991.1 GTS Manual - why hasn't this sold?
Discussion
I seldom post - usually only when considering a new purchase. Interesting cars owned previously comprise: S1 106 Rallye, Clio Trophy, S2 Elise, M3 CS, 996 C2 and a 1M (20,000 miles of happy motoring and £250 of depreciation). Current car is a C63 estate - hugely fast and sounds great considering its a turbo but its a bit of a barge (unsurprising given its an estate).
Keen to get back into something truly special instead of the C63 and I started thinking about a manual 997 GTS before extensively researching the 991.1 GTS. I want something involving and full of character in everyday situations as the right road at the right time is rare. The C63 is my first auto and whilst its fine using the paddles when pressing on its not exactly a tactile experience. A 991.1 GTS in manual form looks like its modern, practical and clearly an NA engine/manual is a combo that doesn't exist in the 911 range anymore - certainly not if rear seats are desired.
A Carrera T could be an option and the reviews suggest they are greater than the sum of the parts. The lower power would make it more accessible but the GTS must clearly win in the aural stakes. From a chronology perspective a GTS followed by at T for variety could be interesting.
Anyway, having done my usual trick of seeking a model that is not in plentiful supply I have been tracking the market on a daily basis for the last month or so and there are next to no cars available. This is the only manual C2 GTS for sale at present:
https://www.tieroneautomotive.co.uk/vehicle-detail...
It has been available since at least mid December. Given the praise the model generates I am puzzled as to why it hasn't sold. I have seen conflicting advice regarding GTS's being spec. sensitive but it has the GTS pack. The lack of parking sensors looks a daft omission but save for that I cannot see anything wrong. Low miles and existing Porsche warranty are a boon.
Am I missing something?
Alternatively, if anyone is looking to move their GTS on let me know....
Keen to get back into something truly special instead of the C63 and I started thinking about a manual 997 GTS before extensively researching the 991.1 GTS. I want something involving and full of character in everyday situations as the right road at the right time is rare. The C63 is my first auto and whilst its fine using the paddles when pressing on its not exactly a tactile experience. A 991.1 GTS in manual form looks like its modern, practical and clearly an NA engine/manual is a combo that doesn't exist in the 911 range anymore - certainly not if rear seats are desired.
A Carrera T could be an option and the reviews suggest they are greater than the sum of the parts. The lower power would make it more accessible but the GTS must clearly win in the aural stakes. From a chronology perspective a GTS followed by at T for variety could be interesting.
Anyway, having done my usual trick of seeking a model that is not in plentiful supply I have been tracking the market on a daily basis for the last month or so and there are next to no cars available. This is the only manual C2 GTS for sale at present:
https://www.tieroneautomotive.co.uk/vehicle-detail...
It has been available since at least mid December. Given the praise the model generates I am puzzled as to why it hasn't sold. I have seen conflicting advice regarding GTS's being spec. sensitive but it has the GTS pack. The lack of parking sensors looks a daft omission but save for that I cannot see anything wrong. Low miles and existing Porsche warranty are a boon.
Am I missing something?
Alternatively, if anyone is looking to move their GTS on let me know....
jh106 said:
I seldom post - usually only when considering a new purchase. Interesting cars owned previously comprise: S1 106 Rallye, Clio Trophy, S2 Elise, M3 CS, 996 C2 and a 1M (20,000 miles of happy motoring and £250 of depreciation). Current car is a C63 estate - hugely fast and sounds great considering its a turbo but its a bit of a barge (unsurprising given its an estate).
Keen to get back into something truly special instead of the C63 and I started thinking about a manual 997 GTS before extensively researching the 991.1 GTS. I want something involving and full of character in everyday situations as the right road at the right time is rare. The C63 is my first auto and whilst its fine using the paddles when pressing on its not exactly a tactile experience. A 991.1 GTS in manual form looks like its modern, practical and clearly an NA engine/manual is a combo that doesn't exist in the 911 range anymore - certainly not if rear seats are desired.
A Carrera T could be an option and the reviews suggest they are greater than the sum of the parts. The lower power would make it more accessible but the GTS must clearly win in the aural stakes. From a chronology perspective a GTS followed by at T for variety could be interesting.
