Last ever 911?

[bosshog]

So given Porsche have already stated their (road) cars will all be EV and the 911 platform won’t be EV when do we think the last iteration of the 911 will be. One more round ?

Gt4RS was the last harah for the ICE cayman so what’s the 911 last gasp.

[DMC2]

There will always be a 911, they are not going to let the heritage of that model die. That's why they have invested so much money into synthetic fuels.

[brake fader]

There is no doubt that the 911 will be the longest running production model ever made due to landrover ending production of the defender back in 2016. The 911 has indeed outlasted everything else and with 70% of them still running is just epic. Hail the 911 it has the lot the looks, speed ,handling, economy , practical, it's sublime in all forms.

[smudger911]

How Porsche are approaching sync fuels is mightily impressive imo. Partnering, investment, production ramp up and opening the door for its use in motorsport. All positive stuff.

[Slippydiff]

smudger911 said:

How Porsche are approaching sync fuels is mightily impressive imo. Partnering, investment, production ramp up and opening the door for its use in motorsport. All positive stuff.

Lets hope the huge amounts required will lead to the production costs being drastically reduced and the price to the end user likewise. Otherwise it'll be a blind alley.

[Koln-RS]

brake fader said:

There is no doubt that the 911 will be the longest running production model ever made due to landrover ending production of the defender back in 2016. The 911 has indeed outlasted everything else and with 70% of them still running is just epic. Hail the 911 it has the lot the looks, speed ,handling, economy , practical, it's sublime in all forms.

Although Porsche has maintained the ‘911’ nomenclature for nearly 60 years - the ‘original’ 911 was replaced with an all new model in 1997.

The cars thereafter are as different to the original as the latest Defender 90 is to a Series 1, or a current Mini to the Alec Issigonis design.

It’s only in the name and the design concept.

[Rich_AR]

Koln-RS said:

Although Porsche has maintained the ‘911’ nomenclature for nearly 60 years - the ‘original’ 911 was replaced with an all new model in 1997.

The cars thereafter are as different to the original as the latest Defender 90 is to a Series 1, or a current Mini to the Alec Issigonis design.

It’s only in the name and the design concept.

Not technically 'all new'... 993 parts (even with 993 part numbers) exist on the early 996's. Just saying

[CrunkleFloop]

Rich_AR said:

Koln-RS said:

Although Porsche has maintained the ‘911’ nomenclature for nearly 60 years - the ‘original’ 911 was replaced with an all new model in 1997.

The cars thereafter are as different to the original as the latest Defender 90 is to a Series 1, or a current Mini to the Alec Issigonis design.

It’s only in the name and the design concept.

Not technically 'all new'... 993 parts (even with 993 part numbers) exist on the early 996's. Just saying

Indeed, there were 911SC parts in the 964, which then had parts carried over to the 993, which had parts in the 996, which had parts in the 997....

Methinks Koln-RS simply doesn't like watercooling.

[politeperson]

Well, I am going to order another brand new 911 tomorrow,

By the time petrol and diesel have been replaced, I will be long gone.

Stratstone, here I come, I know exactly what I want! Just like my old one please.

[Gary C]

Koln-RS said:

Although Porsche has maintained the ‘911’ nomenclature for nearly 60 years - the ‘original’ 911 was replaced with an all new model in 1997.

The cars thereafter are as different to the original as the latest Defender 90 is to a Series 1, or a current Mini to the Alec Issigonis design.

It’s only in the name and the design concept.

I disagree

The last 911 was made in 1989.

Everything else was a 964 or 993 or a 996 or 997 or 991

[anonymous-user]

Gary C said:

I disagree

The last 911 was made in 1989.

Everything else was a 964 or 993 or a 996 or 997 or 991

Although Porsche still call them 911s and refer to the others as designation numbers eg 964, 993 etc. As they did with first 911 Turbo (930) that preceded them.

[Gary C]

Discombobulate said:

Gary C said:

I disagree

The last 911 was made in 1989.

Everything else was a 964 or 993 or a 996 or 997 or 991

Although Porsche still call them 911s and refer to the others as designation numbers eg 964, 993 etc. As they did with first 911 Turbo (930) that preceded them.

Yep, but the 3.2 was the last designated as 911.

[brake fader]

porsche claim the biggest change 85 % was when the 964 was designed , total redesign of the chassis doing away with torsion bar suspension and replacing it with damper / spring set up, ABS and power steering also featured, c4 and tiptronic introduced as well, this is where the origins of the 996 started, watercooled engines were a small change in comparison. But after all the changes the cars still look like 911's although a tad bloated after the 996/7.

