Discussion
Hi all
I run an old diesel 2003 Shogun no DPF yet nearly everyone I know has had to have their DPF's taken off thus my question is how do these vehicles pass an MOT? While I realise certain MOT stations are less strict than others there MUST be fines depending of either the MOT stations or the drivers of cars where the DPF has been disabled and what if you bought a second hand car not knowing the DPF has been taken off?
Cheers in advance and really look forward to peoples take on the subect
I run an old diesel 2003 Shogun no DPF yet nearly everyone I know has had to have their DPF's taken off thus my question is how do these vehicles pass an MOT? While I realise certain MOT stations are less strict than others there MUST be fines depending of either the MOT stations or the drivers of cars where the DPF has been disabled and what if you bought a second hand car not knowing the DPF has been taken off?
Cheers in advance and really look forward to peoples take on the subect
Would a 2003 have needed a DPF?
Thought these were occasionally for EU4 in 2005, with most needed for EU5 in 2009.
What I mean is, will they be looking for one? if you’ve no warning lights, no smoke, and no obvious tampering, they can’t know.
Thought these were occasionally for EU4 in 2005, with most needed for EU5 in 2009.
What I mean is, will they be looking for one? if you’ve no warning lights, no smoke, and no obvious tampering, they can’t know.
Edited by Rough101 on Sunday 26th January 12:23
Happens over here where we have government run MOT centres.
Get caught it’s a £1000 fine basically the same as replacing it so worth the gamble to get through one MOT. If you get queried play dumb that you purchased the car with the previous owner/dealer having done it and you hadn’t a clue.
Personal view is manufacturer greed on a vital part is responsible. If it was a £200 part or easier to access and clean it wouldn’t be a problem. Also cars misold not being suitable or with crap regens a major contributor.
Get caught it’s a £1000 fine basically the same as replacing it so worth the gamble to get through one MOT. If you get queried play dumb that you purchased the car with the previous owner/dealer having done it and you hadn’t a clue.
Personal view is manufacturer greed on a vital part is responsible. If it was a £200 part or easier to access and clean it wouldn’t be a problem. Also cars misold not being suitable or with crap regens a major contributor.
It's not removed, its modified and left on the vehicle.
DIY ones they take it off and knock it through with a chisel and clean out all the ceramic inside and refit it. Rusted bolts, exhaust clamps etc are undone and it is pretty easy to see something has gone on.
More professional places dont leave any evidence as they grind open the welds on the can, make a 3" hole in the ceramic but leave most of it in place and weld it back up, so bolts, clamps etc are clearly untouched.
In both cases the ECU is remapped to ignore pressure readings.
DIY ones they take it off and knock it through with a chisel and clean out all the ceramic inside and refit it. Rusted bolts, exhaust clamps etc are undone and it is pretty easy to see something has gone on.
More professional places dont leave any evidence as they grind open the welds on the can, make a 3" hole in the ceramic but leave most of it in place and weld it back up, so bolts, clamps etc are clearly untouched.
In both cases the ECU is remapped to ignore pressure readings.
Decky_Q said:
It's not removed, its modified and left on the vehicle.
DIY ones they take it off and knock it through with a chisel and clean out all the ceramic inside and refit it. Rusted bolts, exhaust clamps etc are undone and it is pretty easy to see something has gone on.
More professional places dont leave any evidence as they grind open the welds on the can, make a 3" hole in the ceramic but leave most of it in place and weld it back up, so bolts, clamps etc are clearly untouched.
In both cases the ECU is remapped to ignore pressure readings.
Thanks and thought this but didn't know the tech wording. So in both the rough and professional jobs the holes are made larger so they don't get blocked, which I think is the layman's answer, which I get BUT without getting too technical the holes are now bigger so don't get blocked which is great I suppose but then the question is when a car has an MOT there is some sort of emission range and it either passes or fails but surely if the holes are bigger not to get blocked the emission levels are off the chart or does it not work like that?DIY ones they take it off and knock it through with a chisel and clean out all the ceramic inside and refit it. Rusted bolts, exhaust clamps etc are undone and it is pretty easy to see something has gone on.
More professional places dont leave any evidence as they grind open the welds on the can, make a 3" hole in the ceramic but leave most of it in place and weld it back up, so bolts, clamps etc are clearly untouched.
