£10,000 ish budget, looking for something fun!
Discussion
Hi all,
Posted here a few times, always been very helpful so I expect no different this time :P
So... I'm looking to buy my first "real" car, I'm 20, been driving 2 and a half years (since June 2016) and currently own a 16v Renault Clio Extreme 1.2, not the quickest thing in the world to say the least but I enjoy how light it feels and that the clutch is pretty forgiving, it's a car I enjoy to thrash around and how it feels like it's going faster than it really is due to the decent feedback and forgiving clutch control the car provides, I'd like something similar in that I get good feel and feedback from the car as I'm driving, the Clio doesn't have traction control or anything and I enjoy testing it's limits on stock tyres that can't grip any corners past 20mph....
Basically I want a car to have some fun but then to be sturdy if needed, I've been looking at a few options but am really not sure of what to even consider, I'm a complete newbie at these things so any advice is very greatly appreiciated....
I'm going to buy a used car, probably max 80k mileage unless someone can convince me otherwise, my original budget was around £7k and was looking at things like BMW 325i SE, 2010> 2.0L Scirroco, Fiesta ST, Puegeot RCZ, Puegeot 208 GTI, MK2 Focus ST and a few others.
From this list I realized that something like a BMW or RCZ is probably going to cost me a lot more than others in the long run in terms of fuel costs, repair costs, service costs and insurance and so it made me think I could stretch my upfront cost to be a little higher and so I'm now looking at what's available around the £10k mark, this has led me to consider the Megane R.S. 250 and the GT86, I'm not sure what else would be available around this pricepoint....
The R.S 250 looks stunning but similar to the Scirroco I don't really like how basic the interior of the car is, it's a minor pet peave but still I think fast cars should always have flashy interiors as it's what the driver and passenger is going to be seeing most of so that is a big negative to me, along with this, the R.S 250 is twice as expensive on insurance than basically any car here (£1400 quote compared to GT86 £800, Fiesta ST £750) and I've heard it is quite expensive to repair and service due to everything being uprated due to being a R.S model but I might be wrong with that.
The GT86 looks amazing to me, I love that style of coupe, it's like a modern RX-8 design which appeals greatly to me as the RX-8 R3 is a car I think is one of the best looking, it's a shame the engine inside doesn't match the looks (I know rotaries are special but really they aren't great for average drivers like me), the GT86 isn't too fast either (considering what I'm upgrading from there is a slight worry I'll get something a little too fast, advice appreciated on this...), looks great, is cheap to insure and gives me the option of playing around with the rear wheel drive goodness, I'm just not sure about running costs, repair costs and what it would be like as a daily driver (I don't like cars that are too stiff, my mums 09 3.2 Audi TT Quattro is a nightmare to be a passenger in) and also what the traction is like on the "normal" settings, so again I'm not really sure about this one and definitely need some advice.... also, would this car be a good used buy? I see the 2013 ones are around £10,500, what would the depreciation be like on a car like this?
The Fiesta ST seemed a good option, my issue is that apparently the ride is very rough and that at the end of the day it's a Fiesta shell which is too bland and boring for me, it's also a bit too small a hatch for my liking but it does tick boxes with cheap to run, insure and a fun ride so I'm still open to it.
For the Scirroco I've heard it's a bit boring, more like a GT than a sporty car and so that turns me off a bit, I want to be able to have fun from time to time, flying round roundabouts getting a close to centre racing line is something a love in the Clio because I can feel the tyres desperately trying to retain grip and the feeling of just gliding through them is brilliant for me and I'm not sure I'll get this with the Scirroco but I'm not sure and again need advice on this, cost wise again I'm not sure what the repair bills would be for this car, it would cost me around £7k for decent mileage and spec and would be around £1100 to insure.
Any advice is greatly appreciated, I know this is a long read but hopefully I've supplied enough information for you guys to make some good suggestions and offer your much appreciated advice! I'm only 20 and work in contracting so having a car that is cheap to maintain is more important than the initial cost because there might be times I'm not in work for a few months and I want the peace of mind knowing that nothing too expensive could go wrong (looking at you BMW...).
Thanks a lot all! I look forward to hearing replies
Posted here a few times, always been very helpful so I expect no different this time :P
So... I'm looking to buy my first "real" car, I'm 20, been driving 2 and a half years (since June 2016) and currently own a 16v Renault Clio Extreme 1.2, not the quickest thing in the world to say the least but I enjoy how light it feels and that the clutch is pretty forgiving, it's a car I enjoy to thrash around and how it feels like it's going faster than it really is due to the decent feedback and forgiving clutch control the car provides, I'd like something similar in that I get good feel and feedback from the car as I'm driving, the Clio doesn't have traction control or anything and I enjoy testing it's limits on stock tyres that can't grip any corners past 20mph....
Basically I want a car to have some fun but then to be sturdy if needed, I've been looking at a few options but am really not sure of what to even consider, I'm a complete newbie at these things so any advice is very greatly appreiciated....