Anyway, having done my usual trick of seeking a model that is not in plentiful supply I have been tracking the market on a daily basis for the last month or so and there are next to no cars available. This is the only manual C2 GTS for sale at present:
https://www.tieroneautomotive.co.uk/vehicle-detail...
It has been available since at least mid December. Given the praise the model generates I am puzzled as to why it hasn't sold. I have seen conflicting advice regarding GTS's being spec. sensitive but it has the GTS pack. The lack of parking sensors looks a daft omission but save for that I cannot see anything wrong. Low miles and existing Porsche warranty are a boon.
Am I missing something?
Alternatively, if anyone is looking to move their GTS on let me know....
I looked at this, think its a great car but didn’t want white, i got a black 997 instead. Agree with a lot of your points, they are getting harder to find with low mileage.Keen to get back into something truly special instead of the C63 and I started thinking about a manual 997 GTS before extensively researching the 991.1 GTS. I want something involving and full of character in everyday situations as the right road at the right time is rare. The C63 is my first auto and whilst its fine using the paddles when pressing on its not exactly a tactile experience. A 991.1 GTS in manual form looks like its modern, practical and clearly an NA engine/manual is a combo that doesn't exist in the 911 range anymore - certainly not if rear seats are desired.
A Carrera T could be an option and the reviews suggest they are greater than the sum of the parts. The lower power would make it more accessible but the GTS must clearly win in the aural stakes. From a chronology perspective a GTS followed by at T for variety could be interesting.
Anyway, having done my usual trick of seeking a model that is not in plentiful supply I have been tracking the market on a daily basis for the last month or so and there are next to no cars available. This is the only manual C2 GTS for sale at present:
https://www.tieroneautomotive.co.uk/vehicle-detail...
It has been available since at least mid December. Given the praise the model generates I am puzzled as to why it hasn't sold. I have seen conflicting advice regarding GTS's being spec. sensitive but it has the GTS pack. The lack of parking sensors looks a daft omission but save for that I cannot see anything wrong. Low miles and existing Porsche warranty are a boon.
Am I missing something?
Alternatively, if anyone is looking to move their GTS on let me know....
That car was on sale when I bought my 991.2 GTS back in October last year (albeit it was around £82k at the time). My view would be if you want a 991.1 GTS in manual then check it out as it could be a perfect buy. However, if you want a specific colour or a certain spec (eg Parking sensors, Bose etc) as a lot of buyers do then you may be put off (i suspect this is the reason it hasn’t sold at that price)
Edited by harry76 on Saturday 6th February 00:27
jh106 said:
I seldom post - usually only when considering a new purchase. Interesting cars owned previously comprise: S1 106 Rallye, Clio Trophy, S2 Elise, M3 CS, 996 C2 and a 1M (20,000 miles of happy motoring and £250 of depreciation). Current car is a C63 estate
This tickled me. Change your user name to Impeccable Taste Lurker 
We should be coming to you for advice!
If this car is for weekend fun then go with a 997 . The electric steering on the 991.1 is IMO not very good and really retracts from the fun. 991.2 steering is better but not half as good as 997. 997 GTS would be great fun and minimal depreciation though running costs might be higher due to being an older car. I have a 991.2 Manual S which is great for a daily but it no weekend car. I have an Elise for that.
997 and 991 are quite a different driving experience....I’ve got a Manual 997 GTS and a Manual 991.2 GT3...and have driven 991.2 GTS but not the .1, The width difference of the cars is minimal but the 997 feels a lot smaller primarily I think because the glasshouse is narrower. 997 definitely feels more tactile and in some cases less sophisticated. 997 chassis for me is a great set up for driving on UK country roads...enough compliance to deal with potholes etc but the 991 I think chassis has a greater range of ability still delivers the sporting drive but has more compliance.
I don’t know what the gearing is like in the 991.1 GTS but 997 GTS 2nd and 3rd are perfect ratios for pressing on at country road speeds.
What I do remember which really surprised me at the time is that when people traded in their 991.1 GTS’s for 991.2 GTS’s everyone on here much preferred the newer car...which surprised me because of losing the naturally aspirated engine.