In both cases the ECU is remapped to ignore pressure readings.
If your DPF is getting blocked up you have an issue elsewhere, could be something as simple as thermostat is getting old and sticking not allowing the coolant temp to get up high enough to allow DPF regens to happen.
DPFs all have a minimum life of around 100,000 miles, that is for someone doing really short journeys, but most will last 250,000 miles no problem if the car is looked after.
The bigger issue is garages not even understanding this, many throw on a new DPF rather than working out why it is blocked. It will be fine for another 10k miles maybe, but it won't last much longer than that if the issue is not sorted.
DPFs all have a minimum life of around 100,000 miles, that is for someone doing really short journeys, but most will last 250,000 miles no problem if the car is looked after.
The bigger issue is garages not even understanding this, many throw on a new DPF rather than working out why it is blocked. It will be fine for another 10k miles maybe, but it won't last much longer than that if the issue is not sorted.
Ed.Neumann said:
DPFs all have a minimum life of around 100,000 miles, that is for someone doing really short journeys, but most will last 250,000 miles no problem if the car is looked after.
This may be true as a general rule, but it's not true of all cars with DPFs, for example various JLR SUVs had issues as the platform hadn't been designed for a DPF so they weren't close enough to the engine to regen reliably.IME it's not so difficult to get an MoT done where certain issues are overlooked, if needed. (Relatedly when buying a car, do not take an MoT pass as evidence of the car's condition).
samoht said:
This may be true as a general rule, but it's not true of all cars with DPFs, for example various JLR SUVs had issues as the platform hadn't been designed for a DPF so they weren't close enough to the engine to regen reliably.
Yeah, I was going to use the LR Ingenium engines as an example of "issue elsewhere" can also be through bad design. I'll ask one of the taxi drivers round here where they get their dodgy mot from.
Literally every taxi round here belches out thick black smoke at every opportunity, and stink to be behind.
Annoying as it gives diesel a continued bad name. Meanwhile us law abiding types have done 170k on the original dpf, with no thought of removing it.
Literally every taxi round here belches out thick black smoke at every opportunity, and stink to be behind.
Annoying as it gives diesel a continued bad name. Meanwhile us law abiding types have done 170k on the original dpf, with no thought of removing it.
Ed.Neumann said:
If your DPF is getting blocked up you have an issue elsewhere, could be something as simple as thermostat is getting old and sticking not allowing the coolant temp to get up high enough to allow DPF regens to happen.
DPFs all have a minimum life of around 100,000 miles, that is for someone doing really short journeys, but most will last 250,000 miles no problem if the car is looked after.
The bigger issue is garages not even understanding this, many throw on a new DPF rather than working out why it is blocked. It will be fine for another 10k miles maybe, but it won't last much longer than that if the issue is not sorted.
Loading up the parts cannon is profitable.DPFs all have a minimum life of around 100,000 miles, that is for someone doing really short journeys, but most will last 250,000 miles no problem if the car is looked after.
The bigger issue is garages not even understanding this, many throw on a new DPF rather than working out why it is blocked. It will be fine for another 10k miles maybe, but it won't last much longer than that if the issue is not sorted.
Shearwater, keeping it simple, the MOT emissions tests measure the chemical composition of the GASES coming out of the exhaust.
The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter untill they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter untill they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
Decky_Q said:
Shearwater, keeping it simple, the MOT emissions tests measure the chemical composition of the GASES coming out of the exhaust.
The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter until they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
Thanks everyone and particular in keeping it simple so shall re-phrase my question more simply......The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter until they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
Will a car with a modified DPF pass or fail an MOT?
Cheers
Shearwater52 said:
Decky_Q said:
Shearwater, keeping it simple, the MOT emissions tests measure the chemical composition of the GASES coming out of the exhaust.
The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter until they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
Thanks everyone and particular in keeping it simple so shall re-phrase my question more simply......The DPF is like a sieve that catches large soot particles of solid matter until they break down into smaller particles. This is checked with a "visible smoke test" where you look at the exhaust and decide for yourself if it looks bad or not.
Will a car with a modified DPF pass or fail an MOT?
Cheers
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