Dash camera fitiing with CAN BUS electrics
Discussion
I've no idea - sorry,
i was, however thinking about dash cams whilst bored in the car today
Why don't they integrate a little Rear view cam in the rear view mirror and a forward facing one next to the rain sensors on the screen and terminate to a USB in the glove box.
Nice and easy, costs pennies to do and saves everyone hacking their dash/wiring up as you are contemplating. It would also encourage mass take up of dash cams, which would stop all these fake crashes etc in their tracks and be generally great for evidential purposes.
i was, however thinking about dash cams whilst bored in the car today
Why don't they integrate a little Rear view cam in the rear view mirror and a forward facing one next to the rain sensors on the screen and terminate to a USB in the glove box.
Nice and easy, costs pennies to do and saves everyone hacking their dash/wiring up as you are contemplating. It would also encourage mass take up of dash cams, which would stop all these fake crashes etc in their tracks and be generally great for evidential purposes.
Discodriver1 said:
Hi gents, anyone got any ideas for fitting a Hawk Eye camera (12v) onto a car with 4V CAN BUS electrics. Get a feeling I am going to have to battle through the back of the dash with a separate fused and switched feed but thought it worth asking "what does the team think?"
why are you looking at the CAN bus?there will be 12V in the headlining of the car...
Scuffers said:
why are you looking at the CAN bus?
there will be 12V in the headlining of the car...
Is that something that manufacturers do standard? Never heard of that before...there will be 12V in the headlining of the car...
Unless you mean taking something from the interior light or similar?
Edited by Swanny87 on Friday 27th February 15:36
Swanny87 said:
Scuffers said:
why are you looking at the CAN bus?
there will be 12V in the headlining of the car...
Is that something that manufacturers do standard? Never heard of that before...there will be 12V in the headlining of the car...
the lights in the headlining will be 12V, if the mirror is auto-dimming, it will have a 12V feed, etc etc etc.
really not sure what your issue is?
what car are we talking about?
I cannot see what difference it would make TBH. If yours is a discovery, there are a 2 twisted pairs (high and low speed) CAN-BUS wires which run around the vehicle and plug into anything with it's own ECU. They look like this:
If you are simply looking for a permanent live, look out for a red wire whilst ground is usually black but whatever you do, stay away from the CAN-BUS wires.
If you are simply looking for a permanent live, look out for a red wire whilst ground is usually black but whatever you do, stay away from the CAN-BUS wires.
Greg_D said:
I've no idea - sorry,
i was, however thinking about dash cams whilst bored in the car today
Why don't they integrate a little Rear view cam in the rear view mirror and a forward facing one next to the rain sensors on the screen and terminate to a USB in the glove box.
Nice and easy, costs pennies to do and saves everyone hacking their dash/wiring up as you are contemplating. It would also encourage mass take up of dash cams, which would stop all these fake crashes etc in their tracks and be generally great for evidential purposes.
As soon as I get time, I'm going to buy a second hand rear view mirror and work out how to disassemble the mirror and a dash cam to integrate the 2. It has to be possible. Neat little slot for a SD card on the side. I'll report back in 10 years when I've got round to it i was, however thinking about dash cams whilst bored in the car today
Why don't they integrate a little Rear view cam in the rear view mirror and a forward facing one next to the rain sensors on the screen and terminate to a USB in the glove box.
Nice and easy, costs pennies to do and saves everyone hacking their dash/wiring up as you are contemplating. It would also encourage mass take up of dash cams, which would stop all these fake crashes etc in their tracks and be generally great for evidential purposes.
Discodriver1 said:
Hi gents, anyone got any ideas for fitting a Hawk Eye camera (12v) onto a car with 4V CAN BUS electrics. Get a feeling I am going to have to battle through the back of the dash with a separate fused and switched feed but thought it worth asking "what does the team think?"
There is no such thing as a "4v CAN BUS". The Controller Area network BUS is a differential pair serially signalled data transmission line. It drives a differential voltage onto the two data lines (CAN HIGH & CAN LOW). When there is no differential voltage the signal is defined as a 1, when there is a differential voltage the signal data is defined as a zero. By pulsing between these two states at high speed (typically 500Kbs, or 500,000 bits per second) data can be transfered between electronic devices connected to the Bus.
