Who's looking forward to EV sheds?
Discussion
I love engines, manual gearboxes and all the other PH clichés, but I'm looking forward to cheap used EVs – are you?
A low-maintenance runabout with minimal running costs sounds great. I've been eyeing Leaf prices for a while and they've dropped to around £4k at the low end, but haven't budged from there for a while.
That gets you one of the early very short-range models, but that wouldn't necessarily matter for a car that only gets used for shopping trips, walking the dog and so forth.
I guess the question is, when will they get into shed territory? With demand for EVs only increasing I'm wondering if they'll ever go sub-£2k.
A low-maintenance runabout with minimal running costs sounds great. I've been eyeing Leaf prices for a while and they've dropped to around £4k at the low end, but haven't budged from there for a while.
That gets you one of the early very short-range models, but that wouldn't necessarily matter for a car that only gets used for shopping trips, walking the dog and so forth.
I guess the question is, when will they get into shed territory? With demand for EVs only increasing I'm wondering if they'll ever go sub-£2k.
Until battery supply as new makes old batteries signficantly valuable, then no EV will ever be a shed imo! There are so many second life uses, from classic car EV converisions, to DIY powerwalls and other projects that need battery storage.
When there are 10 million EVs on our roads, and there is a supply of cheap batteries, then EV's become sheds. I think we are talking roundabout 2030 if i had to guess
(and this assumes there isn't some form of battery revolution, which because EVs are intrinsically agnostic to the source of their electricity means you could fit a new, "better tech" battery to your old EV and really it's go for another 10 years!
When there are 10 million EVs on our roads, and there is a supply of cheap batteries, then EV's become sheds. I think we are talking roundabout 2030 if i had to guess
(and this assumes there isn't some form of battery revolution, which because EVs are intrinsically agnostic to the source of their electricity means you could fit a new, "better tech" battery to your old EV and really it's go for another 10 years!
One of Jalopnik's writers has been running a Sheddy Nissan Leaf he bought for US$2000. The range isn't great after 10 years, but he's using it and writing about it.
There should be quite a lot of these on the market soon, and 100 miles of urban/suburban range for Shed money is getting quite close.
There should be quite a lot of these on the market soon, and 100 miles of urban/suburban range for Shed money is getting quite close.
Europa Jon said:
Until the battery costs drop hugely, a second hand EV will be worth lots more than your average ICE shed. I do love the idea of a scabby Tesla Model S for a couple of grand though...
No chance of that but even at £30k for an S between 2012 and 2016, those models came with free Supercharging for life (yes free fuel forever).I have a Model 3 but am seriously tempted to have a go at a sub £30k that's a bit scabby. They are the Brave Pill of the EV shed
There was a sub £3k Leaf last year, I think with 9 battery bars left. They become worth more in parts (particularly the battery pack) at this sort of level - don't hold your breath for sub-£1k EVs.
Trouble is, there's so few of these early EVs and enough demand that prices are kept high. Sales of all EVs was low thousands per year (2016 was the first year they cracked 10k EV sales in the UK - soon it'll be that many per month), loads of them are still doing the job for their owners, so a tiny pool of cheaper cars to choose from. In the meantime, loads of people now have friends, colleagues, family, neighbours with EVs that they're happy with, the 2030 deadline is in the news, the older EVs haven't degraded as much as many feared, and people want the cheap motoring, no tax, no congestion charge without spending Tesla money.
I think even at £5k a Leaf makes a decent case for itself. Not flashy but reliable, that battery pack may not handle heat very well but it's modular and repairable, the rest of it is robust. As a second/third/station car that you don't need to care too much about, that's relaxing in traffic, that's warm on a cold winter morning and saves you about £100 per 1000 miles in fuel there's a lot to like.
Trouble is, there's so few of these early EVs and enough demand that prices are kept high. Sales of all EVs was low thousands per year (2016 was the first year they cracked 10k EV sales in the UK - soon it'll be that many per month), loads of them are still doing the job for their owners, so a tiny pool of cheaper cars to choose from. In the meantime, loads of people now have friends, colleagues, family, neighbours with EVs that they're happy with, the 2030 deadline is in the news, the older EVs haven't degraded as much as many feared, and people want the cheap motoring, no tax, no congestion charge without spending Tesla money.
I think even at £5k a Leaf makes a decent case for itself. Not flashy but reliable, that battery pack may not handle heat very well but it's modular and repairable, the rest of it is robust. As a second/third/station car that you don't need to care too much about, that's relaxing in traffic, that's warm on a cold winter morning and saves you about £100 per 1000 miles in fuel there's a lot to like.
Some good comments re batteries, I guess it's unreasonable to further price drops anytime soon.
