MINI Cooper S Clubman ALL4: Is it the "new" WRX Wagon?
Discussion
OK, bear with me on this, as I know that on PH, the latest MINI Clubman is widely regarded as one of the fugliest cars currently available but...Subaru left quite a gap in the marketplace when they discontinued the WRX Wagon, SG Forester XT and Legacy Spec B Estate. I'm not really a big car kind of guy but my WRX Wagon was a great starter family car for us. Fast, fun and practical, yet compact, relatively light and amazing traction. Yes, it wasn't quite as cavernous as a "proper" estate car but it was usefully more practical than a saloon or small Golf-sized hatch. Let's be honest, neither it or the SG Forester were ever really lookers though. If Subaru still made cars like this, I would probably buy one next but sadly they don't anymore!
We currently have a Grand Voyager and an R56 MINI Cooper and for our current needs they are perfect. Our children are still both under 5 and in car seats and in the GV, these are a cinch to fit and there is plenty of space for their associated paraphernalia and day trips out with grandparents. The MINI is also great fun. Ignoring practicality, it's a solid 9/10 car (a Cooper S could be 10/10 but I would want a later R56 with the supposedly more reliable N18 engine). We're committed to the current fleet for the next 3 years but after that time, I have promised my wife another Fiat 500, as she loved her first one. That would mean that I would need to drive the "practical" family car. I don't mind driving the GV actually but wouldn't want to drive an MPV every day. Audi/BMW/Mercedes do some very nice larger estates (mainly diesel) but I'm not quite ready for one of those yet. Golf R Estate is auto only and well a bit German. Focus ST Estate not really my thing and a bit traction limited. I'm not completely opposed to a small SUV/crossover but to get the level of performance/handling/fun that I would want, I would need to be looking at a Macan or F-Pace and they're both big bucks!
The MINI Cooper S Clubman ALL4 seems to tick a lot of boxes. I'm actually not a fan of the latest MINI in terms of looks. It has lost its cheekiness and that was 50% of its appeal and I have never liked the Countryman/Paceman. The Clubman may be no oil painting but it does have some historical precedence with the 1960s Mini Traveller i.e. a more practical 2 door "estate" version of the Mini aimed at small families (plus two extra doors for the 21st century). I'm not sure whether the barn doors really benefit the practicality but do at least make it a bit quirkier and interesting (I hear that MINI are shooting at the dull, dull, dull A-Class and A3 Sportback with the Clubman). It's no lightweight though. I actually suspect that the cheaper, lighter, FWD Cooper S Clubman may be the better steer. The only other option that really appeals is a mk7 Golf GTI. Not as quirky or interesting but a very good car and a fairly big boot for a small hatch. Skoda Yeti is an obvious contender but they have ditched the 1.8 TFSI and AWD on most models (not a diesel fan in case you haven't realised yet)!
So, is the Cooper S Clubman the modern equivalent to a WRX Wagon or not even in the same league?
Oh and I actually don't think that it looks too bad in BRG or black...
We currently have a Grand Voyager and an R56 MINI Cooper and for our current needs they are perfect. Our children are still both under 5 and in car seats and in the GV, these are a cinch to fit and there is plenty of space for their associated paraphernalia and day trips out with grandparents. The MINI is also great fun. Ignoring practicality, it's a solid 9/10 car (a Cooper S could be 10/10 but I would want a later R56 with the supposedly more reliable N18 engine). We're committed to the current fleet for the next 3 years but after that time, I have promised my wife another Fiat 500, as she loved her first one. That would mean that I would need to drive the "practical" family car. I don't mind driving the GV actually but wouldn't want to drive an MPV every day. Audi/BMW/Mercedes do some very nice larger estates (mainly diesel) but I'm not quite ready for one of those yet. Golf R Estate is auto only and well a bit German. Focus ST Estate not really my thing and a bit traction limited. I'm not completely opposed to a small SUV/crossover but to get the level of performance/handling/fun that I would want, I would need to be looking at a Macan or F-Pace and they're both big bucks!
The MINI Cooper S Clubman ALL4 seems to tick a lot of boxes. I'm actually not a fan of the latest MINI in terms of looks. It has lost its cheekiness and that was 50% of its appeal and I have never liked the Countryman/Paceman. The Clubman may be no oil painting but it does have some historical precedence with the 1960s Mini Traveller i.e. a more practical 2 door "estate" version of the Mini aimed at small families (plus two extra doors for the 21st century). I'm not sure whether the barn doors really benefit the practicality but do at least make it a bit quirkier and interesting (I hear that MINI are shooting at the dull, dull, dull A-Class and A3 Sportback with the Clubman). It's no lightweight though. I actually suspect that the cheaper, lighter, FWD Cooper S Clubman may be the better steer. The only other option that really appeals is a mk7 Golf GTI. Not as quirky or interesting but a very good car and a fairly big boot for a small hatch. Skoda Yeti is an obvious contender but they have ditched the 1.8 TFSI and AWD on most models (not a diesel fan in case you haven't realised yet)!
