First EV ordered, advice / help please
Discussion
Hi all , have just ordered my first EV through work scheme , seems like a nice deal that offers quite a bit of savings for me on my commute.
I have ordered a Kia E niro 3 64kwh after extensive reading up and reviews.
My commute is 120M round trip so hoping for considerable savings petrol costs wise.
Hopefully some of you more experienced EV owners could possibly help me with a few questions if possible.
Firstly , I have signed up on Zap-Map and it seems there are numerous different recharging companies / tariffs , what are the best to sign up to for recharging charges when out and about ( is there a one covers all for example ) ?
I get a home charger fitted as part of the deal , what one should I opt for ?
Is it worth changing my home electricity supplier for when I home recharge ?
Do you have to book in advance to charge from garages etc ?
That's all at the moment , any advice , recommendations gratefully received .
I have ordered a Kia E niro 3 64kwh after extensive reading up and reviews.
My commute is 120M round trip so hoping for considerable savings petrol costs wise.
Hopefully some of you more experienced EV owners could possibly help me with a few questions if possible.
Firstly , I have signed up on Zap-Map and it seems there are numerous different recharging companies / tariffs , what are the best to sign up to for recharging charges when out and about ( is there a one covers all for example ) ?
I get a home charger fitted as part of the deal , what one should I opt for ?
Is it worth changing my home electricity supplier for when I home recharge ?
Do you have to book in advance to charge from garages etc ?
That's all at the moment , any advice , recommendations gratefully received .
fozzy280472 said:
Firstly , I have signed up on Zap-Map and it seems there are numerous different recharging companies / tariffs , what are the best to sign up to for recharging charges when out and about ( is there a one covers all for example ) ?
I get a home charger fitted as part of the deal , what one should I opt for ?
Is it worth changing my home electricity supplier for when I home recharge ?
Do you have to book in advance to charge from garages etc ?
Almost certainly you'll do 99% of your charging at home, so make that your priority. You'll get a 3-pin "granny" charging cable with the car but it's very slow.I get a home charger fitted as part of the deal , what one should I opt for ?
Is it worth changing my home electricity supplier for when I home recharge ?
Do you have to book in advance to charge from garages etc ?
A home charger is basically a big plug so, in my view, no need to spend excessive amounts on one. I can't recommend a particular brand or model - I've had a basic Rolec since 2015 and it's still going strong; but if you read the t'internet you'll see that they're somewhat demonised (probably unfairly).
Definitely consider a tariff change unless you're already on an EV type special. Still none better than Octopus Go (or Go Faster) with 4 hours at 5p/kWh.
For the rare occasions that you may need a fast-charge when you're out, stick with Instavolt, Osprey and Shell Recharge - they all 'tend' to be reliable (esp. Instavolt) and take payment by credit/debit contactless. Pod Point offer plenty of free chargers at Tesco and elsewhere, and you need their app.
Also, Octopus are running an amalgamation scheme that gives you one RFID card to use at quite a few networks and puts the cost on your electricity bill, so worth considering as another option.
Mod edit. No referral codes please
Cheers Knock Knock , very informative and helpful , will be definitely looking at Octopus , I have seen the name mentioned before regarding EV tariffs .
I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
fozzy280472 said:
Cheers Knock Knock , very informative and helpful , will be definitely looking at Octopus , I have seen the name mentioned before regarding EV tariffs .
I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
Like I say, I don't really know much about "smart" chargers etc.I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
The eNiro (I have one) has lots of charging timers and options, and a smartphone app on which you can set them, and start/stop the charging etc, so it's not something that I've considered. YMMV
fozzy280472 said:
Cheers Knock Knock , very informative and helpful , will be definitely looking at Octopus , I have seen the name mentioned before regarding EV tariffs .
I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
My charger is always on. The car is setup to pull power when it’s cheap. I must say I did think the charger was just a large plug too but I noticed most can have wireless and smartphone control so any info on that side would be very welcome.
Any other views welcome .
Might be worth checking out what charging options there are where you work. I had a 140 mile round trip commute for a while and the car park I used had free chargers. It meant I didn’t charge that much at home and didn’t change my tariff. Only a few times could I not get on a charger and needed a quick rapid charge to get me home.