Normally, you would expect to see both data lines (High & Low) at 2.5v in the dominant state, and usually they will be driven by about 1v in either direction for the recessive state (CAN LOW = 1.5V, CAN High = 3.5v). To avoid signal reflections, the ends of the bus are terminated with 120Ohm resistors.
As long as you CAN device meets the standards laid out (Usually CAN 2.0b) it should be able to transmit and receive on the CAN bus without issue
However you cannot (should not) ever attempt to use these coms bus wires to power any consumer, even though theoretically, some small amount of power is present on the Can Bus. Typically, automotive ECU's or diagnostic devices take Vbatt (nominally 12V) and power ground from pins allocated for this on the J1962 OBD connector, which must be fitted to all cars since around 2002.
J1962 pin out is as follows:
But it depends to some extent on the age of the car (most cars post ~2005 will be using CAN only for diagnostics and not the other protcols (K/L line etc)
Origin Unknown said:
As soon as I get time, I'm going to buy a second hand rear view mirror and work out how to disassemble the mirror and a dash cam to integrate the 2. It has to be possible. Neat little slot for a SD card on the side. I'll report back in 10 years when I've got round to it
eBay, plenty around!Discodriver1 said:
Thanks to all for input, the car in question is 2010 Mondeo Zetec 2.0 TDCi, and I was wanting to cable it so it became live on start up.Will investigate possibility of separate switched supply I think.
For this sort of stuff you can get a "ignition generator" which sits on the battery +ve and senses the voltage change - it uses that to provide a "IGN live" - and it switches off shortly after engine off when the voltage falls again.Eg
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IGNI-GEN-12V-Output-Igni...
This might help
You just need a switched live for hardwiring in, plenty of topics on google to help you out should you get stuck.
You just need a switched live for hardwiring in, plenty of topics on google to help you out should you get stuck.
Discodriver1 said:
Thanks to all for input, the car in question is 2010 Mondeo Zetec 2.0 TDCi, and I was wanting to cable it so it became live on start up.Will investigate possibility of separate switched supply I think.
does it have a rain sensor and/or auto light switch?if yes, then there will be a switched supply to the mirror mount.
We fit these cameras through work and if I remember correctly there is a 12v switched feed around the handbrake area. Can't remember if its the cigarette lighter or another wire but there's definitely one in that general area. Pm me if you need more info and I'll ask our fitter for details.
Max_Torque said:
Discodriver1 said:
Hi gents, anyone got any ideas for fitting a Hawk Eye camera (12v) onto a car with 4V CAN BUS electrics. Get a feeling I am going to have to battle through the back of the dash with a separate fused and switched feed but thought it worth asking "what does the team think?"
There is no such thing as a "4v CAN BUS". The Controller Area network BUS is a differential pair serially signalled data transmission line. It drives a differential voltage onto the two data lines (CAN HIGH & CAN LOW). When there is no differential voltage the signal is defined as a 1, when there is a differential voltage the signal data is defined as a zero. By pulsing between these two states at high speed (typically 500Kbs, or 500,000 bits per second) data can be transfered between electronic devices connected to the Bus.
Normally, you would expect to see both data lines (High & Low) at 2.5v in the dominant state, and usually they will be driven by about 1v in either direction for the recessive state (CAN LOW = 1.5V, CAN High = 3.5v). To avoid signal reflections, the ends of the bus are terminated with 120Ohm resistors.
As long as you CAN device meets the standards laid out (Usually CAN 2.0b) it should be able to transmit and receive on the CAN bus without issue
However you cannot (should not) ever attempt to use these coms bus wires to power any consumer, even though theoretically, some small amount of power is present on the Can Bus. Typically, automotive ECU's or diagnostic devices take Vbatt (nominally 12V) and power ground from pins allocated for this on the J1962 OBD connector, which must be fitted to all cars since around 2002.
J1962 pin out is as follows:
But it depends to some extent on the age of the car (most cars post ~2005 will be using CAN only for diagnostics and not the other protcols (K/L line etc)
CAN is used for communicating between various network systems. Not just for diag purposes. Essentially all the systems on your can (pun excused) communicate to each other (via the gateway unit) but realistically thy don't all have to be very fast. Powertrain/safety does. But door locks can be relatively slower for example. The speed is governed by the voltage range. So 500kb/s will be 1Volt ranging. 100kb/s will be 5v ranging.
( I'll ignore MOST systems and old skool 12v systems or new Flexray for now)
Edited by Rich_W on Monday 2nd March 21:59
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