An unanticipated predominance of English
Discussion
The latest addition to the ecurie is a Japanese import Mercedes C200 estate. It is Japanese spec and almost everything is written in Japanese, as you might expect. But if it's not in Japanese, it's in English. As far as I have explored, there's no German to be seen. American English perhaps, but English nonetheless.
Funny that. And it took a while to dawn on me.
The badges on the wings say Blue Efficiency. That can't mean much to your average Japanese.
Is it a tacit acknowledgement by Mercedes that English is more international than German? That's quite a big step.
Funny that. And it took a while to dawn on me.
The badges on the wings say Blue Efficiency. That can't mean much to your average Japanese.
Is it a tacit acknowledgement by Mercedes that English is more international than German? That's quite a big step.
My first Landcruiser 70 series, every electrical component such as relays were stamped in English with the voltage and purpose, ie 12v glow plug relay.
It makes sense on vehicle designed to be sold all over the world, English is almost universal as a second language, even in the back of beyond thousands of miles from a city a bush mechanic will be able to find someone who can translate from English for them.
It makes sense on vehicle designed to be sold all over the world, English is almost universal as a second language, even in the back of beyond thousands of miles from a city a bush mechanic will be able to find someone who can translate from English for them.
English is fairly widely used 'for effect' in Japan, in a similar manner to how French is used on menus here, but more broadly.
Naturally enough it's more common in respect of imported cars than say with a Nissan or Toyota. Since the domestic industry is so comprehensive, those Japanese who pay more to own an imported car like to feel they have something special / fashionable / international, which I think may be part of the reason for keeping some of the text in English. (For the same reason that many imported cars are chosen in LHD, even Bentleys!)
The level of spoken English among Japanese has increased in the past 20 years or so, I suspect most would recognise 'Blue' from school but not be able to explain why that colour is used to denote reduced environmental impact (can many British people?). The only Japanese person I know who reads German is a dentist who read medical papers in the language, otherwise I don't think it's at all well known.
What may be less obvious is that even the 'Japanese' words in the above are actually English words spelt out phonetically in katakana. Eg the bullet points are
- Mercedes-Benz Vehicle Maintenance
- Mercedes Care
- My Mercedes Maintenance
- My Mercedes Support
- Touring Support Plus
(I think... not 100% on that)
which is a little bit like how english often has both anglo-saxon and french origin words giving us two ways of saying the same thing, but with a different attitude.
As far as the Germans go, I work for a different large German automotive company and English is widely used internally. I think most Germans accept that English is the global language and just get on with learning it to a good level and getting the benefits of international communication.
Naturally enough it's more common in respect of imported cars than say with a Nissan or Toyota. Since the domestic industry is so comprehensive, those Japanese who pay more to own an imported car like to feel they have something special / fashionable / international, which I think may be part of the reason for keeping some of the text in English. (For the same reason that many imported cars are chosen in LHD, even Bentleys!)
The level of spoken English among Japanese has increased in the past 20 years or so, I suspect most would recognise 'Blue' from school but not be able to explain why that colour is used to denote reduced environmental impact (can many British people?). The only Japanese person I know who reads German is a dentist who read medical papers in the language, otherwise I don't think it's at all well known.
What may be less obvious is that even the 'Japanese' words in the above are actually English words spelt out phonetically in katakana. Eg the bullet points are
- Mercedes-Benz Vehicle Maintenance
- Mercedes Care
- My Mercedes Maintenance
- My Mercedes Support
- Touring Support Plus
(I think... not 100% on that)
which is a little bit like how english often has both anglo-saxon and french origin words giving us two ways of saying the same thing, but with a different attitude.
As far as the Germans go, I work for a different large German automotive company and English is widely used internally. I think most Germans accept that English is the global language and just get on with learning it to a good level and getting the benefits of international communication.
samoht said:
English is fairly widely used 'for effect' in Japan, in a similar manner to how French is used on menus here, but more broadly.
Naturally enough it's more common in respect of imported cars than say with a Nissan or Toyota. Since the domestic industry is so comprehensive, those Japanese who pay more to own an imported car like to feel they have something special / fashionable / international, which I think may be part of the reason for keeping some of the text in English. (For the same reason that many imported cars are chosen in LHD, even Bentleys!)