[Gary C]

brake fader said:

porsche claim the biggest change 85 % was when the 964 was designed , total redesign of the chassis doing away with torsion bar suspension and replacing it with damper / spring set up, ABS and power steering also featured, c4 and tiptronic introduced as well, this is where the origins of the 996 started, watercooled engines were a small change in comparison. But after all the changes the cars still look like 911's although a tad bloated after the 996/7.

I agree, the 3.2's chassis is basically the one they produced from 1964 to 89

The last 3.2's though did steal a few minor 964 parts as they apparently stopped making some bits as they were coming down the production line. They have the plastic fuel filler bowl and the window surround.

[Cheib]

DMC2 said:

There will always be a 911, they are not going to let the heritage of that model die. That's why they have invested so much money into synthetic fuels.

If they can make synthetic fuels work economically (which requires huge scale) then the future is brighter than it currently looks. I think the future of the 911 depends on that project personally.

The very essence of a 911 is that it is rear engined….calling an EV roller skate with a 911 body slapped on top a 911 would be ridiculous.

Fingers crossed they make synthetic fuels work

[Koln-RS]

Cheib said:

Fingers crossed they make synthetic fuels work

Whilst this is a great hope, my understanding is that they are unlikely to work with older Petrol engines.
Perhaps Diesel, but more likely, all new ICE designs.

[trashbat]

brake fader said:

There is no doubt that the 911 will be the longest running production model ever made due to landrover ending production of the defender back in 2016. The 911 has indeed outlasted everything else and with 70% of them still running is just epic. Hail the 911 it has the lot the looks, speed ,handling, economy , practical, it's sublime in all forms.

Koln-RS said:

Although Porsche has maintained the ‘911’ nomenclature for nearly 60 years - the ‘original’ 911 was replaced with an all new model in 1997.

The cars thereafter are as different to the original as the latest Defender 90 is to a Series 1, or a current Mini to the Alec Issigonis design.

It’s only in the name and the design concept.

Even if you were going off the name, the Chevrolet Suburban has been going since 1934.

[Grantstown]

politeperson said:

Well, I am going to order another brand new 911 tomorrow,

By the time petrol and diesel have been replaced, I will be long gone.

Stratstone, here I come, I know exactly what I want! Just like my old one please.

Are you anticipating this will be a gen 2 by the time the car makes it to production?

[esotericar]

smudger911 said:

How Porsche are approaching sync fuels is mightily impressive imo. Partnering, investment, production ramp up and opening the door for its use in motorsport. All positive stuff.

It's awfully hard to imagine that Porsche can go it alone with synthetic fuels. Will surely need fairly wide adoption to be viable and can't see a huge amount of evidence for that? Well, for new cars. Synthetic fuels compatible with classics would have a certain amount of built-in demand. But would it really be all that much? Synthetic fuels certainly seem like a very good idea on several levels, but being a good idea doesn't mean it'll happen. So many vested interests at play and the broader industry and legislators around the world are all hell bent on battery electric.

The recent $75 million investment really only amounts to a symbolic amount in the context of the zillions that would be needed to really make it viable. Doubt it will happen in a manner that will save the flat six, the whole synthetic fuel thing, and Porsche will just have to slap the 911 brand on an EV eventually. But will be very happy if proven wrong!

[esotericar]

brake fader said:

porsche claim the biggest change 85 % was when the 964 was designed , total redesign of the chassis doing away with torsion bar suspension and replacing it with damper / spring set up, ABS and power steering also featured, c4 and tiptronic introduced as well, this is where the origins of the 996 started, watercooled engines were a small change in comparison. But after all the changes the cars still look like 911's although a tad bloated after the 996/7.

Porsche indeed claims.

964 is a tarted up 911 based on the same basic shell and air-cooled lump as the original. Has basically nothing to do with the 996, which was the first actually new car since the original.

The 996 was a huge change compared to any earlier 911. Monocoque, engine, electrical system, the lot, all clean sheet (bar the Mezger lump in a few models, obvs). And on a modern modular platform, too, shared with the Cayster. Front half of the car is essentially shared between 911 and Cayster of the day from 996 up to and including 991.2. OK, as facelifts go, the 964 was fairly full on and as you say brought a lot of new tech and features. But that's really what it was - a glorified facelift and not remotely comparable to the revolution, for better and worse, that was the 996.

I think in the end the 911 will be split into two 30-40 year eras, following the second of which it will be game over - in about 10 years from now? - the original and then everything from 996 onwards (even if the 991 was actually on a completely new platform it's conceptually a 996, just massively upgraded). I think whatever Porsche says, the 992 is on a modified 991 platform and at a guess Porsche won't do another new platform for the 911. So, in platform terms, that means just three for all time. The original, the 996 and the 991. 997 is of course a heavy facelift of the 996. But in many ways would think it does actually make sense to look it it as air cooled (well, oil cooled really, innit) and then everything else.