Private sellers/HPI - bit of a rant.
Discussion
Not a great day so need to let off some steam...
I have been looking for a Z4 for a while with a particular spec so have cast the net quite far and don't mind travelling for the right car. Having exhausted PH classifieds/AT/eBay, I decided to have a look on gumtree (a site I normally avoid like the plague after trying to sell a Macbook Air last year and receiving the most inane messages). I spotted what seemed to be the perfect car - called the seller this morning and asked a series of questions including -
Me - Did you take any finance out when you purchased the car last year, or are you aware of any finance agreements outstanding?
Seller - No, none.
He seemed decent/honest on the phone so I thought I would view the car first and if everything checked out, then carry out an HPI check before handing the cash over. The only thing that put me off was the crappy private plate that he said would go with the car. I went to the bank and withdrew the cash then set off on a 200 mile journey to view/buy the car. I arrived, car looked great, decent area, and was invited in for tea. All good so far - test drove the car and everything was perfect. Service history and MOT history all checked out, although half the logbook was missing. I connected up to his wifi to carry out an HPI which I thought would be a formality, until an Alert popped up stating that finance was owing on the previous reg number. He started to bluster, claiming ignorance then suggested the garage must have taken finance out on the car themselves (!) - he then said he did take a loan out, but couldn't remember who with or how much was outstanding. I suggested to him that the car was owned by the finance company and wasn't his to sell unless he allowed me to pay off the outstanding amount, and if he was going to sell and use the money to buy his daughter a car (as he previously suggested) that would be fraud. I suspect he thought the private plate would not cross-reference the previous reg and the finance, hence why he was keen to move the plate on with the car.
I left and was 30 mins into my trip my phone started ringing incessantly - turned out I have picked up the keys to the BMW by mistake and he was understandably anxious to have them back. Given he is a lying toad I was seriously tempted to turf them out onto the verge on the A9 but thought better of it. I left them at the customer service counter of B&Q, saying I found them in the car park and then told the seller where he could pick them up.
As I spent the next two hours driving I was wondered how many people don't actually bother with HPI checks? and what are the consequences of buying a car with finance outstanding - presumably if the seller defaults they then come looking for the new owner?
Of course I should have done the HPI check before I set off but decided to hold back based on my gut feeling of the seller (proved wrong), and not wanting to spend the money in case the car wasn't as described. Lesson learnt.
I have been looking for a Z4 for a while with a particular spec so have cast the net quite far and don't mind travelling for the right car. Having exhausted PH classifieds/AT/eBay, I decided to have a look on gumtree (a site I normally avoid like the plague after trying to sell a Macbook Air last year and receiving the most inane messages). I spotted what seemed to be the perfect car - called the seller this morning and asked a series of questions including -
Me - Did you take any finance out when you purchased the car last year, or are you aware of any finance agreements outstanding?
Seller - No, none.
He seemed decent/honest on the phone so I thought I would view the car first and if everything checked out, then carry out an HPI check before handing the cash over. The only thing that put me off was the crappy private plate that he said would go with the car. I went to the bank and withdrew the cash then set off on a 200 mile journey to view/buy the car. I arrived, car looked great, decent area, and was invited in for tea. All good so far - test drove the car and everything was perfect. Service history and MOT history all checked out, although half the logbook was missing. I connected up to his wifi to carry out an HPI which I thought would be a formality, until an Alert popped up stating that finance was owing on the previous reg number. He started to bluster, claiming ignorance then suggested the garage must have taken finance out on the car themselves (!) - he then said he did take a loan out, but couldn't remember who with or how much was outstanding. I suggested to him that the car was owned by the finance company and wasn't his to sell unless he allowed me to pay off the outstanding amount, and if he was going to sell and use the money to buy his daughter a car (as he previously suggested) that would be fraud. I suspect he thought the private plate would not cross-reference the previous reg and the finance, hence why he was keen to move the plate on with the car.