The level of spoken English among Japanese has increased in the past 20 years or so, I suspect most would recognise 'Blue' from school but not be able to explain why that colour is used to denote reduced environmental impact (can many British people?). The only Japanese person I know who reads German is a dentist who read medical papers in the language, otherwise I don't think it's at all well known.
What may be less obvious is that even the 'Japanese' words in the above are actually English words spelt out phonetically in katakana. Eg the bullet points are
- Mercedes-Benz Vehicle Maintenance
- Mercedes Care
- My Mercedes Maintenance
- My Mercedes Support
- Touring Support Plus
(I think... not 100% on that)
which is a little bit like how english often has both anglo-saxon and french origin words giving us two ways of saying the same thing, but with a different attitude.
As far as the Germans go, I work for a different large German automotive company and English is widely used internally. I think most Germans accept that English is the global language and just get on with learning it to a good level and getting the benefits of international communication.
That's absolutely marvellous. Thanks for that.Naturally enough it's more common in respect of imported cars than say with a Nissan or Toyota. Since the domestic industry is so comprehensive, those Japanese who pay more to own an imported car like to feel they have something special / fashionable / international, which I think may be part of the reason for keeping some of the text in English. (For the same reason that many imported cars are chosen in LHD, even Bentleys!)
The level of spoken English among Japanese has increased in the past 20 years or so, I suspect most would recognise 'Blue' from school but not be able to explain why that colour is used to denote reduced environmental impact (can many British people?). The only Japanese person I know who reads German is a dentist who read medical papers in the language, otherwise I don't think it's at all well known.
What may be less obvious is that even the 'Japanese' words in the above are actually English words spelt out phonetically in katakana. Eg the bullet points are
- Mercedes-Benz Vehicle Maintenance
- Mercedes Care
- My Mercedes Maintenance
- My Mercedes Support
- Touring Support Plus
(I think... not 100% on that)
which is a little bit like how english often has both anglo-saxon and french origin words giving us two ways of saying the same thing, but with a different attitude.
As far as the Germans go, I work for a different large German automotive company and English is widely used internally. I think most Germans accept that English is the global language and just get on with learning it to a good level and getting the benefits of international communication.
Wacky Racer said:
In my experience nearly all Germans speak English, or at least have a grasp of it, unlike in France.
I
i had a multi lingual French colleague working in the Frankfurt office. She was having a conversation with a German colleague in German and he was speaking in English because she was visiting from London. it took them a few minutes to realise they were doing it because they were both so fluent. I
An extract from an article in a recent edition of the Spectator.
After Brexit, it was all going to be so different for Europe. Following years of growing dominance by the English-speaking world, at last the great European project could return to the language of its founders. Well, that’s what the French believed. Britain’s exit was seen as an opportunity to raise the status of the French language in the EU. Under their presidency last year, French diplomats announced that all key meetings would be in French, alongside translations, with minutes and notes being in French. Some politicians in the National Assembly hoped that French would become ‘the only’ working language of the EU, calling Brexit a ‘unique opportunity’ to reverse the march of ‘Anglo-Saxon culture’.
Yet other European officials were not keen on the idea and complained that ‘We are so used to English.’ Indeed, when Portugal held the EU presidency, ambassador Nuno Brito would speak mostly in English in council meetings. And when the time came for France’s presidency, in early 2022, their insistence on using la langue préférée of international diplomacy especially annoyed Baltic and Scandinavian representatives, who all speak fluent English. Because, while the departure of the British could have heralded the decline of English in the corridors of Brussels, paradoxically the opposite seems to have happened. English, because it is no longer the language of a major EU nation, is now a more neutral form of communication and so seems more popular than ever.
The march is relentless. L’Académie française, who are usually viewed by the British press as charming no-hopers fighting a war against reality, last year threatened to sue the French government unless it removed ‘English words like “surname” from the country’s new biometric identity cards’, calling the English ‘invasion’ unnecessary and unconstitutional.
Such is the domination of English in the Middle East that even ISIS opened two English language schools in Raqqa
After Brexit, it was all going to be so different for Europe. Following years of growing dominance by the English-speaking world, at last the great European project could return to the language of its founders. Well, that’s what the French believed. Britain’s exit was seen as an opportunity to raise the status of the French language in the EU. Under their presidency last year, French diplomats announced that all key meetings would be in French, alongside translations, with minutes and notes being in French. Some politicians in the National Assembly hoped that French would become ‘the only’ working language of the EU, calling Brexit a ‘unique opportunity’ to reverse the march of ‘Anglo-Saxon culture’.
