Trader mislead me over FSH. Now withholding deposit
Discussion
I called into a local car trader the other day looking for a runaround for my Mrs.
I spotted great spec 2 year old motor at a good price, The spec sheet in the car said “full history” and I asked the sales guy if that was with the main dealer and he said yes.
I asked to see the service history and they said that the documents hadn’t come in but would be there when I collected on Thursday. I paid a £750 deposit by credit card.
I went in on Thursday to collect it, I gave it a final check and asked for the service history and the dealer said “oh this doesn’t have any - that’s why it’s so cheap” and that the history they’d mentioned was the HPI and mileage check.
They denied having any conversation about service history and they’re saying the car is 10% cheaper than a car with a service history so I shouldn’t have expected one.
The car is cheaper than others but I expected a service history because they told me it had one.
I told them that the car isn’t as they’d told me it was at the time of viewing and asked for my deposit back.
They refused saying their terms clearly state no deposit refunds under any circumstances as they have costs in cancelled sales. I explained it’s only cancelled as they mislead me so their contract is unreasonable so unenforceable.
The sales guy said he’d talk to the business owner as he couldn’t do anything and the owner was back on a Friday.
On Friday I got a call from the owner before I had chance to call him, we discussed the situation and he said I must have misunderstood about the history, there was no mention of history in their Autotrader ad (which I hadn’t seen) so they won’t refund my deposit but I can choose another vehicle from their stock. I don’t want to do that.
I told him that if they didn’t refund the deposit, I would take it up with the credit card company. The owner said that’s up to me but they’d met their part of the deal so I was wasting my time. If I didn’t want to lose my £750 then my choice was either buy the original car or another from them. He said he didn’t have to offer another car but was doing so as a gesture of goodwill.
I think the situation is clearly one of being mislead and I shouldn’t have any issue getting the refund from the credit card company but is there a risk I will lose the deposit?
I spotted great spec 2 year old motor at a good price, The spec sheet in the car said “full history” and I asked the sales guy if that was with the main dealer and he said yes.
I asked to see the service history and they said that the documents hadn’t come in but would be there when I collected on Thursday. I paid a £750 deposit by credit card.
I went in on Thursday to collect it, I gave it a final check and asked for the service history and the dealer said “oh this doesn’t have any - that’s why it’s so cheap” and that the history they’d mentioned was the HPI and mileage check.
They denied having any conversation about service history and they’re saying the car is 10% cheaper than a car with a service history so I shouldn’t have expected one.
The car is cheaper than others but I expected a service history because they told me it had one.
I told them that the car isn’t as they’d told me it was at the time of viewing and asked for my deposit back.
They refused saying their terms clearly state no deposit refunds under any circumstances as they have costs in cancelled sales. I explained it’s only cancelled as they mislead me so their contract is unreasonable so unenforceable.
The sales guy said he’d talk to the business owner as he couldn’t do anything and the owner was back on a Friday.
On Friday I got a call from the owner before I had chance to call him, we discussed the situation and he said I must have misunderstood about the history, there was no mention of history in their Autotrader ad (which I hadn’t seen) so they won’t refund my deposit but I can choose another vehicle from their stock. I don’t want to do that.
I told him that if they didn’t refund the deposit, I would take it up with the credit card company. The owner said that’s up to me but they’d met their part of the deal so I was wasting my time. If I didn’t want to lose my £750 then my choice was either buy the original car or another from them. He said he didn’t have to offer another car but was doing so as a gesture of goodwill.
I think the situation is clearly one of being mislead and I shouldn’t have any issue getting the refund from the credit card company but is there a risk I will lose the deposit?
Dependant on the car and mileage it may not even need its first service yet.
As for the dealership they sound like absolute
s and if they are pulling this sort of crap now imagine what they'll do come a warranty claim.
Just get a refund via the credit card, I don't think anyone can legally take £750 and claim its non refundable if they are offering nothing in return.
As for the dealership they sound like absolute
s and if they are pulling this sort of crap now imagine what they'll do come a warranty claim. Just get a refund via the credit card, I don't think anyone can legally take £750 and claim its non refundable if they are offering nothing in return.