As well as Zap-Map you can check out plugshare and abetterrouteplanner
As for which networks, I’d only look to sign up when you’re likely to travel to that area where they’re dominant, and more and more have a credit card option on a turn up and use basis. The car park I mention above was run by charge your car (CYC) which although free required membership, they were also greater Manchester EV (GMEV) and iirc at the time Charge Scotland and one card was all I needed for all 3, so double check before signing up multiple times to the same companies needlessly. It can get a little confusing but you’ll quickly settle into a pattern and not really think about it.
As well as Zap-Map you can check out plugshare and abetterrouteplanner
As for which networks, I’d only look to sign up when you’re likely to travel to that area where they’re dominant, and more and more have a credit card option on a turn up and use basis. The car park I mention above was run by charge your car (CYC) which although free required membership, they were also greater Manchester EV (GMEV) and iirc at the time Charge Scotland and one card was all I needed for all 3, so double check before signing up multiple times to the same companies needlessly. It can get a little confusing but you’ll quickly settle into a pattern and not really think about it.
Charger - I'd say it's worth finding out first if you've got three phase power to your house/street already, if you have then I would be tempted to pay whatever top-up is required to get this hooked up to your charger. It's just future-proofing if you're having to do a daily commute of 120 miles then there may be times where you're out late and need to get quite a bit of juice in to the car overnight, at which point you'll be wanting that 11kw+ charge rate.
Home electricity provider - Definitely take a look at the rates your provider offers and have a look what else is out there. Octopus Go ended up being very favourable for my area and needs, 5p/kWh between 00:30-04:30. If you're utilising smart charging to charge during cheaper hours then a plan like this could halve your charging costs.
Enjoy your new car once it arrives!
Home electricity provider - Definitely take a look at the rates your provider offers and have a look what else is out there. Octopus Go ended up being very favourable for my area and needs, 5p/kWh between 00:30-04:30. If you're utilising smart charging to charge during cheaper hours then a plan like this could halve your charging costs.
Enjoy your new car once it arrives!
Thanks for the replies and advice chaps , regarding charging at work , even though it's a company EV scheme they don't seem to be provisioning Workplace chargers at the moment ....joined up thinking right there !!
Interesting info about the chargers , shall have to look into it more as I will on the electric providers.
Quite looking forward to getting the car , never had anything to do with EVs so should be interesting ,usually had ICE hot hatches so quite a difference I would say .
Once again cheers for your views .
Interesting info about the chargers , shall have to look into it more as I will on the electric providers.
Quite looking forward to getting the car , never had anything to do with EVs so should be interesting ,usually had ICE hot hatches so quite a difference I would say .
Once again cheers for your views .
Great answers here for all thinking of this.
My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though
. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...
I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though
. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
Don't expect 280+ miles from your Kia if you use it at 70mph.
Mine will only do 200 on the motorway (in cold windy winter weather) at 70mph. Using the heater a lot kills the range, pre condition the car at home whilst charging, car is nice and warm the second you drive away but hasn't used battery power up.
Charge at home. Get a charger installed - no question about it.... the granny chargers take 30 hours vs 8 hours of you get a charger installed. Octopus go tariff, 5p per kwh for 4 hours each night. Charge every day and that'll cover your daily commute.
Mine will only do 200 on the motorway (in cold windy winter weather) at 70mph. Using the heater a lot kills the range, pre condition the car at home whilst charging, car is nice and warm the second you drive away but hasn't used battery power up.
Charge at home. Get a charger installed - no question about it.... the granny chargers take 30 hours vs 8 hours of you get a charger installed. Octopus go tariff, 5p per kwh for 4 hours each night. Charge every day and that'll cover your daily commute.
Ken Figenus said:
Great answers here for all thinking of this.
My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...
I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
If you're regularly dependant on en-route charging then the fuelling costs seem to get a bit silly, the real savings are to be had for people who are able to do the vast majority of their charging at home, with occasional en-route charging for longer journeys. If I was consistently needing to be charging en-route then I'd be purchasing a 2016/17 Model S with lifetime supercharging to make the numbers stack up.My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though
. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
Racking my brain to try to work it out and make sure I don't regret it... I have an ICE vehicle so this could be used if the range is going to be a big issue (if I pay to add business insurance on it and then make sure clients don't see it 
). But as you say it will 90% of the time be fine charging at home. Big decision though...