Yet other European officials were not keen on the idea and complained that ‘We are so used to English.’ Indeed, when Portugal held the EU presidency, ambassador Nuno Brito would speak mostly in English in council meetings. And when the time came for France’s presidency, in early 2022, their insistence on using la langue préférée of international diplomacy especially annoyed Baltic and Scandinavian representatives, who all speak fluent English. Because, while the departure of the British could have heralded the decline of English in the corridors of Brussels, paradoxically the opposite seems to have happened. English, because it is no longer the language of a major EU nation, is now a more neutral form of communication and so seems more popular than ever.
The march is relentless. L’Académie française, who are usually viewed by the British press as charming no-hopers fighting a war against reality, last year threatened to sue the French government unless it removed ‘English words like “surname” from the country’s new biometric identity cards’, calling the English ‘invasion’ unnecessary and unconstitutional.
Such is the domination of English in the Middle East that even ISIS opened two English language schools in Raqqa
I’m often surprised by the variation in English dubs of Japanese anime, vs the English subs.
Clearly done by different people, and wildly different.
Often the subs are more accurate I feel, and the dubs are often properly dumbed down for people who can’t even read (especially between lines)
It makes you think a lot about Japanese culture and language, and ultimately meaning.
Obviously Mercedes branding/messaging is best conveyed in English.
And possibly has an aura of mystique because of its non-Japanese culture/language/branding.
Clearly done by different people, and wildly different.
Often the subs are more accurate I feel, and the dubs are often properly dumbed down for people who can’t even read (especially between lines)
It makes you think a lot about Japanese culture and language, and ultimately meaning.
Obviously Mercedes branding/messaging is best conveyed in English.
And possibly has an aura of mystique because of its non-Japanese culture/language/branding.
Almost 30 years ago I was backpacking around Australia. I was travelling with a disparate group - 2 Dutch, 3 Germans, a Japanese and myself - English.
We were in the main market in Adelaide and one of the Germans said (in English) what "Just language are the locals speaking?"
I immediately said "Surely you must know....they are speaking German?"
To which all three Germans 'kind of' shook their heads as though I had lost the plot.
Until.... they actually listened to what was being said. And I was correct. They WERE speaking German - or at least a version of....
Adelaide has a large population of German descent - many of whom came to cultivate grapes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Australians
The South Australian wine industry was very much based around German grape varieties / methods. Obviously these German Australians communicated in English with Australians but spoke German amongst themselves...... or rather a bastardised version of German.
Imagine speaking the German language in C19th Australia. 'New' inventions would come along. For example "aeroplane", "television", "telephone". The German Australians would use these English words in the middle of German sentences. Which was why their version of German was all but unintelligible to actual native German speakers. (and the German Australians used a particular country dialect).
It was rather amusing as they discussed this amongst themselves (in English). I joked "Hey, shouldn't you be discussing this in German rather than English?"
To which they laughed, because one of them was a Sudeten German, the other two from Berlin. And they found that 'their' common language was English rather than German ie they found the differences between 'High' and 'Low' German were too hard to reconcile.
A bit like a Geordie trying to communicate with a Bristolian, I suppose!
We were in the main market in Adelaide and one of the Germans said (in English) what "Just language are the locals speaking?"
I immediately said "Surely you must know....they are speaking German?"
To which all three Germans 'kind of' shook their heads as though I had lost the plot.
Until.... they actually listened to what was being said. And I was correct. They WERE speaking German - or at least a version of....
Adelaide has a large population of German descent - many of whom came to cultivate grapes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Australians
The South Australian wine industry was very much based around German grape varieties / methods. Obviously these German Australians communicated in English with Australians but spoke German amongst themselves...... or rather a bastardised version of German.
Imagine speaking the German language in C19th Australia. 'New' inventions would come along. For example "aeroplane", "television", "telephone". The German Australians would use these English words in the middle of German sentences. Which was why their version of German was all but unintelligible to actual native German speakers. (and the German Australians used a particular country dialect).
