RE: Jaguar XK tweaked for 2012 M/Y
Thursday 21st April 2011
The XK range gets a new front endAs well as unveiling a significantly revised XF at the New York motor show, Jaguar has pulled the wraps off this lightly freshened XK.
XKR-S - expect news from the 'Ring...The new XKR-S is also at New York, and although we've seen that car already, we're expecting an announcement soon from the Nurburgring where we've been tipped off that Jaguar engineers have been engaged in trying to record an official lap time.
Jaguar XK tweaked for 2012 M/Y
New York show unveil for Jaguar's updated GT
The XK range gets a new front end
Changes are limited to a new bumper and grille treatment, and more contemporary styling for the headlamps, plus a switch to a horizontal chrome embellishment behind the front wheelarches. (Previous generation cars had a vertical trim strip because when the car was designed Jaguar didn't want to conflict with what is recognisably an Aston Martin-esque styling cue. Now no longer corporate bedfellows, we can assume they're officially 'not bovvered'.)
There's a new range of colours, and various minor tweaks inside to switchgear and trim.
XKR-S - expect news from the 'Ring...
Something starting with a '7' is the goal, apparently...
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Discussion
Finally, for the first time since the late eighties, Jaguar has been free to do what it wants without worrying about stepping on Aston Martin's toes ...
toppstuff said:
Headlights are a big improvement.
The spoiler on the back is revolting. It's a 80's throwback that serves no purpose. Anyone willfully choosing to own an XK with this appendage is an idiot.
Are you sure about the "serves no purpose" bit? In the article about the special edition that first featured the spoiler, the designer (Mike Cross?) claimed it provided much needed stability at speed. He's probably an idiot though The spoiler on the back is revolting. It's a 80's throwback that serves no purpose. Anyone willfully choosing to own an XK with this appendage is an idiot.
toppstuff said:
Headlights are a big improvement.
The spoiler on the back is revolting. It's a 80's throwback that serves no purpose. Anyone willfully choosing to own an XK with this appendage is an idiot.
Only available on the XKR-S where it's standard fit; thus anyone wishing to spec it on a regular XK will be sThe spoiler on the back is revolting. It's a 80's throwback that serves no purpose. Anyone willfully choosing to own an XK with this appendage is an idiot.
t out of luck- idiot or otherwise. ewenm said:
Are you sure about the "serves no purpose" bit? In the article about the special edition that first featured the spoiler, the designer (Mike Cross?) claimed it provided much needed stability at speed. He's probably an idiot though
Yes. There may well be technical reasons for the spoiler and no doubt this floats the boat of an engineer, but if there are drivers who really want the added stability when driving at probably at wharp factor 9 then fine, let them fit a spoiler. I will reserve the right to laugh at them.
The 80's throwback appearance is unforgivable. This is a Jaguar, not a 20 year old Toyota Supra or an old 280ZX.
It is lazy, cheapskate engineering anyway. If the car needs more downforce, a more elegant and more "jaguar" like solution would be to design an increased lip to the existing spoiler or engineer something retractable. The spoiler they offer is pure Halfords. And for the best part of £100k, unforgivable IMO.
In spite of their misplaced dreams, this is NOT a GT3RS. If I was a buyer of the hot XKR I would absolutely insist that the add on spoiler was removed and replaced with something like the old one. If the car needs a bigger spoiler then they should do a proper job , in keeping with a Jaguar.
Edited by toppstuff on Thursday 21st April 10:35
toppstuff said:
ewenm said:
Are you sure about the "serves no purpose" bit? In the article about the special edition that first featured the spoiler, the designer (Mike Cross?) claimed it provided much needed stability at speed. He's probably an idiot though
Yes. There may well be technical reasons for the spoiler and no doubt this floats the boat of an engineer, but if there are drivers who really want the added stability when driving at probably at wharp factor 9 then fine, let them fit a spoiler. I will reserve the right to laugh at them.
The 80's throwback appearance is unforgivable. This is a Jaguar, not a 20 year old Toyota Supra or an old 280ZX.
It is lazy, cheapskate engineering anyway. If the car needs more downforce, a more elegant and more "jaguar" like solution would be to design an increased lip to the existing spoiler or engineer something retractable. The spoiler they offer is pure Halfords. And for the best part of £100k, unforgivable IMO.
In spite of their misplaced dreams, this is NOT a GT3RS. If I was a buyer of the hot XKR I would absolutely insist that the add on spoiler was removed and replaced with something like the old one. If the car needs a bigger spoiler then they should do a proper job , in keeping with a Jaguar.
Edited by toppstuff on Thursday 21st April 10:35
Should have gone to Specsavers....
This is Jags attempt at building a more hard core XK, that has a little of the GT3/M3 GTS flavour about it. Perhaps not for your so-called traditional Jag buyer, but so what?!
If Jag had continued to listen to the traditionalists (you evidently being one of them) then they would still be stuck in the backward-facing retro fixation, that did little to demonstrate the superb technology and design that had gone into the cars beneath the skin.
Each to their own , but I love that XKR-S, but also the less extrovert models.
Daily driver, XFR please and a XFR-S for weekends and track fun!
300bhp/ton said:
Can't really say I've ever understood this kind of attitude??? Most bafferling 
I just have a major dislike of tacked on spoilers on road cars. They are a lazy, predictable engineering solution when a car needs a mid-life facelift and the bean counters won't spend the money on engineering a proper , more elegant alternative. It's not appropriate for a Jaguar.
Edited to add: I am not a traditionalist ! I favour and welcome the new Jaguars. But I am disappointed at the lazy use of a tacked on spoiler. It is ugly and unnecessary.