So, is the Cooper S Clubman the modern equivalent to a WRX Wagon or not even in the same league?
Oh and I actually don't think that it looks too bad in BRG or black...
Edited by white_goodman on Thursday 3rd November 16:29
Edited by white_goodman on Thursday 3rd November 16:29
Haha. I'll take that as a no then? Did they not rally the Countryman though and this should handle better with a lower COG? Can you suggest an alternative? Similar size, fairly quick, fun, manual transmission etc. No worse looking than a Panamera or Cayenne IMHO and they're considerably more expensive or an A-Class for that matter...
white_goodman said:
Haha. I'll take that as a no then? Did they not rally the Countryman though and this should handle better with a lower COG? Can you suggest an alternative? Similar size, fairly quick, fun, manual transmission etc. No worse looking than a Panamera or Cayenne IMHO and they're considerably more expensive or an A-Class for that matter...
CLA45 estate is lovely looking thing since you mentioned the A class xD, local lad has one all blacked out and it looks awesome.All the VAG hot hatches have estate versions, Golf R/GTi, Seat Leon Cupra, Octavia VRS & Audi S3. Ive driven a Leon Cupra in hatch form and its a fantastic steer.
Peugeot do a lovely 308 GTi estate, The 308 hatch gets great reviews so again I assume the estate is good. Peugeots imo are always nice places to be and well kitted for their price when you compare them to the Germans
I think vauxhall still do an Astra VXR estate. I might be wrong though
Ford do a ST version of their focus estate, another very well reviewed car.
EDIT: Peugeot also have a somewhat of a rally heritage with there 208 GTi if thats the kind of thing that matters to you. I have a 207GTi and love it. I was at one of their press things and they where trying to compare there 208 Rally car to the 208 and 308 GTi hatches.
Edited by caelite on Thursday 3rd November 18:02
caelite said:
CLA45 estate is lovely looking thing since you mentioned the A class xD, local lad has one all blacked out and it looks awesome.
All the VAG hot hatches have estate versions, Golf R/GTi, Seat Leon Cupra, Octavia VRS & Audi S3. Ive driven a Leon Cupra in hatch form and its a fantastic steer.
Peugeot do a lovely 308 GTi estate, The 308 hatch gets great reviews so again I assume the estate is good. Peugeots imo are always nice places to be and well kitted for their price when you compare them to the Germans
I think vauxhall still do an Astra VXR estate. I might be wrong though
Ford do a ST version of their focus estate, another very well reviewed car.
EDIT: Peugeot also have a somewhat of a rally heritage with there 208 GTi if thats the kind of thing that matters to you. I have a 207GTi and love it. I was at one of their press things and they where trying to compare there 208 Rally car to the 208 and 308 GTi hatches.
Thanks. Some pretty decent suggestions there actually, some of which I had overlooked (Leon) or didn't know existed (308, CLA SB). Not sure if they meet all my criteria or compare favourably with my old Subaru but food for thought and there is time, so something new might come out that fulfills them better in the next 3 years. Octavia vRS a nice car but a little too big for my tastes these days. As far as I know the Astra VXR was only ever available as a 3 door hatch? I recall a Zafira VXR but never an Astra VXR Estate. All the VAG hot hatches have estate versions, Golf R/GTi, Seat Leon Cupra, Octavia VRS & Audi S3. Ive driven a Leon Cupra in hatch form and its a fantastic steer.
Peugeot do a lovely 308 GTi estate, The 308 hatch gets great reviews so again I assume the estate is good. Peugeots imo are always nice places to be and well kitted for their price when you compare them to the Germans
I think vauxhall still do an Astra VXR estate. I might be wrong though
Ford do a ST version of their focus estate, another very well reviewed car.
EDIT: Peugeot also have a somewhat of a rally heritage with there 208 GTi if thats the kind of thing that matters to you. I have a 207GTi and love it. I was at one of their press things and they where trying to compare there 208 Rally car to the 208 and 308 GTi hatches.
Edited by caelite on Thursday 3rd November 18:02
DanielSan said:
OP I think it's time you started taking the pills again....