It was rather amusing as they discussed this amongst themselves (in English). I joked "Hey, shouldn't you be discussing this in German rather than English?"
To which they laughed, because one of them was a Sudeten German, the other two from Berlin. And they found that 'their' common language was English rather than German ie they found the differences between 'High' and 'Low' German were too hard to reconcile.
A bit like a Geordie trying to communicate with a Bristolian, I suppose!
Edited by alfaspecial on Sunday 15th October 15:57
alfaspecial said:
Almost 30 years ago I was backpacking around Australia. I was travelling with a disparate group - 2 Dutch, 3 Germans, a Japanese and myself - English.
We were in the main market in Adelaide and one of the Germans said (in English) what "Just language are the locals speaking?"
I immediately said "Surely you must know....they are speaking German?"
To which all three Germans 'kind of' shook their heads as though I had lost the plot.
Until.... they actually listened to what was being said. And I was correct. They WERE speaking German - or at least a version of....
Adelaide has a large population of German descent - many of whom came to cultivate grapes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Australians
The South Australian wine industry was very much based around German grape varieties / methods. Obviously these German Australians communicated in English with Australians but spoke German amongst themselves...... or rather a bastardised version of German.
Imagine speaking the German language in C19th Australia. 'New' inventions would come along. For example "aeroplane", "television", "telephone". The German Australians would use these English words in the middle of German sentences. Which was why their version of German was all but unintelligible to actual native German speakers. (and the German Australians used a particular country dialect).
It was rather amusing as they discussed this amongst themselves (in English). I joked "Hey, shouldn't you be discussing this in German rather than English?"
To which they laughed, because one of them was a Sudeten German, the other two from Berlin. And they found that 'their' common language was English rather than German ie they found the differences between 'High' and 'Low' German were too hard to reconcile.
A bit like a Geordie trying to communicate with a Bristolian, I suppose!
That's absolutely marvellous. Thanks for that.We were in the main market in Adelaide and one of the Germans said (in English) what "Just language are the locals speaking?"
I immediately said "Surely you must know....they are speaking German?"
To which all three Germans 'kind of' shook their heads as though I had lost the plot.
Until.... they actually listened to what was being said. And I was correct. They WERE speaking German - or at least a version of....
Adelaide has a large population of German descent - many of whom came to cultivate grapes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Australians
The South Australian wine industry was very much based around German grape varieties / methods. Obviously these German Australians communicated in English with Australians but spoke German amongst themselves...... or rather a bastardised version of German.
Imagine speaking the German language in C19th Australia. 'New' inventions would come along. For example "aeroplane", "television", "telephone". The German Australians would use these English words in the middle of German sentences. Which was why their version of German was all but unintelligible to actual native German speakers. (and the German Australians used a particular country dialect).
It was rather amusing as they discussed this amongst themselves (in English). I joked "Hey, shouldn't you be discussing this in German rather than English?"
To which they laughed, because one of them was a Sudeten German, the other two from Berlin. And they found that 'their' common language was English rather than German ie they found the differences between 'High' and 'Low' German were too hard to reconcile.
A bit like a Geordie trying to communicate with a Bristolian, I suppose!
Edited by alfaspecial on Sunday 15th October 15:57
A South African I worked with for a spell in Thame had a bit of sensitive business he needed to discuss with another South African. They found a quiet pub in town, just the barman and one other drinker, and started to converse in Afrikaans. They noticed that every now and then the lone drinker would chuckle to himself and dismissed him as being a bit odd. When he laughed out loud they had enough and confronted him. He said he was Dutch and they were talking the oldest form of Dutch he'd ever heard. It was like a Brit overhearing Elizabethans.
Forsooth.
Forsooth.
I was recently speaking to some Dutch friends and they told me that most University courses in the Netherlands use English as the primary language. They explained that as most of the papers & books used by University students were written in English that it makes sense to use English throughout the entire course.
LRDefender said:
I was recently speaking to some Dutch friends and they told me that most University courses in the Netherlands use English as the primary language. They explained that as most of the papers & books used by University students were written in English that it makes sense to use English throughout the entire course.
All the Dutch people I worked with could write and speak English as well as many English people I know.I always felt a bit rude when conversing but it really is the case that everyone else will do English as it’s in their interests… but it then makes being English hard work as you can’t reasonably know every other language.
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