I left and was 30 mins into my trip my phone started ringing incessantly - turned out I have picked up the keys to the BMW by mistake and he was understandably anxious to have them back. Given he is a lying toad I was seriously tempted to turf them out onto the verge on the A9 but thought better of it. I left them at the customer service counter of B&Q, saying I found them in the car park and then told the seller where he could pick them up.
As I spent the next two hours driving I was wondered how many people don't actually bother with HPI checks? and what are the consequences of buying a car with finance outstanding - presumably if the seller defaults they then come looking for the new owner?
Of course I should have done the HPI check before I set off but decided to hold back based on my gut feeling of the seller (proved wrong), and not wanting to spend the money in case the car wasn't as described. Lesson learnt.
The Moose said:
Do the cheapest bit first always.
CSK423 said:
HPI is surely the first port of call to ensure its worth the 200 mile trip, as much as the seller was wrong surely you've been a bit naive ?
I have to agree and disagree!I drove a similar distance to test drive a Megane 175 DCI and deliberately didn't HPI it 'till afterwards. I thought I wanted the car but I wanted to drive one as soon as possible - for all I knew I'd get in the car and hate the driving position and cross it off the list.
The car was up for £5k and drove very well, the seller told me they'd bought it from auction with a damaged bumper and bonnet, replaced them, used it as a daily driver for a bit and were now selling it on. I wanted it!
When the car came back a write off, it was obvious there was probably more damage than a bumper and bonnet (even at ins co prices - thats not enough to write off a £5k car). I spoke to the seller and they had no pictures of the car pre-repair (convenient) so I had to walk. But at least I knew I wanted one!
...I then went and spent the money on a house deposit
I feel your pain. I once went to view a car and had asked the seller specifically whether it had any finance owing, she said no. When I turned up cash in my pocket and did an HPI it had alert on finance. Turns out she owed over what I was paying for the car to the finance co. When I reminded her I asked she said, 'oh i didn't know what you were talking about. Not really sold any cars before. I was going to pay the finance when you paid me'.
Wasted 250 mile round trip.
Stupid b
h.
Not as stupid as me though, who really wanted the car some ended up going a week later, paying the finance co. direct and then taking the car.
Wasted 250 mile round trip.
Stupid b
h. Not as stupid as me though, who really wanted the car some ended up going a week later, paying the finance co. direct and then taking the car.
Should you take a car being sold privately with a cherished plate as a potential warning sign? I discovered an undeclared Cat D with an HPI check last month, and it was for sale with a private plate from a supposed private seller on autotrader.
Changing the plate hides nothing as far as an HPI check is concerned, I thought.
Changing the plate hides nothing as far as an HPI check is concerned, I thought.
Jakg said:
The Moose said:
Do the cheapest bit first always.
CSK423 said:
HPI is surely the first port of call to ensure its worth the 200 mile trip, as much as the seller was wrong surely you've been a bit naive ?
I have to agree and disagree!I drove a similar distance to test drive a Megane 175 DCI and deliberately didn't HPI it 'till afterwards. I thought I wanted the car but I wanted to drive one as soon as possible - for all I knew I'd get in the car and hate the driving position and cross it off the list.
The car was up for £5k and drove very well, the seller told me they'd bought it from auction with a damaged bumper and bonnet, replaced them, used it as a daily driver for a bit and were now selling it on. I wanted it!
When the car came back a write off, it was obvious there was probably more damage than a bumper and bonnet (even at ins co prices - thats not enough to write off a £5k car). I spoke to the seller and they had no pictures of the car pre-repair (convenient) so I had to walk. But at least I knew I wanted one!
...I then went and spent the money on a house deposit
I had already found the advert and checked the Reg before reading your email 
Definitely still outstanding financw and yes, the plate was changed after the finance was taken out! You got lucky.
Ones like this annoy me too...
http://www.gumtree.com/p/bmw/2004-bmw-z4-2.2l-se-r...
