Engine oil, 0w 40 better than 5w 30 ? part or full synthetic
Discussion
I am about to service my Vivaro campervan, the recommended oil is 5w 30 but doesn't say part or fully synthetic.
Looking on euro car parts they recommend oils from 0w 40 fully synthetic to 5w30 part synthetic for the van.
Now being thinner at cooler temps and better performing at higher temp with the 0w40 rating I am guessing the fully synthetic 0w40 would be the best choice ? get round the turbo and engine quicker when cold, does a better job when hot on all those parts as well ?
The van does most of its mileage (6-8k a year) on motorways on long trips but it does do a few short trips of less than 2 miles each way to take the wife to the station 2 times a week (engine is fully warm when I turn round after dropping her off). This is why I am thinking of the thinner oil, help the engine parts on those cold morning she wants a lift.
Or should just buy cheap 5w30 part synthetic ( I change oil every year no matter how low the mileage ) and pocket the difference?
Any advise?
Looking on euro car parts they recommend oils from 0w 40 fully synthetic to 5w30 part synthetic for the van.
Now being thinner at cooler temps and better performing at higher temp with the 0w40 rating I am guessing the fully synthetic 0w40 would be the best choice ? get round the turbo and engine quicker when cold, does a better job when hot on all those parts as well ?
The van does most of its mileage (6-8k a year) on motorways on long trips but it does do a few short trips of less than 2 miles each way to take the wife to the station 2 times a week (engine is fully warm when I turn round after dropping her off). This is why I am thinking of the thinner oil, help the engine parts on those cold morning she wants a lift.
Or should just buy cheap 5w30 part synthetic ( I change oil every year no matter how low the mileage ) and pocket the difference?
Any advise?
Tampon said:
I am about to service my Vivaro campervan, the recommended oil is 5w 30 but doesn't say part or fully synthetic.
Looking on euro car parts they recommend oils from 0w 40 fully synthetic to 5w30 part synthetic for the van.
Now being thinner at cooler temps and better performing at higher temp with the 0w40 rating I am guessing the fully synthetic 0w40 would be the best choice ? get round the turbo and engine quicker when cold, does a better job when hot on all those parts as well ?
The van does most of its mileage (6-8k a year) on motorways on long trips but it does do a few short trips of less than 2 miles each way to take the wife to the station 2 times a week (engine is fully warm when I turn round after dropping her off). This is why I am thinking of the thinner oil, help the engine parts on those cold morning she wants a lift.
Or should just buy cheap 5w30 part synthetic ( I change oil every year no matter how low the mileage ) and pocket the difference?
Any advise?
I would just go for the basic oil of the right spec unless you tow with it Then it might benifit from the FS... Clean cheap oil is Better than dirty expensive oil so changing at about 5 k isn't a bad idea if you are going to keep it years...Looking on euro car parts they recommend oils from 0w 40 fully synthetic to 5w30 part synthetic for the van.
Now being thinner at cooler temps and better performing at higher temp with the 0w40 rating I am guessing the fully synthetic 0w40 would be the best choice ? get round the turbo and engine quicker when cold, does a better job when hot on all those parts as well ?
The van does most of its mileage (6-8k a year) on motorways on long trips but it does do a few short trips of less than 2 miles each way to take the wife to the station 2 times a week (engine is fully warm when I turn round after dropping her off). This is why I am thinking of the thinner oil, help the engine parts on those cold morning she wants a lift.
Or should just buy cheap 5w30 part synthetic ( I change oil every year no matter how low the mileage ) and pocket the difference?
Any advise?
Definitely keeping her, so want to look after her as best as possible. That why I was thinking about the cold short trips and trying to do my best prevent any damage.
She only has 45k on the clock so hopefully I can keep her running well a good while.
I dont mind spending the extra 10 quid for the better oil over the cheap stuff.
She only has 45k on the clock so hopefully I can keep her running well a good while.
I dont mind spending the extra 10 quid for the better oil over the cheap stuff.
Tampon said:
Definitely keeping her, so want to look after her as best as possible. That why I was thinking about the cold short trips and trying to do my best prevent any damage.
She only has 45k on the clock so hopefully I can keep her running well a good while.
I dont mind spending the extra 10 quid for the better oil over the cheap stuff.
Well it won't do any harm and tenner isn't much ...7She only has 45k on the clock so hopefully I can keep her running well a good while.
I dont mind spending the extra 10 quid for the better oil over the cheap stuff.
I'd stick with mfrs recommendations.
Not sure how many instances / how apocryphal, but there was quite a stir on CTR forums a few years back about Mobil-1 0W- oil, and bottom-end failures allegedly because the oil was too thin and not providing enough lubrication (for an admittedly high-revving engine). Those using 5W- oils never seemed to have any problems...
That said, it IS worth going for an ester-based synthetic, rather than the so called mass-market synthetics (actually cracked mineral oil). Have a gander around the Opie Oils website for starters.