). But as you say it will 90% of the time be fine charging at home. Big decision though...Just give it a go, one can really over think these things. I sold my RS7 for a Model S and don't regret it one bit. Done a couple of 400 mile round trips in the last few weeks and a few 160 mile round trips, been into London etc. No problems at all, very easy, pretty fast and very cheap to run.
Interesting thread . I passed on an EV as I have nowhere to charge it so would have to use public charge points which i calculated to be a lot more expensive than ICE.
Cant see my ability to home charge changing in the next 10 years so EV will have to wait. I might have to shift to running older ICE for as long as practical if they ban new ones.
Cant see my ability to home charge changing in the next 10 years so EV will have to wait. I might have to shift to running older ICE for as long as practical if they ban new ones.
Lots of interesting stuff here chaps , thanks for everyone's input , I must say I'm feeling a bit more confident I've made the right decision on this car.
It's responses like these and the manufacturer specific forums that make me think there's still plenty of helpful enthusiasts on PH.
It's responses like these and the manufacturer specific forums that make me think there's still plenty of helpful enthusiasts on PH.
I have a 64kWh Kia eNiro
1. 120Mile round trip - easy - even in Winter. No range anxiety
2. eNiro non 4+ will not work with 3 phase kWh AC Charger. You need the 4+ to get 11kW 3 phase charging - so you are limited to 7kWh Single Phase on AC Charging. More with DC charging - but this is in regard to charging at home.
3. I am going to assume you have a driveway and can park the car on that / in a garage. A charger can be put anywhere assuming the right cabling can be run, but security must be considered if the charger is accessible.
4. Home charging is much cheaper than anything else (unless you can get free charging at work)
5. Home EVSE (Charging points) range from moderately expensive to very expensive. Which one to get depends on whether you have house batteries, solar power and what her indoors likes / dislikes about a particular installation.
6. There is a grant to get a home charger, however (IMHO), its almost as cheap to get a sparky to fit one without the grant as all the paperwork involved and delays in getting paid means most installers put the price up to cover costs
7. Cheapest charger combo is a 32Amp (7kW) Commando and an OHME cable (£199 from Octopus when I last looked)
8. Probably the best (YMMV) electric tariff for EV charging is Octopus Go - but you need a smart meter. 5p/unit for 4 hours plus not expensive electricity at other times makes charging very very easy.
9. Avoid Rolec chargers - they have a nasty tendancy to burn out although by replacing internal parts they can be made good. But why buy one in the first place. I have an old chargemaster (without the faulty caps and with the old grant) and a Zappi which I had installed without a Grant. I only have one car so can't use both at the same time
10. When getting your charger, consider if your house shares a mains connection with next door - this can make getting a charger more complex. There is a term for this but can't remember what it is.
11. Enjoy the car.
Note 1 that Octopus Go = 4 Hours cheap = 7*4*(between 3 & 4 miles/kW) = 84 to 112 miles charge in 4 hours which is less than your 120M round trip. So you will not be able to charge what you use each day. However if we assume 3mile/kWh as worst case in winter you will lose approx 36 miles per day which means that by the end of the week you won't have enough charge to do your trip. Note this is worst case.
Go Faster is 5 hours @ 5.5p rather than Go, 4 hours @ 5p which would give you approx 20 miles range available at the end of the week.
Remember this is worst case of 3miles/kWh with a starting range (cold, motorway etc of 200 miles). Summer will be a lot better
Obviously you can top up with more expensive home electricity (by charging a bit longer), or work electricity (maybe) or worst case public charging - just avoid Ionity unless an emergency.
Note 2 There are electricity suppliers that give longer cheap periods than Octopus. One of these may suit you better in your use case. They tend not to be as cheap as Octopus but will still make you smile at the cost of motoring
1. 120Mile round trip - easy - even in Winter. No range anxiety
2. eNiro non 4+ will not work with 3 phase kWh AC Charger. You need the 4+ to get 11kW 3 phase charging - so you are limited to 7kWh Single Phase on AC Charging. More with DC charging - but this is in regard to charging at home.