Looking at this, I rest my case:
Edited by toppstuff on Thursday 21st April 10:50
300bhp/ton said:
toppstuff said:
The spoiler on the back is revolting. It's a 80's throwback that serves no purpose. Anyone willfully choosing to own an XK with this appendage is an idiot.
Can't really say I've ever understood this kind of attitude??? Most bafferling The third rear brake light has to be legally at a certain height. Because of the rear slope of the car the visibility of the rear window would be further reduced by a window mounted brake light.
There was only the solution of a body mounted one but the designers did not want to put grooves into the rear body surface. So one decided on a rear spoiler (that was recommended by the aerodynmics department anyway) that would carry the third rear brake light.
This is first hand Jag info. Hard to believe but this is how things come about.
Without regulations about a third brake light there would be no rear spoiler. This is how regulations screw up design.
vintageracer01 said:
Don't laugh, but this spoiler has a reason (besides improving down-force on the rear axle.)
The third rear brake light has to be legally at a certain height. Because of the rear slope of the car the visibility of the rear window would be further reduced by a window mounted brake light.
There was only the solution of a body mounted one but the designers did not want to put grooves into the rear body surface. So one decided on a rear spoiler (that was recommended by the aerodynmics department anyway) that would carry the third rear brake light.
This is first hand Jag info. Hard to believe but this is how things come about.
Without regulations about a third brake light there would be no rear spoiler. This is how regulations screw up design.
In that case, how do their standard cars get away without it?The third rear brake light has to be legally at a certain height. Because of the rear slope of the car the visibility of the rear window would be further reduced by a window mounted brake light.
There was only the solution of a body mounted one but the designers did not want to put grooves into the rear body surface. So one decided on a rear spoiler (that was recommended by the aerodynmics department anyway) that would carry the third rear brake light.
This is first hand Jag info. Hard to believe but this is how things come about.
Without regulations about a third brake light there would be no rear spoiler. This is how regulations screw up design.
Creating downforce with minimal drag is still a problem manufacturers seem to suffer with, when i go past Boxsters on the motorway who are cruising along at 75 i do wonder how much money they are wasting because of the extra drag caused by their electric spoiler that has popped up. The same could be said for the rear wing on this thing the problem is you don't want it as a fixed part but an electric part is flawed too. i'm surprised we don't see more roof / back window spoilers similar (if not as lairy) to the Escort Cosworth.
toppstuff said:
I just have a major dislike of tacked on spoilers on road cars. They are a lazy, predictable engineering solution when a car needs a mid-life facelift and the bean counters won't spend the money on engineering a proper , more elegant alternative.
It's not appropriate for a Jaguar.
Edited to add: I am not a traditionalist ! I favour and welcome the new Jaguars. But I am disappointed at the lazy use of a tacked on spoiler. It is ugly and unnecessary.
Looking at this, I rest my case:
No it was more the arrogance that if someone liked what you didn't it then made them an idiot.
As for the tacked on look. How do you know that wasn't intended to make it look more specifically different?
And while you're on the subject of past Jaguar's and in-keeping. These seemed to do fairly well with an equally tacked on aero aid:
Or maybe one of these:
It's not appropriate for a Jaguar.
Edited to add: I am not a traditionalist ! I favour and welcome the new Jaguars. But I am disappointed at the lazy use of a tacked on spoiler. It is ugly and unnecessary.
Looking at this, I rest my case:
No it was more the arrogance that if someone liked what you didn't it then made them an idiot.As for the tacked on look. How do you know that wasn't intended to make it look more specifically different?
And while you're on the subject of past Jaguar's and in-keeping. These seemed to do fairly well with an equally tacked on aero aid:
Or maybe one of these:
Edited by toppstuff on Thursday 21st April 10:50
300bhp/ton said:
Hey, surely you can spot someone being deliberately provocative in order to stimulate debate ! Anyway, the D type is lovely because the wing is an integral part of the design. But the spoiler on the XJS kind of proves my point. Surely Jaguar's 2011 flagship car can do better than simply sticking a bit of plastic on, in the same way they did in the 80's?
Aston manage without stuck on spoilers. So do Maserati. So should Jaguar.
If I wanted a car with spoilers I would get a GT3. I personally find them most unwelcome.
toppstuff said:
300bhp/ton said:
Hey, surely you can spot someone being deliberately provocative in order to stimulate debate ! Anyway, the D type is lovely because the wing is an integral part of the design. But the spoiler on the XJS kind of proves my point. Surely Jaguar's 2011 flagship car can do better than simply sticking a bit of plastic on, in the same way they did in the 80's?
Aston manage without stuck on spoilers. So do Maserati. So should Jaguar.
If I wanted a car with spoilers I would get a GT3. I personally find them most unwelcome.
I appreciate it serves a purpose, both aerodynamically and due to regulations, but a more subtle, sophisticated approach I feel would be more suitable. Just my 2p worth.
vintageracer01 said:
The third rear brake light has to be legally at a certain height. Because of the rear slope of the car the visibility of the rear window would be further reduced by a window mounted brake light.
There was only the solution of a body mounted one but the designers did not want to put grooves into the rear body surface. So one decided on a rear spoiler (that was recommended by the aerodynmics department anyway) that would carry the third rear brake light.
I think that applies to the standard XK and not only the XK-R-S (or is it XK-RS, or XKR-S?).There was only the solution of a body mounted one but the designers did not want to put grooves into the rear body surface. So one decided on a rear spoiler (that was recommended by the aerodynmics department anyway) that would carry the third rear brake light.
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