Petrol vs diesel - does it matter for a lease car

[pigway]

I'm looking at leasing for either 2 or 3 years. Will be doing about 7k miles per year, mainly short journeys in crawling traffic, with a few long motorway trips (only 3 or 4 times per year)

Conventionally my understanding is that a diesel wouldn't be suitable for this due to DPF issues so I've been looking at petrol cars. But - if I'm giving the car back in 2 or 3 years anyway, do I need to worry about that?

Thanks.

[Sheepshanks]

Nope.

[Tomo1971]

I would normally say no as well but some manufacturers may exclude dpf from their warranty if only used for shorter journeys (low miles) - I would double check the T&C’s just in case....personally cant see it happening and probably just been over cautious.

But, the big diesel vs petrol debate is why I am leasing now.... was concerned that my old car would have issues, lose value due to the uncertainties so thought i would get rid, lease for a few years and hopefully the dust will settle or the gap between petrol and diesel economy will get even better than it has in the last couple of years.

[nickfrog]

The DPF of our 2.0TDI CR 150 Tiguan started playing up towards month 22 and 16k miles. The warning light started flashing occasionally but luckily not when they inspected it at return time. And we didn't much start stop driving.
Even at the same lease rate I would go for petrol. The 1.5 T with the same power hardly use any more fuel in the Karoq, is much nicer, lighter and no more Adblue.

[Guy-j88un]

I looked into the before leasing. The DPF is not usually a warranty item and therefore seen as more of a consumable from a lease perspective. Treat it the same as if you were buying.

[Jag_NE]

nickfrog said:

The DPF of our 2.0TDI CR 150 Tiguan started playing up towards month 22 and 16k miles. The warning light started flashing occasionally but luckily not when they inspected it at return time. And we didn't much start stop driving.
Even at the same lease rate I would go for petrol. The 1.5 T with the same power hardly use any more fuel in the Karoq, is much nicer, lighter and no more Adblue.

the 1.6d is almost 20% more economical than the 1.5 petrol, 52 vs 61 combined cycle. if your mileage is small its probably no big deal however. the 2.0d is almost the same mpg vs the 1.5 so its down to your preference for petrol vs diesel driving characteristics at that point. for motorway driving the shove of the diesel will be great but for pottering around the 1.5 would be fine. Adblue as an element of total cost is absolutely tiny by the way.

[Alan16ac]

pigway said:

I'm looking at leasing for either 2 or 3 years. Will be doing about 7k miles per year, mainly short journeys in crawling traffic, with a few long motorway trips (only 3 or 4 times per year)

Conventionally my understanding is that a diesel wouldn't be suitable for this due to DPF issues so I've been looking at petrol cars. But - if I'm giving the car back in 2 or 3 years anyway, do I need to worry about that?

Thanks.

You'd be better off with a petrol with such low mileage. You'll never get the diesel up to temp which for one thing is a nightmare in winter, no warm air for demisitng, or simply keeping you warm! And you'll probably end up with DPF issues. You'll find warranties often don't cover the DPF.

nickfrog said:

The DPF of our 2.0TDI CR 150 Tiguan started playing up towards month 22 and 16k miles. The warning light started flashing occasionally but luckily not when they inspected it at return time. And we didn't much start stop driving.
Even at the same lease rate I would go for petrol. The 1.5 T with the same power hardly use any more fuel in the Karoq, is much nicer, lighter and no more Adblue.

That works out about 8,700 miles a year. Far too low mileage for a modern diesel, which would explain your issues with the DPF.
It's not just about stop-start driving. You need to be doing long enough journeys to allow the car to reach its optimal temp and then perform a regen. It can take surprisingly long for these diesel engines to reach temp. I'd imagine your journeys are too short given your mileage.

[Sheepshanks]

Alan16ac said:

You'd be better off with a petrol with such low mileage. You'll never get the diesel up to temp which for one thing is a nightmare in winter, no warm air for demisitng, or simply keeping you warm! And you'll probably end up with DPF issues. You'll find warranties often don't cover the DPF.

…..

That works out about 8,700 miles a year. Far too low mileage for a modern diesel, which would explain your issues with the DPF.
It's not just about stop-start driving. You need to be doing long enough journeys to allow the car to reach its optimal temp and then perform a regen. It can take surprisingly long for these diesel engines to reach temp. I'd imagine your journeys are too short given your mileage.

Diesels have hefty electric booster heaters - wife's Tiguan blows warm air almost instantly. Even in my old Merc you can feel it after a couple of hundred yards, however you do have to be moving in that for the booster to work, not sure in the Tiguan.


Again, specific to Tiguan, but I think all newer diesels are the same, they never passive regen in practice as the dpf doesn't get anywhere near hot enough. I've certainly driven the Tiguan a couple of miles on the school run and got out to find it's been doing a regen (the fan roars). Seems to take about 10 mins or so to complete so it's run-time rather than distance that is important.

[nickfrog]

Jag_NE said:

nickfrog said:

The DPF of our 2.0TDI CR 150 Tiguan started playing up towards month 22 and 16k miles. The warning light started flashing occasionally but luckily not when they inspected it at return time. And we didn't much start stop driving.
Even at the same lease rate I would go for petrol. The 1.5 T with the same power hardly use any more fuel in the Karoq, is much nicer, lighter and no more Adblue.

the 1.6d is almost 20% more economical than the 1.5 petrol, 52 vs 61 combined cycle. if your mileage is small its probably no big deal however. the 2.0d is almost the same mpg vs the 1.5 so its down to your preference for petrol vs diesel driving characteristics at that point. for motorway driving the shove of the diesel will be great but for pottering around the 1.5 would be fine. Adblue as an element of total cost is absolutely tiny by the way.