NNH said:
One of Jalopnik's writers has been running a Sheddy Nissan Leaf he bought for US$2000. The range isn't great after 10 years, but he's using it and writing about it.
I read that at that time and then completely forgot about it, will have to revisit!Toaster Pilot said:
I think I just bought about as close as you’re going to get - a £2750 inc vat Kangoo ZE.
£0 tax and MOT exempt make for a compelling shed. Shame about the battery lease mind.
Yeah, battery leases kinda kill the shedding side of it for me. £0 tax and MOT exempt make for a compelling shed. Shame about the battery lease mind.
I wasn't aware of the MOT loophole but have they not closed that anyway? Cursory googling suggests they have. How on earth did you find one so cheap anyway?
MajorMantra said:
Yeah, battery leases kinda kill the shedding side of it for me.
I wasn't aware of the MOT loophole but have they not closed that anyway? Cursory googling suggests they have. How on earth did you find one so cheap anyway?
The exemption still applies for electric vans registered before 1 Mar 2015. I wasn't aware of the MOT loophole but have they not closed that anyway? Cursory googling suggests they have. How on earth did you find one so cheap anyway?
It was advertised on SpeakEV which is the same place I found the £2600 Leaf last year
I wonder if heavily depreciated ZS EVs are going to be the first EV sheds - MG are shifting them in volume and they’ll surely be pretty worthless in 10 years time.
Obviously these early Leafs etc might then be worth even less but some of them will barely be able to get off the driveway without needing charging.
Obviously these early Leafs etc might then be worth even less but some of them will barely be able to get off the driveway without needing charging.
MajorMantra said:
Indeed. In terms of actual total costs, it's still a good deal cheaper to buy and run an old ICE car, we're a long way from that tipping point it seems.
A lot hinges on how well the values of cheap EVs fare in the coming years. While there'll be some pressure from above as the bigger volume stuff selling today comes off lease/PCP, the cheap Leafs today will still represent the bottom of the market and the cheapest entry point.Even as a £5k buy today if it'll still be £3k in a few years it can stack up. Save on fuel (average 8k miles will save about £800pa charging at home), no tax, and you're not risking catastrophic failure by avoiding servicing. As long as the basic safety stuff is covered, no risk of failing an MOT.
sjg said:
MajorMantra said:
Indeed. In terms of actual total costs, it's still a good deal cheaper to buy and run an old ICE car, we're a long way from that tipping point it seems.
A lot hinges on how well the values of cheap EVs fare in the coming years. While there'll be some pressure from above as the bigger volume stuff selling today comes off lease/PCP, the cheap Leafs today will still represent the bottom of the market and the cheapest entry point.Even as a £5k buy today if it'll still be £3k in a few years it can stack up. Save on fuel (average 8k miles will save about £800pa charging at home), no tax, and you're not risking catastrophic failure by avoiding servicing. As long as the basic safety stuff is covered, no risk of failing an MOT.
And of course, the no1 killer of old bangers is not there at all, namely, failing their MOT emisisons test, at which point it's generally simply not worth the cost and both of investigating and fixing the issue.
The problem I see is that with a squint you can call a £4k Leaf a shed.
But a £4k Leaf is likely to have a 40 mile range in winter so you'll be needing a sub 30 mile commute and access to convenient charging everyday.
It's not really competing with a 1.9PD Golf that costs £800 and will do 600 miles with your foot down everywhere, unless you can meet the usage criteria above.
But a £4k Leaf is likely to have a 40 mile range in winter so you'll be needing a sub 30 mile commute and access to convenient charging everyday.
It's not really competing with a 1.9PD Golf that costs £800 and will do 600 miles with your foot down everywhere, unless you can meet the usage criteria above.
ChocolateFrog said:
The problem I see is that with a squint you can call a £4k Leaf a shed.
But a £4k Leaf is likely to have a 40 mile range in winter so you'll be needing a sub 30 mile commute and access to convenient charging everyday.
It's not really competing with a 1.9PD Golf that costs £800 and will do 600 miles with your foot down everywhere, unless you can meet the usage criteria above.
Aside from the use case (which of course is relevant), that Golf will be well over 15 years old and close or over 200k km. But a £4k Leaf is likely to have a 40 mile range in winter so you'll be needing a sub 30 mile commute and access to convenient charging everyday.
It's not really competing with a 1.9PD Golf that costs £800 and will do 600 miles with your foot down everywhere, unless you can meet the usage criteria above.
I'd be curious to see if another 5-10 years to that leaf brings it near to that magic £1k barrier.
In which case, it'll be the flexibility of the Golf vs the running costs and reliability of the Leaf.
But again, we're talking about some of the first publicly available EV's here and to me it's already looking good.
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