

[aeropilot]

Matt UK said:

Rawwr said:

And rightly so. I can't f*cking stand privacy glass. I don't get it. What the hell are you doing in the back of your car which needs privacy? Unless you're taking a dump or fapping yourself into a frenzy, you really, really don't need it. It just makes your car look awful.

Totally agree. When searching for a used car it's one of my first 'scroll one' signals.

Not easy to actually find a newish car that hasn't got it fitted though.....

[Devil2575]

Claudia Skies said:

MrBarry123 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

^^^ Yup, that's the one. The capability of high torque engines to eat clutches and drivelines is well known. That's why Merc went "auto only" with their big AMGs a along time ago.

I bet it's got more to do with a lack of demand. Who buys a new 5 series with a manual box, especially a big diesel that suits an auto.

[MitchT]

kambites said:

MrBarry123 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

I'm sure it's not beyond BMW's considerable engineering ability to make a manual gearbox capable of coping with any of the engines available in the 5-series if they thought there was enough of a market to make it worth the effort.

It's one thing the engineers being able to build a robust drive train ... another thing the accountants letting them (these days)!

[aeropilot]

MitchT said:

kambites said:

MrBarry123 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if it's BMW protecting itself against warranty claims from numpties killing the manual gearbox with all the torque of the diesel engine.

I'm sure it's not beyond BMW's considerable engineering ability to make a manual gearbox capable of coping with any of the engines available in the 5-series if they thought there was enough of a market to make it worth the effort.

It's one thing the engineers being able to build a robust drive train ... another thing the accountants letting them (these days)!

When was the last time a BMW was fitted with a BMW gearbox.....?

Haven't all the manuals been designed/developed/made by either Getrag or ZF for the past 40 odd years+.....??

[MitchT]

aeropilot said:

When was the last time a BMW was fitted with a BMW gearbox.....?

Haven't all the manuals been designed/developed/made by either Getrag or ZF for the past 40 odd years+.....??

Wherever the 'box comes from, they aren't going to dent their profits by either developing or outsourcing one that's engineered as well as it could be.