650s, reg Pzeros and understeer
Discussion
Second time on track, able to push much harder this time. Still on the regular Pzeros I bought the car with. Of course those have got to go.
My lap times were limited by understeer. Probably no surprise - great having a relatively light car, but that means it really needs downforce for the fronts to bite better.
Braking 101, brake hard before turning in and let the wing help the rears contribute to the braking, but then you have aggressively trail brake letting the wing retract and getting more bite from the fronts. I actullay thought I was getting more front end bite in Normal, as the car could rock forward under braking.
Still enjoying learning the car, but already well past my previous personal record (including an Atom) as the car really puts the power down well post-apex. Absolutely no turbo lag as the car knows to build and hold the boost while downshifting - very clever.
My lap times were limited by understeer. Probably no surprise - great having a relatively light car, but that means it really needs downforce for the fronts to bite better.
Braking 101, brake hard before turning in and let the wing help the rears contribute to the braking, but then you have aggressively trail brake letting the wing retract and getting more bite from the fronts. I actullay thought I was getting more front end bite in Normal, as the car could rock forward under braking.
Still enjoying learning the car, but already well past my previous personal record (including an Atom) as the car really puts the power down well post-apex. Absolutely no turbo lag as the car knows to build and hold the boost while downshifting - very clever.
12pack said:
Second time on track, able to push much harder this time. Still on the regular Pzeros I bought the car with. Of course those have got to go.
My lap times were limited by understeer. Probably no surprise - great having a relatively light car, but that means it really needs downforce for the fronts to bite better.
Braking 101, brake hard before turning in and let the wing help the rears contribute to the braking, but then you have aggressively trail brake letting the wing retract and getting more bite from the fronts. I actullay thought I was getting more front end bite in Normal, as the car could rock forward under braking.
Still enjoying learning the car, but already well past my previous personal record (including an Atom) as the car really puts the power down well post-apex. Absolutely no turbo lag as the car knows to build and hold the boost while downshifting - very clever.
Did you experiment with coming off the brakes a touch earlier and carrying more speed - I'm guessing the wing would retract and some weight would shift forwards as per normal mode?My lap times were limited by understeer. Probably no surprise - great having a relatively light car, but that means it really needs downforce for the fronts to bite better.
Braking 101, brake hard before turning in and let the wing help the rears contribute to the braking, but then you have aggressively trail brake letting the wing retract and getting more bite from the fronts. I actullay thought I was getting more front end bite in Normal, as the car could rock forward under braking.
Still enjoying learning the car, but already well past my previous personal record (including an Atom) as the car really puts the power down well post-apex. Absolutely no turbo lag as the car knows to build and hold the boost while downshifting - very clever.
Indeed that’s exactly what I meant by “aggressively trail braking”. Was still gaining confidence in carrying in more speed as I really, really didn’t want to put it in the barrier..
But don’t get me wrong, still was a darn sight faster than in my previous cars. Just commenting that the car understeers at the limit - more than I was used to with front engined cars. To be expected.
Indeed Pzeros gone soon. Do the PS4S rub on the rears as I’ve heard?
But don’t get me wrong, still was a darn sight faster than in my previous cars. Just commenting that the car understeers at the limit - more than I was used to with front engined cars. To be expected.
Indeed Pzeros gone soon. Do the PS4S rub on the rears as I’ve heard?
Edited by 12pack on Wednesday 24th April 20:07
I race Caterhams so know Oulton Park well. As much as I want to use cars on track, I think I would be nervous pushing a McLaren through Cascades or Island. So expensive if it goes wrong.....
In a 150bhp ish Caterham you can do 1:37 round the Island layout and 1:54 on International.
In a 150bhp ish Caterham you can do 1:37 round the Island layout and 1:54 on International.
Edited by CharlesElliott on Thursday 25th April 19:15
CharlesElliott said:
I race Caterhams so know Oulton Park well. As much as I want to use cars on track, I think I would be nervous pushing a McLaren through Cascades or Island. So expensive if it goes wrong.....
In a 150bhp ish Caterham you can do 1:37 round the Island layout and 1:54 on International.
Those numbers are tight. Indeed Oulton Park - even International- not the best track for a very fast road car. It’s just close to where I am and where I ran my Atom. But I’m doing better in the Mac than the Atom, just with so much absolute power and decent braking. And a lot better than the now classic V12V.In a 150bhp ish Caterham you can do 1:37 round the Island layout and 1:54 on International.
Edited by CharlesElliott on Thursday 25th April 19:15
At Silverstone this week I found trail braking into some corners very beneficial. Took me a few sessions to adapt, but particularly in the slower corners it helped get the nose in with a tighter line.
Most of my understeer was more taking too much speed into a corner and scrubbing it off on the front end, not good. P zeros were limiting factor. I’m eager to get better tyres to try on track.
Out of interest, what tyre temps were you getting and at what hot pressure?
Most of my understeer was more taking too much speed into a corner and scrubbing it off on the front end, not good. P zeros were limiting factor. I’m eager to get better tyres to try on track.
Out of interest, what tyre temps were you getting and at what hot pressure?
That was indeed my experience per my original post.
Didn’t monitor the pressures, but started with 30 / 34 psi. Temps 25 starting out but well above 30c after the first lap.
To reiterate, I was much faster than in any other car I’d driven, just not used to having so much understeer. Will be working on my trail-braking skills. Will be switching to better rubber soon. Pzeros almost done now anyway.
Didn’t monitor the pressures, but started with 30 / 34 psi. Temps 25 starting out but well above 30c after the first lap.
To reiterate, I was much faster than in any other car I’d driven, just not used to having so much understeer. Will be working on my trail-braking skills. Will be switching to better rubber soon. Pzeros almost done now anyway.
I was also at Silverstone this week and finished off my P Zeros, I have some Corsas to go on but I think Cup 2’s are the best bang for your buck for a combination of track and road but you can’t get them in 225
I have them on my Lotus and they work great on track and reasonable on road
I always trail brake in my Lotus and Just tried it with my 570 but lost rear end traction as tyres got hot .
I have them on my Lotus and they work great on track and reasonable on road
I always trail brake in my Lotus and Just tried it with my 570 but lost rear end traction as tyres got hot .
Rocketreid said:
I was also at Silverstone this week and finished off my P Zeros, I have some Corsas to go on but I think Cup 2’s are the best bang for your buck for a combination of track and road but you can’t get them in 225
I have them on my Lotus and they work great on track and reasonable on road
I always trail brake in my Lotus and Just tried it with my 570 but lost rear end traction as tyres got hot .
I think the rear wing in the super series is the difference. Can really feel it settling the rear, but then there’s less weight transfer for the fronts to bite and you have to trail brake. But you do get better overall stopping power with the rears helping.I have them on my Lotus and they work great on track and reasonable on road
I always trail brake in my Lotus and Just tried it with my 570 but lost rear end traction as tyres got hot .
Does your 570s also push out if you don’t trail brake?
12pack said:
I think the rear wing in the super series is the difference. Can really feel it settling the rear, but then there’s less weight transfer for the fronts to bite and you have to trail brake. But you do get better overall stopping power with the rears helping.
Does your 570s also push out if you don’t trail brake?
Yes I think you have a point , a wing does make a big difference particularly at a fast track like Silverstone .Does your 570s also push out if you don’t trail brake?
The rear is actually pretty well planted but certainly a bit of trail braking tends to bite the fronts in on the tighter bends
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