EV "charging"

[knk]

Have any manufacturers considered an easily replaceable battery pack which can be swapped quickly and easily?

Instead of charging at a charging station it could be designed to be replaced with a pre-charged pack at a drive-in "filling station", with the old power pack left to be charged for another customer. That could work well to assure that charging is done in the most economical and battery friendly manner.
I am sure technology for tracking and monitoring is easily up to it.

Those who want to can still charge at home or while waiting, but on long journeys a quick battery pack change could perhaps take the same time as fuelling a car with petrol or diesel.

[kambites]

knk said:

Have any manufacturers considered an easily replaceable battery pack which can be swapped quickly and easily?

Yes, it's been prototyped by a number of companies. However, it is a pretty difficult entineering challenge in real-world conditions (ie when the car is covered in road crud and all the bolts are rusted solid).

I think such a system taking hold would also seriously suppress battery technology because if the manufacturers have to use a standard pack to make it swappable, there would be no reason for them to spend money researching improvements.

Edited by kambites on Monday 17th February 13:37

[eybic]

I worked for Renault in around 2010 and they were looking into it as an option with their EV's with a quick drive in "service" swapping the battery for a fully charged one, not sure what came of it but it definitely has been looked at.

[jjwilde]

The Tesla model S supports it, Tesla set up stations, no one was interested. They preferred to just use the superchargers for 30mins. Tesla closed the project down.

Renault also tried it and it also failed (look up 'better place'). People seem to prefer to just have their own battery and stop for 30mins or so every 200-300miles.

Edited by jjwilde on Monday 17th February 14:44

[RichardM5]

Very cheesy and the music is incredibly irritating, but it shows it can be done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5V0vL3nnHY

[kambites]

RichardM5 said:

Very cheesy and the music is incredibly irritating, but it shows it can be done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5V0vL3nnHY

It shows it can be done in a very controlled environment but that was never the problem.

[sjg]

Technically possible, commercially a non-starter. It's sci-fi fantasy for people that can't let go of the petrol/diesel way of "filling up".

Edited by sjg on Monday 17th February 16:13

[SWoll]

jjwilde said:

The Tesla model S supports it, Tesla set up stations, no one was interested. They preferred to just use the superchargers for 30mins. Tesla closed the project down.

Renault also tried it and it also failed (look up 'better place'). People seem to prefer to just have their own battery and stop for 30mins or so every 200-300miles.

Edited by jjwilde on Monday 17th February 14:44

Or charge at home overnight 99% of the time and only supercharge for occasional longer trips. If I'm going 300 miles I will work in at least one 30 minute break for a leg stretch/coffee/toilet visit.

[SamR380]

That concept is no longer relevant, with the ability to charge at home before you leave and (if you have the right car and charging point) fill up 200 miles in the time it takes to have a coffee and a pee. 350kW charger points are available but I think the fastest charging cars can currently only manage 150kW.

Charging speeds have come a long way in the last five years and they're only getting faster.

[TheHat]

A great many people can't charge at home.

[smn159]

sjg said:

Technically possible, commercially a non-starter. It's sci-fi fantasy for people that can't let go to the petrol/diesel way of "filling up".

I had an EV for a couple of years and regularly undertook journeys in excess of its range. You adapt quickly to the need to charge up for 30 mins or so every now and then - never an issue.

[kambites]

TheHat said:

A great many people can't charge at home.

In the log run it'll be far cheaper to change that than to make every car capable of reliable automatic battery swapping.

[TheHat]

kambites said:

In the log run it'll be far cheaper to change that than to make every car capable of reliable automatic battery swapping.

I just can't see how we will get the infrastructure in place. There is zero off street parking in hundreds of houses in our village alone.

[Willow1212]

TheHat said:

I just can't see how we will get the infrastructure in place. There is zero off street parking in hundreds of houses in our village alone.

Yes, not everyone is going to be able to charge at home, I don't think anyone is saying it will be possible for 100% of people to do that.
But no one has a petrol pump at home. If 60% of people can charge at home (or work) by the time everyone is in an EV (2050?) then that's 60% of people that will rarely/never need to use any public charging networks, which makes it all the more achievable to build that network for the ~40% of people who do need it, i.e. those who can't charge at home/work or who do longer distances.

[Heres Johnny]

jjwilde said:

The Tesla model S supports it, Tesla set up stations, no one was interested. They preferred to just use the superchargers for 30mins. Tesla closed the project down.

Renault also tried it and it also failed (look up 'better place'). People seem to prefer to just have their own battery and stop for 30mins or so every 200-300miles.

Edited by jjwilde on Monday 17th February 14:44

Not sure "nobody was interested" - it was more a case of it not being viable, how to manage the 12 different battery packs Tesla have made, what happens as warranty starts running out etc etc so they didn;t implement it,

Tesle have given up on the idea totally as the M3 battery can only be removed by undoing fixings within the car, the Ms and MX battery can be removed and replaced totally from beneath the car.

[PSB1]

TheHat said:

kambites said:

In the log run it'll be far cheaper to change that than to make every car capable of reliable automatic battery swapping.

I just can't see how we will get the infrastructure in place. There is zero off street parking in hundreds of houses in our village alone.

I think in the long run it will be either:

1) Own / rent a property with off-street parking: EV market will cater for you.

2) Own / rent a property in one of the many locations with no dedicated parking: You'll have to settle for a subscription service.

Car ownership will be a privilege.

[blueacid]

TheHat said:

I just can't see how we will get the infrastructure in place. There is zero off street parking in hundreds of houses in our village alone.

Well, that's it, stop the sale of all electric cars, someone in a village can't charge it.

I suspect in all honesty that there won't be a 'master' plan, taxes on petrol and diesel will continue to rise, older ICE vehicles will be restricted from going to more and more towns and cities, those who can run an electric car will start to do so.

By that point, who knows, maybe there'll be RFID/Contactless charge points in a few places down the streets in your village, or there'll be a few rapid chargers found nearby. However, I suspect that the sales and adoption of EV won't really slow down; at present they're selling pretty rapidly.

It'll be rather like the 4G or 5G rollout. Enough people can get 4G now that phones with 4G & generous data allowances are the norm. They're still on sale, even despite 100% coverage not yet being accomplished.