OK. We've already established that the looks are very "marmite" but how about functionality and the way it drives (which ought to be more important to the average PHer)? Some of the reviews that I have read suggest that it may be even be the best car in the range! I seem to have a bizarre liking for quirky vehicles and would rather drive something a bit out of the ordinary if divisive rather than bland/boring.I don't mind how the Clubman looks too much, but purely for its new age not a proper 4x4, 4 wheel drive system it's just not as capable an all rounder as a WRX, and I'm willing to bet everything on red and say it'll be nowhere near as mechanically tough or clock up the miles and abuse like a WRX.
It's more badging exercise than seriously practical all rounder.
It's more badging exercise than seriously practical all rounder.
DanielSan said:
I don't mind how the Clubman looks too much, but purely for its new age not a proper 4x4, 4 wheel drive system it's just not as capable an all rounder as a WRX, and I'm willing to bet everything on red and say it'll be nowhere near as mechanically tough or clock up the miles and abuse like a WRX.
It's more badging exercise than seriously practical all rounder.
Fair enough. I had doubts myself, which was why I was asking. The new one now has the same engine as the BMW 320 vs. the PSA engine in the previous generation though, which does seem to be the car's Achilles and I agree not as mechanically tough as the Subaru. I believe that the Countryman is still previous gen, so still has the PSA engine, whereas the Clubman has the BMW engine, which may be better reliability-wise long-term? My MINI is great fun though and if I have to drive something larger the idea of my car with a bit more power, practicality and AWD traction appeals more than a bargey diesel 3-Series/C-Class/A4 estate. The "normal" MINI 3 door hatch is fairly true to the original and apart from the tenuous connection between the Clubman and the 60s Traveller, I find all the MINI/Fiat 500 spin-offs a little abhorrent though!It's more badging exercise than seriously practical all rounder.
My wife's just taken delivery of an auto clubman sd, looks aren't to my taste but it's more interesting than the vag alternatives, for a diesel with a slush box it's a very good car. Effortlessly dealt with the 600 mile round trip to Cornwall and held it's own on the b roads. A petrol with a manual box would make for a fantastic car, just dont expect the load space of the larger estates, it's rather small in the luggage capacity stakes.
I think the current Clubman and previous gen Clubman are brilliant cars. Why? Quirkiness and left field. How many cars these days have that quality? For instance, most people regurgitate stuff from retarded journalists about the Clubdoor being on the wrong side. No it's not. I much prefer it on the "wrong" side and I'm the one living with it as my daily driver. It works for me and others.
Given my current fleet - apart from the 520d which is a company car - I don't think I could buy mainstream again.
Given my current fleet - apart from the 520d which is a company car - I don't think I could buy mainstream again.
Is it bad that i actually quite like the look of that? I've always absolutely detested the daft bigger version of the Mini like the Clubman and whatever the other ones are called. But that kinda looks a bit cool?
Anyway, to answer your question, no it most definitely isn't the new WRX Wagon whatsoever. It could be brilliant, it could be great but a Scooby Wagon beater it ain't.
Anyway, to answer your question, no it most definitely isn't the new WRX Wagon whatsoever. It could be brilliant, it could be great but a Scooby Wagon beater it ain't.
My other half has a 12 plate Countryperson Cooper SD ALL4 - yes, it's tourquey with its 320D-derived engine and goes remarkably well, but it's also talky 
which grates as the thing grumbles along like Marvin the paranoid android in the background (and extended it's pretty shouty 
).
It also handles incredibly well - but with no life to the steering just "point and go" and it hangs on like it's an arcade game screen. The future. I have a few 1980s cars capable of giving a drive with lots of feedback, I enjoy driving them.
I also have a 1990s Metro 1100 which recently shrugged off 360 painless and relaxing miles in 36 hours in a way the Countryperson never ever could... We got out at our destination after 180 miles and got on with our day saying "right, we're here" with no aches or pains or distress, and went back home 24 hours later after which journey we got out similarly unscathed. Ironically, we both know we have travelled after similar trips in the Countryperson
.
which grates as the thing grumbles along like Marvin the paranoid android in the background (and extended it's pretty shouty ).It also handles incredibly well - but with no life to the steering just "point and go" and it hangs on like it's an arcade game screen. The future. I have a few 1980s cars capable of giving a drive with lots of feedback, I enjoy driving them.
I also have a 1990s Metro 1100 which recently shrugged off 360 painless and relaxing miles in 36 hours in a way the Countryperson never ever could... We got out at our destination after 180 miles and got on with our day saying "right, we're here" with no aches or pains or distress, and went back home 24 hours later after which journey we got out similarly unscathed. Ironically, we both know we have travelled after similar trips in the Countryperson
.
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