Little blurb about some small damage? Cat C write off
Definitely still outstanding financw and yes, the plate was changed after the finance was taken out! You got lucky.
Ones like this annoy me too...
http://www.gumtree.com/p/bmw/2004-bmw-z4-2.2l-se-r...
Little blurb about some small damage? Cat C write off
I don't know if it's still the case these days, but certainly 'back in the day' they couldn't touch you if you bought a car in good faith which had outstanding finance on it. I once bought a V6 Vectra SRi which while cheaper than most of the competition, wasn't that cheap to ring alarm bells. We were only talking a couple of G so didn't bother with HPI checks and the owner seemed right enough. Long story short, I paid the money, got the V5 and everything was tickety-boo until around a month later when I got a call from a finance company asking if I was the owner of registration xyz and did I know there was finance outstanding etc. Panic mode took over and I was expecting to lose the car and my money so ended the call right there . Next day the bloke phoned back and asked some more questions about it then said I had nothing to worry about as they can't legally take the car if I'd bought it in good faith with no knowledge of this. All he wanted to know was the name and address of where I'd bought it and any other details about the seller that I could provide. I never heard anything else about it and in fact had forgotten all about it when I came to flog it about a year later and the potential buyer discovered that there was still finance outstanding on it. I can't remember the specifics, but I spoke to the finance company about it and they said they'd clear the marker with HPI within a few days. True to their word they did do and it went the following weekend.
. Next day the bloke phoned back and asked some more questions about it then said I had nothing to worry about as they can't legally take the car if I'd bought it in good faith with no knowledge of this. All he wanted to know was the name and address of where I'd bought it and any other details about the seller that I could provide. I never heard anything else about it and in fact had forgotten all about it when I came to flog it about a year later and the potential buyer discovered that there was still finance outstanding on it. I can't remember the specifics, but I spoke to the finance company about it and they said they'd clear the marker with HPI within a few days. True to their word they did do and it went the following weekend.I sold my car to WBAC last year. It had finance outstanding, but the HPI didn't pick it up. I informed WBAC of this, but an error in their admin meant they sent me the full cash amount.
Now, I'm an honest sort of fellow and paid the finance off with the proceeds, so everything was clean and clear. But if I was a dirty scumbag, it could have been sold to any unsuspecting citizen.
I queried this with WBAC and they said that although it isn't common, it isn't a rare occurence either. It seems that some finance companies forget to register their interest with HPI - which is a bit worrying.
Now, I'm an honest sort of fellow and paid the finance off with the proceeds, so everything was clean and clear. But if I was a dirty scumbag, it could have been sold to any unsuspecting citizen.
I queried this with WBAC and they said that although it isn't common, it isn't a rare occurence either. It seems that some finance companies forget to register their interest with HPI - which is a bit worrying.
I learnt the hard(ish) way too about HPI.
Saw an Elise with the Exige body advertised as immaculate/ stunning/ usual cliche, and travelled up to just south of Birmingham to see it. The car was running when I got there, which put me off straight away. The Exige body looked like it had been fitted by the bloke who built his own 'Zonda', there was mould on the inside, wiring loom half exposed and it just looked a right fking state. To put it mildly.
Unsurprisingly, it didn't drive particularly well, and by this point I'd seen and had enough. Called it a day and said I'd let him know, HPI'd it just out of interest when I got home... Cat B write off.
Saw an Elise with the Exige body advertised as immaculate/ stunning/ usual cliche, and travelled up to just south of Birmingham to see it. The car was running when I got there, which put me off straight away. The Exige body looked like it had been fitted by the bloke who built his own 'Zonda', there was mould on the inside, wiring loom half exposed and it just looked a right f
king state. To put it mildly. Unsurprisingly, it didn't drive particularly well, and by this point I'd seen and had enough. Called it a day and said I'd let him know, HPI'd it just out of interest when I got home... Cat B write off.
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