Not sure how many instances / how apocryphal, but there was quite a stir on CTR forums a few years back about Mobil-1 0W- oil, and bottom-end failures allegedly because the oil was too thin and not providing enough lubrication (for an admittedly high-revving engine). Those using 5W- oils never seemed to have any problems...
That said, it IS worth going for an ester-based synthetic, rather than the so called mass-market synthetics (actually cracked mineral oil). Have a gander around the Opie Oils website for starters.
The comments about a basic oil of the right spec are kinda true, depending upon what the manufacturer recommends.
Generally, engines are fairly adaptable to oils, or at least used to be - however these days there are a number of engines that MUST have the exact spec of oil that the manufacturer recommends, in order to not die a horrible death anytime soon.
Check your handbook.
If it's a wee bit vague, then it might be worth doing a wider internet search, finding a more specialist forum dedicated to your particular model. Normally specific forums are a great source of information.
Finally - my rather generalised comments on your question: as you say, a 0w oil is thinner when cold than a 5w oil - hence will circulate around the engine and turbo bearing a wee bit quicker on start-up. And a 40 compared to a 30 has a higher viscosity that GENERALLY may give a little more of a protection with regard to it's working film strength on some bearings.
But it depends upon what the designers were thinking of when designing the engine - the oil pump capacity, the size and location of internal oilways - everything really.
I would suggest that the grade and viscosity is relevent to the vehicle and the spec. However, one thing I have learned about oils, from over 25 years of motoring and nearly 10 years involved in racing and the engines thereof - it's always best to buy the best quality oil you can afford - and that a lot of oils are a triumph of marketing over substance.
It's always interesting to be involved in racing, and engine builders, and understand what actually works and what doesn't. A fascinating subject, and not for this thread!
Finally, have a search for the 'Opie Oils' sticky that lurks on this forum somewhere. The guys there seem to be absolutely on the ball for oil recommendations, and will happily answer your question I am sure.
All the best!
Generally, engines are fairly adaptable to oils, or at least used to be - however these days there are a number of engines that MUST have the exact spec of oil that the manufacturer recommends, in order to not die a horrible death anytime soon.
Check your handbook.
If it's a wee bit vague, then it might be worth doing a wider internet search, finding a more specialist forum dedicated to your particular model. Normally specific forums are a great source of information.
Finally - my rather generalised comments on your question: as you say, a 0w oil is thinner when cold than a 5w oil - hence will circulate around the engine and turbo bearing a wee bit quicker on start-up. And a 40 compared to a 30 has a higher viscosity that GENERALLY may give a little more of a protection with regard to it's working film strength on some bearings.
But it depends upon what the designers were thinking of when designing the engine - the oil pump capacity, the size and location of internal oilways - everything really.
I would suggest that the grade and viscosity is relevent to the vehicle and the spec. However, one thing I have learned about oils, from over 25 years of motoring and nearly 10 years involved in racing and the engines thereof - it's always best to buy the best quality oil you can afford - and that a lot of oils are a triumph of marketing over substance.
It's always interesting to be involved in racing, and engine builders, and understand what actually works and what doesn't. A fascinating subject, and not for this thread!
Finally, have a search for the 'Opie Oils' sticky that lurks on this forum somewhere. The guys there seem to be absolutely on the ball for oil recommendations, and will happily answer your question I am sure.
All the best!
I get oil for my vivaro from the Vauxhall dealer. I think it's 5w30 fully synthetic. I always get a reasonable price from them. You need quite a lot, 7L I think. Just get two gallons and save the extra for next time. You might get the same GM oil cheaper online but I can't be bothered with the hassle.
Cheers guys, yes the van has a easy life apart from those cold short runs, but I like looking after things.
If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
Tampon said:
Cheers guys, yes the van has a easy life apart from those cold short runs, but I like looking after things.
If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
If they change the oil every 3 months that would be no bad thing.If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
Better to have cheap clean oil than expensive dirty oil that's left in for a year.
egor110 said:
Better to have cheap clean oil than expensive dirty oil that's left in for a year.
Where's your proof for that? I think it's utter cobblers. Good quality fully synthetic is virtually indestructible. So long as the engine is hot for a good proportion of its life there won't be any condensation water in the oil.Just follow the manufacturer's recommendations.
Ozzie Osmond said:
egor110 said:
Better to have cheap clean oil than expensive dirty oil that's left in for a year.
Where's your proof for that? I think it's utter cobblers. Good quality fully synthetic is virtually indestructible. So long as the engine is hot for a good proportion of its life there won't be any condensation water in the oil.Just follow the manufacturer's recommendations.
Tampon said:
Cheers guys, yes the van has a easy life apart from those cold short runs, but I like looking after things.