3. I am going to assume you have a driveway and can park the car on that / in a garage. A charger can be put anywhere assuming the right cabling can be run, but security must be considered if the charger is accessible.
4. Home charging is much cheaper than anything else (unless you can get free charging at work)
5. Home EVSE (Charging points) range from moderately expensive to very expensive. Which one to get depends on whether you have house batteries, solar power and what her indoors likes / dislikes about a particular installation.
6. There is a grant to get a home charger, however (IMHO), its almost as cheap to get a sparky to fit one without the grant as all the paperwork involved and delays in getting paid means most installers put the price up to cover costs
7. Cheapest charger combo is a 32Amp (7kW) Commando and an OHME cable (£199 from Octopus when I last looked)
8. Probably the best (YMMV) electric tariff for EV charging is Octopus Go - but you need a smart meter. 5p/unit for 4 hours plus not expensive electricity at other times makes charging very very easy.
9. Avoid Rolec chargers - they have a nasty tendancy to burn out although by replacing internal parts they can be made good. But why buy one in the first place. I have an old chargemaster (without the faulty caps and with the old grant) and a Zappi which I had installed without a Grant. I only have one car so can't use both at the same time
10. When getting your charger, consider if your house shares a mains connection with next door - this can make getting a charger more complex. There is a term for this but can't remember what it is.
11. Enjoy the car.
Note 1 that Octopus Go = 4 Hours cheap = 7*4*(between 3 & 4 miles/kW) = 84 to 112 miles charge in 4 hours which is less than your 120M round trip. So you will not be able to charge what you use each day. However if we assume 3mile/kWh as worst case in winter you will lose approx 36 miles per day which means that by the end of the week you won't have enough charge to do your trip. Note this is worst case.
Go Faster is 5 hours @ 5.5p rather than Go, 4 hours @ 5p which would give you approx 20 miles range available at the end of the week.
Remember this is worst case of 3miles/kWh with a starting range (cold, motorway etc of 200 miles). Summer will be a lot better
Obviously you can top up with more expensive home electricity (by charging a bit longer), or work electricity (maybe) or worst case public charging - just avoid Ionity unless an emergency.
Note 2 There are electricity suppliers that give longer cheap periods than Octopus. One of these may suit you better in your use case. They tend not to be as cheap as Octopus but will still make you smile at the cost of motoring
Edited by NugentS on Wednesday 12th May 01:46
J1990 said:
If you're regularly dependant on en-route charging then the fuelling costs seem to get a bit silly, the real savings are to be had for people who are able to do the vast majority of their charging at home, with occasional en-route charging for longer journeys. If I was consistently needing to be charging en-route then I'd be purchasing a 2016/17 Model S with lifetime supercharging to make the numbers stack up.
100% this. Unless you have regular and reliable access to a free charger, an EV is not a suitable option without a home charging point. Public chargers charge a premium and absolutely make it more expensive than an equivalent ICE vehicle.My general mental guide is that anything above 35p/kWh becomes "petrol" territory and should only be used when essential rather than simply convenient.
Ken Figenus said:
Great answers here for all thinking of this.
My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...
I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
It'll be worse than that in reality as you aren't going to see 4 miles per kW even in the most efficient RWD Taycan with perfect conditions.My key issue is not adding lots of time to every long journey by recharging en-route and making it a chore when you just want to get home...
I looked at these pretty powerful Ionity charging stations - I'd need 60 miles from one to get back from a trip to London - 69p a kilowatt though
. https://support.ionity.eu/en/general-questions/how...I reckon I'd need a kw per 4 miles (Taycan) so that looks like about 9 kw required for a 35mpg equivalent so that's MORE EXPENSIVE than petrol? Baffled - am I right?
Below is the result of a test on a RWD 93kWh battery car in perfect 18 degree temps at an average of 66mph. 293 miles until empty, so more like 3 miles per kW.
Add UK winter weather and higher speeds and that could quie easily drop by a third leaving you with 200 or so miles of range at just over 2 miles per kW.
With EV's and range "Hope for the best, plan for the worst" is the rule to live by IME.
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