Manual 997 GTS is for an “ordinary” 911 quite a special car for the money they command...it’s one of those cars they just got right. Which is why people don’t sell them.
I don’t know what the gearing is like in the 991.1 GTS but 997 GTS 2nd and 3rd are perfect ratios for pressing on at country road speeds.
What I do remember which really surprised me at the time is that when people traded in their 991.1 GTS’s for 991.2 GTS’s everyone on here much preferred the newer car...which surprised me because of losing the naturally aspirated engine.
Manual 997 GTS is for an “ordinary” 911 quite a special car for the money they command...it’s one of those cars they just got right. Which is why people don’t sell them.
991.1 GTS manual owner here (not for sale!)
I spent about 6 months searching for mine and from my experience they only pop up for sale at a a rate of one every couple of months, so depending on how long you are prepared to wait you may need to compromise on spec
They usually sell very quickly when they do come up so it is a bit strange that this one is hanging about.. its low mileage but still top money for a low spec car.. I think the only option it has is the GTS interior pack
I had a 997S manual for 5 years before getting mine 2 years ago and they are very different cars but I absolutely love mine and think it’s the perfect all rounder. Yes the steering on the 997 is better but as an overall package the 991.1 wins hands down for me
I spent about 6 months searching for mine and from my experience they only pop up for sale at a a rate of one every couple of months, so depending on how long you are prepared to wait you may need to compromise on spec
They usually sell very quickly when they do come up so it is a bit strange that this one is hanging about.. its low mileage but still top money for a low spec car.. I think the only option it has is the GTS interior pack
I had a 997S manual for 5 years before getting mine 2 years ago and they are very different cars but I absolutely love mine and think it’s the perfect all rounder. Yes the steering on the 997 is better but as an overall package the 991.1 wins hands down for me
Thanks for the various responses. Interesting to note the relative dislike of white. It's not my first choice but waiting for the perfect colour and spec. could be a very long wait.
People's love of the 997 GTS is noted. This will be my everyday car including subjecting my children to the joy of being crammed into the back (never did me any harm......) so the marginally greater space of a 991 is a consideration. If a cracking C2 997 GTS pops up then never say never but I expect that's even less likely to happen than a 991.1....
Having thought about it some more I am not feeling it in relation to the one I mentioned. Despite my thoughts re an NA engine I have been watching more youtube reviews re the 991.2 GTS. Chieb's positive comments regarding people switching to the newer car were also interesting. One of the thing's I liked about my 1M was the power delivery and low down torque. I had an M3 CS prior and whilst that was great at the upper reaches of the rev range it wasn't easy to find such opportunities. Presumably the flat and plentiful torque curve of the 991.2 goes at least someway to compensating for a more muted soundtrack?
Anyway - that got me thinking about the 991.2 GTS that 911 Virgin have ( https://911virgin.com/listings/991-2-gts-manual-co...
It's also white but for some reason it looks more attractive than the other one. It's specified with the foldable buckets which makes the interior look pretty special. I note that not everyone gets on with them but they do look great. Q - do they make accessing the rear seats a complete pain and impinge upon the rear footwell/passenger space? The unique appeal of a 911 is the practicality and whilst ultimately its a 2+2, if such seats compromise the rear that wouldn't work. I know that running a 911 as an everyday car entails a compromise but saving such a car for high days and holidays only would seem like a waste. They are of course built for driving.......
People's love of the 997 GTS is noted. This will be my everyday car including subjecting my children to the joy of being crammed into the back (never did me any harm......) so the marginally greater space of a 991 is a consideration. If a cracking C2 997 GTS pops up then never say never but I expect that's even less likely to happen than a 991.1....
Having thought about it some more I am not feeling it in relation to the one I mentioned. Despite my thoughts re an NA engine I have been watching more youtube reviews re the 991.2 GTS. Chieb's positive comments regarding people switching to the newer car were also interesting. One of the thing's I liked about my 1M was the power delivery and low down torque. I had an M3 CS prior and whilst that was great at the upper reaches of the rev range it wasn't easy to find such opportunities. Presumably the flat and plentiful torque curve of the 991.2 goes at least someway to compensating for a more muted soundtrack?