If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
Best value you can get is go to your local Vauxhall dealer and see if you can buy the Vauxhall 5/30 fully synthetic stuff. It's very cheap, especially if you can get it on trade club or at trade price which a fair few dealers will do. I'm not sure if you'll get it for 20 quid, although it won't be far off.If the extra for the full synthetic might make small difference then it is worth it (28quid verses 20 with the discount code I have). Most people online on the forums seem to be builders who just stick in the cheapest they can find.
egor110 said:
If your changing it so often it can't be getting dirty as it's being replaced so often.
What you haven't explained is why "dirty" is "bad". One thing is sure, you can't judge the true condition of motor oil by looking at it. I'd rather have the real thing in there and looking a bit grubby than some pristine economy lubricant.Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
The comments about a basic oil of the right spec are kinda true, depending upon what the manufacturer recommends.
Generally, engines are fairly adaptable to oils, or at least used to be - however these days there are a number of engines that MUST have the exact spec of oil that the manufacturer recommends, in order to not die a horrible death anytime soon.
Check your handbook.
If it's a wee bit vague, then it might be worth doing a wider internet search, finding a more specialist forum dedicated to your particular model. Normally specific forums are a great source of information.
Finally - my rather generalised comments on your question: as you say, a 0w oil is thinner when cold than a 5w oil - hence will circulate around the engine and turbo bearing a wee bit quicker on start-up. And a 40 compared to a 30 has a higher viscosity that GENERALLY may give a little more of a protection with regard to it's working film strength on some bearings.
But it depends upon what the designers were thinking of when designing the engine - the oil pump capacity, the size and location of internal oilways - everything really.
I would suggest that the grade and viscosity is relevent to the vehicle and the spec. However, one thing I have learned about oils, from over 25 years of motoring and nearly 10 years involved in racing and the engines thereof - it's always best to buy the best quality oil you can afford - and that a lot of oils are a triumph of marketing over substance.
It's always interesting to be involved in racing, and engine builders, and understand what actually works and what doesn't. A fascinating subject, and not for this thread!
Finally, have a search for the 'Opie Oils' sticky that lurks on this forum somewhere. The guys there seem to be absolutely on the ball for oil recommendations, and will happily answer your question I am sure.
All the best!
Excellent and well-informed post! Interesting that you should say that modern engines are more susceptible - I did hear that all those noisy Pinto camshafts were caused by everybody using 20W 50 rather than the recommended 10W 30, meaning that not enough oil could get through the oil ways to the camshaft and its bearings,Generally, engines are fairly adaptable to oils, or at least used to be - however these days there are a number of engines that MUST have the exact spec of oil that the manufacturer recommends, in order to not die a horrible death anytime soon.
Check your handbook.
If it's a wee bit vague, then it might be worth doing a wider internet search, finding a more specialist forum dedicated to your particular model. Normally specific forums are a great source of information.
Finally - my rather generalised comments on your question: as you say, a 0w oil is thinner when cold than a 5w oil - hence will circulate around the engine and turbo bearing a wee bit quicker on start-up. And a 40 compared to a 30 has a higher viscosity that GENERALLY may give a little more of a protection with regard to it's working film strength on some bearings.
But it depends upon what the designers were thinking of when designing the engine - the oil pump capacity, the size and location of internal oilways - everything really.
I would suggest that the grade and viscosity is relevent to the vehicle and the spec. However, one thing I have learned about oils, from over 25 years of motoring and nearly 10 years involved in racing and the engines thereof - it's always best to buy the best quality oil you can afford - and that a lot of oils are a triumph of marketing over substance.
It's always interesting to be involved in racing, and engine builders, and understand what actually works and what doesn't. A fascinating subject, and not for this thread!
Finally, have a search for the 'Opie Oils' sticky that lurks on this forum somewhere. The guys there seem to be absolutely on the ball for oil recommendations, and will happily answer your question I am sure.
All the best!
OP, if it were me, I would stick to a 5W 30 and get a fully synthetic if you can afford it.
Ozzie Osmond said:
egor110 said:
If your changing it so often it can't be getting dirty as it's being replaced so often.
What you haven't explained is why "dirty" is "bad". One thing is sure, you can't judge the true condition of motor oil by looking at it. I'd rather have the real thing in there and looking a bit grubby than some pristine economy lubricant.I certainly don't think it's wise or even cost effective to use cheap oil and change it more regularly. Besides, 5w30 synthetic aids fuel economy due to its low viscosity. You wouldn't use it in a racing engine but it does the job in a relatively low powered engine with roller cam followers. These engines are designed for low viscosity synthetic oil.
I went for the 0w 40 fully synthetic, drove the van this morning and was wincing at the though of thick oil on a really cold morning getting round the lump of diesel engine and then the turbo spinning away.
In the end new disks and pads ( pagid ) filters and oil and coolant came to £135, chuck in the bleeding kit and turkey baster and a grand total of £140 to give the van a good winter service.
In the end new disks and pads ( pagid ) filters and oil and coolant came to £135, chuck in the bleeding kit and turkey baster and a grand total of £140 to give the van a good winter service.
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