EV repairs, simpler than you might think!

[anonymous-user]

I've being say for a while now that second hand EVs are a great buy compared to ICE because they not only tell you exactly how worn out they are (thanks to accurate monitoring of ech battery cell by the battery management system) but that they shoudl also be a lot cheaper to repair because of their mechanical simplicity comnpared to modern ICE vehicles. And here's a good example:

EV James and Kate
Electric Car Battery - Dead After 3 Years, Right??


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ws9Y1be8N-U


2 hours for the complete job to replace a failed battery cell in this 2011 Leaf. Ok, the leaf thanks to it's aircooled battery is a little bit simpler to work on that most EVs that have liquid cooled batteries, but still, compared to say changing a clutch or DMF, let alone say a piston or main bearing on an ICE, the repair is extremely simple and straight foward, and critically, the diagnositics tool pinpoints the EXACT cell that requires changing.

[motco]

Provided that you steer clear of the c.400Vd.c. hazards! There might be some useful hints in this video too.

[chrisgeary]

That's the first genuinely useful video I've seen from James and Kate.

[kambites]

I'd guess this is one advantage in Nissan's decisions to go with passively cooled batteries - no need to faff about with disconnecting then re-connecting and bleeding the cooling system... but even if you had to do that, it would still be a perfectly managable job.

[mgv8]

As said there is risk and dealing with plugging in batteries in a very high current system. You also need to check the system is happy with what you have done and that will take some know how and a laptop. Having said that with no spark plugs, oil, one or two speed gearbox e.t.c life is a lot easier.

[Smiljan]

It's not really a DIY proposition unless you have a 4 post lift but good to see it's not that complicated. I'm not sure stuff like the Tesla's , I-Pace etc will be quite so simple in the long future when they need attention especially when Tesla start making batteries an integral part of the cars frame.

[kambites]

Smiljan said:

It's not really a DIY proposition unless you have a 4 post lift but good to see it's not that complicated. I'm not sure stuff like the Tesla's , I-Pace etc will be quite so simple in the long future when they need attention especially when Tesla start making batteries an integral part of the cars frame.

We can vote with our feet. If a car manufacturer makes a car which is impossible or prohibitively expensive to service, don't buy it.

For me, serviceability is a significant factor in any remotely expensive purchase I make.

[Mikebentley]

That was really informative and well made. It does show that a good independent EV specialist is going to be a requirement for many of us. It wouldn’t be a bad business to get into now nice and early. No oil and grease and much more clinical.

[lost in espace]

On a facebook group page I am a member of there is outrage because Nissan are not honouring the warranty on the 30kwh Leaf's. Someone paid #135 for a diagnostic as he had dropped to 8 bars. Nissan are supposed to restore to 9. Nissan dealer said it was wear and tear and Nissan have removed the warranty condition from their website. We are seeing hefty degredation on 30kwh batteries, I am down to 80% after 3.5 years and 50k. Should have kept my 24kwh.

[kambites]

Smiljan said:

It's not really a DIY proposition unless you have a 4 post lift but good to see it's not that complicated. .

It would take longer, but I reckon you could do that on axle stands. I've removed entire drive-trains from front engined RWD cars on axle stands which arguably needs more wiggle room than a nice flat square battery pack.

[Smiljan]

You probably could at a push but you’d have to get the whole car very high to get some sort of trolley under it to lower and the raise the pack. Not something I’d relish doing without a lift.

[HustleRussell]

9 years and 46,400 miles- £500 in cost to replace two cell modules and make the car work again. Fair enough.

Compares favourably to changing a clutch.

Although an ICE car doesn’t have 46 more clutches...

[kev b]

A chap I know has a 2008 Civic hybrid with 80K miles, a few cells are gone but they are not individually monitored.

This means stripping down the whole battery to identify the dodgy cells, however, replacing them with new ones still means the cells are unbalanced which is not ideal.

The only way to fix it properly is a new battery at £1300, who is going to put £1300 into an old Honda?

[kambites]

Smiljan said:

You probably could at a push but you’d have to get the whole car very high to get some sort of trolley under it to lower and the raise the pack. Not something I’d relish doing without a lift.

I think you'd raise the car rather than lowering the pack. Jack the car up, disconnect everything, drop the car back down so the pack is resting on bricks, unbolt the pack, jack the car back up leaving the pack behind.

[kambites]

kev b said:

A chap I know has a 2008 Civic hybrid with 80K miles, a few cells are gone but they are not individually monitored.

This means stripping down the whole battery to identify the dodgy cells, however, replacing them with new ones still means the cells are unbalanced which is not ideal.

The only way to fix it properly is a new battery at £1300, who is going to put £1300 into an old Honda?

Sadly there are plenty of poorly designed cars, regardless of the technology underlying them.

[Smiljan]

kambites said:

Smiljan said:

You probably could at a push but you’d have to get the whole car very high to get some sort of trolley under it to lower and the raise the pack. Not something I’d relish doing without a lift.

I think you'd raise the car rather than lowering the pack. Jack the car up, disconnect everything, drop the car back down so the pack is resting on bricks, unbolt the pack, jack the car back up leaving the pack behind.

Sounds so easy, now you have a car disabled on axle stands with a several hundred kilo pack sat on bricks underneath it. Now what?

It's not insurmountable but I don't think it's quite as simple a diy job as you're making out.

[untakenname]

They are using an old Leaf which isn't representative of modern EV's, EV's right now are in the same state that laptops were a decade ago where you could access them without any special tools or heatguns, in the near future manufacturers will move away from using standard 21700 cells and start using larger sealed units that are ultrasonically welded so it will be a case of replacing the whole unit rather than individual banks.

I notice on my phone insurance that any repairs made to them need to be made at a manufacturer authorised repair centre and I assume the same will be a condition for car insurance, they don't want people bodging repairs with recycled/reconditioned batteries from china causing the car to combust in a multistory car park.

Edited by untakenname on Thursday 29th October 11:19

[Heres Johnny]

"Simple" is a relative term but here's a Tesla battery being fixed for much less than a replacement battery

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH2bVWbsKWQ

[kambites]

Smiljan said:

Sounds so easy, now you have a car disabled on axle stands with a several hundred kilo pack sat on bricks underneath it. Now what?

So shove a skateboard under it instead of bricks (OK maybe something a bit stronger than a kid's stakeboard).

Some decent casters and some bits of 4x2 will make you a perfectly adequate trolley for a 24kwh Leaf. Maybe not for a 100kwh Tesla, though.

ETA: I guess the equipment for dealing with big heavy battery packs will become roughly as common as, say, an engine hoist is today.

Edited by kambites on Thursday 29th October 12:58

[granada203028]

Very interesting. Shame they didn't go on to dismantle the duff cells. Presumably the pouch seals failed allowing electrolyte to come in contact between both the cell plates and case causing the ground fault.

So an unusual failure not a ware out issue.