Audi A4 or BMW 3 series

[Reid95]

So after some browsing and searching regarding insurance; I’ve moved away from hatches and onto saloons! I’ve narrowed it down definitively to either an Audi A4 1.8 or a BMW 320i/320d. I would say the 325i but I can’t insure it. Both around the ‘08-‘10 year reg.

I plan to mod, and I understand that the 320i is na; is there any decent way to mod that for performance without breaking the bank?

If anybody can shed some light here that’d be great!

[Glosphil]

Insurance is difficult for you but you intend to modify the car! Also mod'ing the engine of a NA car is expensive for little gain.

[anonymous-user]

Isn't a four cylinder BMW engine liable to grenade itself at any moment? What are the equivalent Audi engines like, don't they have a reputation for burning lots of oil?

[spookly]

Joey Deacon said:

Isn't a four cylinder BMW engine liable to grenade itself at any moment? What are the equivalent Audi engines like, don't they have a reputation for burning lots of oil?

Some BMW engines are fragile, others not. And yes, quite a few of the Audi engines liked drinking oil, not sure which ones specifically.

But, as a poster has pointed out..... modding NA engines is very expensive for little gains unless you add FI. If you can afford a load of mods then you'd be better off spending that money on buying a faster car in the first place or putting it towards the insurance.

If you can't insure a 325i what makes you think you'd be able to afford insurance on a modified 320i?

[RobM77]

I can't advise about modding (although I do run carefully chosen aftermarket suspension on my 3), but my main reason for posting is because I've owned 2xE36, 1xE46 and 2xE90 and had a 2011 A4 2.0TDi for 3 months a while ago, plus I've driven a few A4s over the years for briefer periods. First up are positives for the Audi: although my wife disagreed, I felt that the A4 had a nicer interior; I also got let out of junctions more often. Other than that though, the 3 was superior in every other measure: the nature of the power delivery (Audi had a frantic burst and then nothing, whereas the BMW feels much more linear. My current LCI E90 ED moved more towards the Audi in this respect, compared to my '07 SE E90 compared with at the time, but the BMW is still more evenly spread with its torque delivery), the handling (typical soft front end nose heavy FWD handling in the Audi, whereas nice and balanced in the BMW), the road noise at speed (not helped by the Audi being on 17s and the BMW on 16s, but this was significantly different), and the mpg (about 20% better in the BMW). If you're going to mod for power I'd have thought the BMW's RWD chassis would handle it better than the Audi, but it depends how much power you'll be getting.

[Alucidnation]

Which one did you prefer when you test drove them OP?

[Reid95]

So in terms of buying a used 320i; is the engine a real worry? What should I be looking out for?

Both felt great to drive. The Audi maybe a little smoother? But the 3 series had a nice seating position and feel to me. I’d honestly be happy with either- I just need to make the right decision long term. This is hopefully going to be a car that is with me for the next 5 years or so.
I’m coming from a 1.4 Astra so either will be a massive upgrade for me.
The mods come in time- I don’t want to buy a car, just to buy another car in the future. I’ve heard the 320i is “slow”...I wouldn’t be looking to push anything ridiculous out of it; but from what I’ve read, everyone is pretty much unanimous on the fact that it could use a bit more oomph.
What about the diesel? Would it be worth getting the 3 series diesel over the petrol version?

[oldaudi]

I had a 2008 B8 A4 1.8T 160bhp. They also offered at the time the 1.8T as a 120bhp. Double check exactly what you are buying if it has 1.8T on the back. The 120 was terrible, the 160 was better but suffered from torque steer. Trying to modify that version will just make matters worse.

Later 1.8T gave 170bhp, then the 2.0 offered between 180 up to 225. If you're hoping to get that type of power I think the nose heavy FWD version would be a terrible drive. Probably better with quattro but you'd be looking at more £ to buy and insure.

I think you'd be better off in a BMW or look for a final A4 B7 shape, dated look perhaps but you'd get more power for your £ I'd imagine.

Edited by oldaudi on Tuesday 15th January 18:18

[ZX10R NIN]

OP what's your annual mileage as that may help you rule out the 320d the 320i is an N/A but that doesn't stop you modding the chassis & adding an exhaust for some engine noise but the 2.0 petrol & diesel BMW's from this era have issues so do your checks.

On the Audi front (unless you can't get insured on one) the 2.0T version is where I'd be looking why mod a 1.8T to get to 2.0T power & pay more on insurance for the privilege.

[Reid95]

ZX10R NIN said:

OP what's your annual mileage as that may help you rule out the 320d the 320i is an N/A but that doesn't stop you modding the chassis & adding an exhaust for some engine noise but the 2.0 petrol & diesel BMW's from this era have issues so do your checks.

On the Audi front (unless you can't get insured on one) the 2.0T version is where I'd be looking why mod a 1.8T to get to 2.0T power & pay more on insurance for the privilege.

Probably close to 10,000- that’s heavily dependent on work though!

What do I need to look out for with the engines of that era mate? My Astra is on it’s last legs so ideally don’t want to be falling into another money pit right now! Lol

[SidewaysSi]

I too would go for the BMW as IME it is a much better drive.

Not sure about what mods you are going for but I have undertaken lots of modifications to my old E36 328i and it's now a great drive. Though for engine is bog standard....for the moment

[Jag_luvver]

Personally, of the two, I'd go for the BMW for the RWD fun and better drive in general. My mate has a 2007 320d until last year - it was comfy, has a reasonable amount of pull and was very economical. He moved it on because he was afraid of the odometer reading passing into 6 digits

The flip side is that I have an irrational view that Audis with the smaller engines are just Skodas with a posher badge. Have you considered going for a Skoda/Seat/VW with the same engine as the A4 instead? The Octavia (for example) will be more practical than an A4 (as it's a hatchback) but still has the saloon-style profile. I also imagine you'd get something less used for your money or could spend less to get the same engine.

spookly said:

...
If you can't insure a 325i what makes you think you'd be able to afford insurance on a modified 320i?

Presumably the insurance company won't know about any modifications.

[Shiv_P]

Don't touch any E9x 4 cylinder engines. They're all ste apart from M47 (very early 318d/320d engine)

Edited by Shiv_P on Tuesday 15th January 19:19

[Reid95]

Shiv_P said:

Don't touch any E9x 4 cylinder engines. They're all ste apart from M47

Why is that?

[ZX10R NIN]

For the BMW's look up M/N43 issues.

[AI1694]

Be wary of the 1.8T engine from that era. A lot of them had a design fault with the piston rings so suffered with high oil consumption. The timing chains also are a weak point on that engine. Plenty of info on both issues have a read/search.

I can’t say anything on the 320i, not familiar with them. As for the 320d, is 10k miles/year enough for a diesel? Plus the engines in them also had timing chain problems.

The BMW will be the better drive no doubt but I reckon the A4 looks better inside and out.