A credit car won’t simply take your side, so you are in a bit of a sticky wicket...you are basically saying misrepresentation of the terms of the sale.
However if the dealer is saying you were never told it had a fsh it is your word against the dealer, therefore you will lose you claim, as this is a small claims court matter
Unless you can find any evidence where it states FSH, you are on to a loser imo... and also £750 is a high deposit?
Did you write anywhere that the car sale is dependant on FSH before paying deposit?
However if the dealer is saying you were never told it had a fsh it is your word against the dealer, therefore you will lose you claim, as this is a small claims court matter
Unless you can find any evidence where it states FSH, you are on to a loser imo... and also £750 is a high deposit?
Did you write anywhere that the car sale is dependant on FSH before paying deposit?
Edited by Aeschylus on Saturday 29th September 08:36
MrAverage said:
Dependant on the car and mileage it may not even need its first service yet.
As for the dealership they sound like absolutes and if they are pulling this sort of crap now imagine what they'll do come a warranty claim.
Just get a refund via the credit card, I don't think anyone can legally take £750 and claim its non refundable if they are offering nothing in return.
They have, they offered to move money to a different car, and they are claiming he was never told it had a FSH.As for the dealership they sound like absolute
s and if they are pulling this sort of crap now imagine what they'll do come a warranty claim. Just get a refund via the credit card, I don't think anyone can legally take £750 and claim its non refundable if they are offering nothing in return.
This is a you said, I said issue, and he will lose getting the credit card to refund, it is a small claims matter, the OP would need to show history of only ever buying cars with FSH and the importance he places on this, so the Judge can side with him, also look for bad reviews etc
Pistom said:
Thanks for the replies so far.
I’ve pulled a copy of the ad from their site before they deleted it. It definitely says “full dealership history”.
The car should have had 2 services at just over 2 years.
The amount of deposit seems reasonable to me on a £10K car.
Send a copy of that advertisement to the dealer with a letter asking for the deposit back within 7 days. Otherwise trading standards and County Court.I’ve pulled a copy of the ad from their site before they deleted it. It definitely says “full dealership history”.
The car should have had 2 services at just over 2 years.
The amount of deposit seems reasonable to me on a £10K car.
It’s also worth speaking with the credit card company. I have no experience of this but definitely worth calling them.
Another conversation with the proprietor setting out the facts and pointing out that it would be a shame if you had to involve both trading standards and your solicitor. Give him 48 hours to refund or get your solicitor to write and inform TS.
The sort of trader who'll pull this sort of trick is probably the sort of trader who doesn't want TS taking an interest in them
The sort of trader who'll pull this sort of trick is probably the sort of trader who doesn't want TS taking an interest in them
bad company said:
Send a copy of that advertisement to the dealer with a letter asking for the deposit back within 7 days. Otherwise trading standards and County Court.
It’s also worth speaking with the credit card company. I have no experience of this but definitely worth calling them.
Thanks. Just done this and they've come back asking to give them a week to find a similar or better spec car with a proper FSH. It’s also worth speaking with the credit card company. I have no experience of this but definitely worth calling them.
That seems reasonable.
Bad company - great advice. You're a star.
Pistom said:
Thanks. Just done this and they've come back asking to give them a week to find a similar or better spec car with a proper FSH.
That seems reasonable.
Bad company - great advice. You're a star.
sounds like a stalling tactic, and a way to string you along and engineer a sale at all costs. That seems reasonable.
Bad company - great advice. You're a star.
Mandat said:
Pistom said:
The spec sheet in the car said “full history”
Pistom said:
It definitely says “full dealership history"
The dealer will argue that neither of these statements mean full "service" history.Camelot1971 said:
Mandat said:
Pistom said:
The spec sheet in the car said “full history”
Pistom said:
It definitely says “full dealership history"
The dealer will argue that neither of these statements mean full "service" history.Pistom said:
the history they’d mentioned was the HPI and mileage check
I was surprised to see the car was still on their website (shown as sold) with the "full dealership history" comment and as soon as I sent them with a screen dump of this, they came back with the offer to sort it.
There is a part of me which says - I don't want to deal with them on principle but we all make mistakes and I just want a car which meets the spec we agreed to.