Anyway - that got me thinking about the 991.2 GTS that 911 Virgin have ( https://911virgin.com/listings/991-2-gts-manual-co...
It's also white but for some reason it looks more attractive than the other one. It's specified with the foldable buckets which makes the interior look pretty special. I note that not everyone gets on with them but they do look great. Q - do they make accessing the rear seats a complete pain and impinge upon the rear footwell/passenger space? The unique appeal of a 911 is the practicality and whilst ultimately its a 2+2, if such seats compromise the rear that wouldn't work. I know that running a 911 as an everyday car entails a compromise but saving such a car for high days and holidays only would seem like a waste. They are of course built for driving.......
Don't be put off by white. I have had 2 991.1s in white and both were easy to sell. That is a very nice car and I believe the manual gearbox in the 991.2 was better than the 991.1?
How about a 997 CSR? I was thinking about your question this morning when this arrived on my YouTube feed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auKBC98sDB8
It's actually for sale on AutoTrader https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202011095...
for £83,995. I am very seriously considering something similar in the future...
How about a 997 CSR? I was thinking about your question this morning when this arrived on my YouTube feed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auKBC98sDB8
It's actually for sale on AutoTrader https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202011095...
for £83,995. I am very seriously considering something similar in the future...
Found this video too. Even if it's not your thing, these are excellent films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=AN...
Enjoy.
Tom
Enjoy.
Tom
White actually looks pretty good, but they are more common in white and so price sensitive. Manual is also less desirable for this model, so yes it's rarer but that doesn't make it more sought after.
It's hard to call a GTS poorly specced, because they came with quite a bit as standard, such that I think on this car almost everything (worth noting) is standard equipment apart from the GTS interior pack.
It's quite low mileage, but one has to ask is this really any different to a car with 18,000 miles on it...
So, yes it's overpriced, by about 7-10k which would reflect what I paid (after haggling) for a white GTS from Porsche OPC, with warranty until July 2023. 20k miles, slightly higher spec.
Hasn't sold because it's combo of,
- manual
- overpriced
- poor spec
It's hard to call a GTS poorly specced, because they came with quite a bit as standard, such that I think on this car almost everything (worth noting) is standard equipment apart from the GTS interior pack.
It's quite low mileage, but one has to ask is this really any different to a car with 18,000 miles on it...
So, yes it's overpriced, by about 7-10k which would reflect what I paid (after haggling) for a white GTS from Porsche OPC, with warranty until July 2023. 20k miles, slightly higher spec.
Hasn't sold because it's combo of,
- manual
- overpriced
- poor spec
Edited by beanoir on Monday 8th February 14:28
Probably because the colour and lack of Bose puts people off. Does have the interior package.
Slightly of topic, i have a 997.1 Carrera s and have been tempted by 991.2 gts, looking at the market was wondering if they' ever come down in price. I nearly took a brave pill and bought a 997.1 GT3 but missed the opportunity. It the same money for 997 GT3 and 991.2 GTS. Cannot make my mind up. Anyone?
Slightly of topic, i have a 997.1 Carrera s and have been tempted by 991.2 gts, looking at the market was wondering if they' ever come down in price. I nearly took a brave pill and bought a 997.1 GT3 but missed the opportunity. It the same money for 997 GT3 and 991.2 GTS. Cannot make my mind up. Anyone?
911 Roar said:
Probably because the colour and lack of Bose puts people off. Does have the interior package.
Slightly of topic, i have a 997.1 Carrera s and have been tempted by 991.2 gts, looking at the market was wondering if they' ever come down in price. I nearly took a brave pill and bought a 997.1 GT3 but missed the opportunity. It the same money for 997 GT3 and 991.2 GTS. Cannot make my mind up. Anyone?
I've previously owned a 997.1 GT3 and I am taking delivery of a 991.2 GTS next week so will be able to make a comparison then!Slightly of topic, i have a 997.1 Carrera s and have been tempted by 991.2 gts, looking at the market was wondering if they' ever come down in price. I nearly took a brave pill and bought a 997.1 GT3 but missed the opportunity. It the same money for 997 GT3 and 991.2 GTS. Cannot make my mind up. Anyone?
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