The Adblue point wasn't relating to cost. The 1.5 is a better motorway companion than our 2.0tdi. Far wider rev range and better overall performance courtesy of the 150kg difference, not to mention refinement and sound.

[nickfrog]

Alan16ac said:

That works out about 8,700 miles a year. Far too low mileage for a modern diesel, which would explain your issues with the DPF.
It's not just about stop-start driving. You need to be doing long enough journeys to allow the car to reach its optimal temp and then perform a regen. It can take surprisingly long for these diesel engines to reach temp. I'd imagine your journeys are too short given your mileage.

Indeed and our mileage wasn't particularly town focused, we had enough long runs for regens. I don't think there was a petrol alternative at the end of the MK1 life cycle.

[Jag_NE]

nickfrog said:

Jag_NE said:

nickfrog said:

The DPF of our 2.0TDI CR 150 Tiguan started playing up towards month 22 and 16k miles. The warning light started flashing occasionally but luckily not when they inspected it at return time. And we didn't much start stop driving.
Even at the same lease rate I would go for petrol. The 1.5 T with the same power hardly use any more fuel in the Karoq, is much nicer, lighter and no more Adblue.

the 1.6d is almost 20% more economical than the 1.5 petrol, 52 vs 61 combined cycle. if your mileage is small its probably no big deal however. the 2.0d is almost the same mpg vs the 1.5 so its down to your preference for petrol vs diesel driving characteristics at that point. for motorway driving the shove of the diesel will be great but for pottering around the 1.5 would be fine. Adblue as an element of total cost is absolutely tiny by the way.

The Adblue point wasn't relating to cost. The 1.5 is a better motorway companion than our 2.0tdi. Far wider rev range and better overall performance courtesy of the 150kg difference, not to mention refinement and sound.

if it was to do with hassle, then its virtually zero as top ups are very infrequent on an economical car. my car went to its 20k service interval without needing one. the driving characteristics piece is very horses for courses / each to their own fodder. personally i dont want revvy on the motorway, but thats just me.

[nickfrog]

Jag_NE said:

if it was to do with hassle, then its virtually zero as top ups are very infrequent on an economical car. my car went to its 20k service interval without needing one. the driving characteristics piece is very horses for courses / each to their own fodder. personally i dont want revvy on the motorway, but thats just me.

It wasn't zero on the Tiguan it was every 4,000 miles and a bit of a faff. What I would call virtually zero is now on the 1.5 ;-)
The 1.5 is not revvy at all. It's very much poke in the mid range (diesel style) but far more refined and also usable at low revs where the tdi would bog.

Edited by nickfrog on Wednesday 30th May 23:02

[Jag_NE]

nickfrog said:

It wasn't zero on the Tiguan it was every 4,000 miles and a bit of a faff. What I would call virtually zero is now on the 1.5 ;-)
The 1.5 is not revvy at all. It's very much poke in the mid range (diesel style) but far more refined and also usable at low revs where the tdi would bog.

what is the adblue tank size on the tdi nick, it must be pretty small?

Edited by nickfrog on Wednesday 30th May 23:02

[nickfrog]

I think it was 7 litres but not sure. It was an afterthought on the MK1 Tiguan hence the small capacity and ridiculous access. Both issues have been addressed on the Mk2 I am sure.

[Sheepshanks]

It’s 12 litres in both mk1 (which we have) and mk2 Tiguan. Use depends on MPG - ours is doing true 38MPG and gets through AdBlue at 500 miles per litre. Filling in the mk1 is a right faff as the filler is under the boot floor.

I did a bit of research before buying and other owners with similar use patterns (5K/yr, mostly 2-4 mile journeys) reported no issues. I very nearly leased it but got a good offer to buy so did. I wouldn’t dream of buying a diesel with my own money now, but lease/PCP, no problem.

One thing I was concerned about with leasing and the way my wife uses the car is that the car might pick up a lot of car park dings, and it has, inc a couple of nasty ones. And that’s even with rubber bumpers stuck on the sides, something you couldn’t do on a leased car.

[pigway]

Thanks everyone, very helpful

[Jag_NE]

nickfrog said:

I think it was 7 litres but not sure. It was an afterthought on the MK1 Tiguan hence the small capacity and ridiculous access. Both issues have been addressed on the Mk2 I am sure.

fair enough. i recently had to top mine up and it was as easy as putting diesel in, the filling station i use has an adblue pump same as for diesel. i filled it to the top but probably could have put a fraction in just to see it to its service. either way, my experience so far is 1 top up in 41k miles at a cost of 15 quid and as its just been serviced i expect it to go to about 55k before it needs anymore. it is a larger tank granted and appears to use less per mile versus the VW example.

[nickfrog]

Jag_NE said:

fair enough. i recently had to top mine up and it was as easy as putting diesel in, the filling station i use has an adblue pump same as for diesel. i filled it to the top but probably could have put a fraction in just to see it to its service. either way, my experience so far is 1 top up in 41k miles at a cost of 15 quid and as its just been serviced i expect it to go to about 55k before it needs anymore. it is a larger tank granted and appears to use less per mile versus the VW example.

Sounds well engineered. In the mk1 Tiguan it's actually easier to remove the spare wheel to top up!! I guess the new one has better access.

[PistonBroker]

We took a Tiguan TDI on lease 2015-2017. At the time we worked from home, walked the kids to and from school, so it wasn't used everyday, but mostly got long runs.

Then we took on an office 1.4 miles away - still should have walked, but didn't! It was regularly 'regenning' once we got back on the drive of an evening, but I think I only saw the DPF light twice in our time with it.

We took on a Disco Sport at the beginning of March. I've already seen the DPF light twice. Oh boy!

[Mr Tidy]

So it does seem to matter - diesel works if you are doing enough miles, but not if you aren't!

What a surprise!