I don't think my legal position would be any weaker in a weeks time so what have I got to lose.
As for interpretation of full dealership history - they already confirmed at the time of viewing that it had a FDSH. It's their word against mine but what else could it mean? We know who originally supplied it? We have a photo of it on the dealer forecourt? It was supplied by a car dealer? The more you think of it the more silly it gets. In fact it sounds more like they are making a statement which is intended to mislead. Add that to a contract which allows them to keep a deposit no matter what and it doesn't look good for them.
If they want to be silly, I will just get another car elsewhere and am tempted to look at not only getting my deposit back but also claiming the extra cost of getting the car to the spec they agreed to supply in the first place.
Not because I'm bothered about paying more but to make a point. It will cost them money to defend. Small claims will cost me the same whether I claim for just the deposit or any additional loss due to them failing to keep to the contract.
But forget all that - I just want my deposit back or a car to the spec agreed at the time I made the deposit.
There is a part of me which says - I don't want to deal with them on principle but we all make mistakes and I just want a car which meets the spec we agreed to.
I don't think my legal position would be any weaker in a weeks time so what have I got to lose.
As for interpretation of full dealership history - they already confirmed at the time of viewing that it had a FDSH. It's their word against mine but what else could it mean? We know who originally supplied it? We have a photo of it on the dealer forecourt? It was supplied by a car dealer? The more you think of it the more silly it gets. In fact it sounds more like they are making a statement which is intended to mislead. Add that to a contract which allows them to keep a deposit no matter what and it doesn't look good for them.
If they want to be silly, I will just get another car elsewhere and am tempted to look at not only getting my deposit back but also claiming the extra cost of getting the car to the spec they agreed to supply in the first place.
Not because I'm bothered about paying more but to make a point. It will cost them money to defend. Small claims will cost me the same whether I claim for just the deposit or any additional loss due to them failing to keep to the contract.
But forget all that - I just want my deposit back or a car to the spec agreed at the time I made the deposit.
Edited by Pistom on Saturday 29th September 11:51
Pistom said:
I was surprised to see the car was still on their website (shown as sold) with the "full dealership history" comment and as soon as I sent them with a screen dump of this, they came back with the offer to sort it.
There is a part of me which says - I don't want to deal with them on principle but we all make mistakes and I just want a car which meets the spec we agreed to.
I don't think my legal position would be any weaker in a weeks time so what have I got to lose.
As for interpretation of full dealership history - they already confirmed at the time of viewing that it had a FDSH. It's their word against mine but what else could it mean? We know who originally supplied it? We have a photo of it on the dealer forecourt? It was supplied by a car dealer? The more you think of it the more silly it gets. In fact it sounds more like they are making a statement which is intended to mislead. Add than to a contract which allows them to keep a deposit no matter what and it doesn't look good for them.
If they want to be silly, I will just get another car elsewhere and am tempted to look at not only getting my deposit back but also claiming the extra cost of getting the car to the spec they agreed to supply in the first place.
Not because I'm bothered about paying more but to make a point. It will cost them money to defend. Small claims will cost me the same whether I claim for just the deposit or any additional loss due to them failing to keep to the contract.
You done right as all this will go in your favour if they go to court, do not feel obliged to take the replacement, but keep it cordial.. There is a part of me which says - I don't want to deal with them on principle but we all make mistakes and I just want a car which meets the spec we agreed to.
I don't think my legal position would be any weaker in a weeks time so what have I got to lose.
As for interpretation of full dealership history - they already confirmed at the time of viewing that it had a FDSH. It's their word against mine but what else could it mean? We know who originally supplied it? We have a photo of it on the dealer forecourt? It was supplied by a car dealer? The more you think of it the more silly it gets. In fact it sounds more like they are making a statement which is intended to mislead. Add than to a contract which allows them to keep a deposit no matter what and it doesn't look good for them.
If they want to be silly, I will just get another car elsewhere and am tempted to look at not only getting my deposit back but also claiming the extra cost of getting the car to the spec they agreed to supply in the first place.
Not because I'm bothered about paying more but to make a point. It will cost them money to defend. Small claims will cost me the same whether I claim for just the deposit or any additional loss due to them failing to keep to the contract.
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