I'm going to buy a used car, probably max 80k mileage unless someone can convince me otherwise, my original budget was around £7k and was looking at things like BMW 325i SE, 2010> 2.0L Scirroco, Fiesta ST, Puegeot RCZ, Puegeot 208 GTI, MK2 Focus ST and a few others.
From this list I realized that something like a BMW or RCZ is probably going to cost me a lot more than others in the long run in terms of fuel costs, repair costs, service costs and insurance and so it made me think I could stretch my upfront cost to be a little higher and so I'm now looking at what's available around the £10k mark, this has led me to consider the Megane R.S. 250 and the GT86, I'm not sure what else would be available around this pricepoint....
The R.S 250 looks stunning but similar to the Scirroco I don't really like how basic the interior of the car is, it's a minor pet peave but still I think fast cars should always have flashy interiors as it's what the driver and passenger is going to be seeing most of so that is a big negative to me, along with this, the R.S 250 is twice as expensive on insurance than basically any car here (£1400 quote compared to GT86 £800, Fiesta ST £750) and I've heard it is quite expensive to repair and service due to everything being uprated due to being a R.S model but I might be wrong with that.
The GT86 looks amazing to me, I love that style of coupe, it's like a modern RX-8 design which appeals greatly to me as the RX-8 R3 is a car I think is one of the best looking, it's a shame the engine inside doesn't match the looks (I know rotaries are special but really they aren't great for average drivers like me), the GT86 isn't too fast either (considering what I'm upgrading from there is a slight worry I'll get something a little too fast, advice appreciated on this...), looks great, is cheap to insure and gives me the option of playing around with the rear wheel drive goodness, I'm just not sure about running costs, repair costs and what it would be like as a daily driver (I don't like cars that are too stiff, my mums 09 3.2 Audi TT Quattro is a nightmare to be a passenger in) and also what the traction is like on the "normal" settings, so again I'm not really sure about this one and definitely need some advice.... also, would this car be a good used buy? I see the 2013 ones are around £10,500, what would the depreciation be like on a car like this?
The Fiesta ST seemed a good option, my issue is that apparently the ride is very rough and that at the end of the day it's a Fiesta shell which is too bland and boring for me, it's also a bit too small a hatch for my liking but it does tick boxes with cheap to run, insure and a fun ride so I'm still open to it.
For the Scirroco I've heard it's a bit boring, more like a GT than a sporty car and so that turns me off a bit, I want to be able to have fun from time to time, flying round roundabouts getting a close to centre racing line is something a love in the Clio because I can feel the tyres desperately trying to retain grip and the feeling of just gliding through them is brilliant for me and I'm not sure I'll get this with the Scirroco but I'm not sure and again need advice on this, cost wise again I'm not sure what the repair bills would be for this car, it would cost me around £7k for decent mileage and spec and would be around £1100 to insure.
Any advice is greatly appreciated, I know this is a long read but hopefully I've supplied enough information for you guys to make some good suggestions and offer your much appreciated advice! I'm only 20 and work in contracting so having a car that is cheap to maintain is more important than the initial cost because there might be times I'm not in work for a few months and I want the peace of mind knowing that nothing too expensive could go wrong (looking at you BMW...).
Thanks a lot all! I look forward to hearing replies
I know it's a cliche but I'd have thought the obvious answer is an MX5. You can get one to suit pretty much any budget and they're about as bullet-proof as cars get. Not massively powerful and unlike hot-hatches it doesn't really have the right image to attract the boy-racers who push up insurance prices by association. They ride pretty well too, certainly no worse than most hot hatches.
The GT86 is also a good choice if you'd prefer a coupe and/or want the token rear seats.
The GT86 is also a good choice if you'd prefer a coupe and/or want the token rear seats.
If you like your Clio, you could spend under 10k and get a really nice 182 trophy. Harry Metcalfe of creating Evo Magazine fame reckons it's the best hot hatch ever. It's depreciation free motoring too...
Megane R.S is a good shout. Abarth 695 Comp is great fun. 350z would leave you money in the bank and get you a V6 AND RWD as a left field choice to the GT86 (but will be thirsty)
I wouldn't worry about the Scirocco - they're very good cars and very quick in a straight line when needs be, but I chose a 182 over one and have not regretted it one bit (apart from long journeys...) -
Megane R.S is a good shout. Abarth 695 Comp is great fun. 350z would leave you money in the bank and get you a V6 AND RWD as a left field choice to the GT86 (but will be thirsty)
I wouldn't worry about the Scirocco - they're very good cars and very quick in a straight line when needs be, but I chose a 182 over one and have not regretted it one bit (apart from long journeys...) -
For 10k, you can get a high specced Megane 250.
The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
grudas said:
I'd say a mk 3.5 MX5
will be rwd, well built, epic fun, can grab one for 10k in very good condition, folding hardtop, lsd etc.
What do you think of the GT86? I can get one from a good dealership with 60k miles for £10,500. 2012 plate.will be rwd, well built, epic fun, can grab one for 10k in very good condition, folding hardtop, lsd etc.
Problem with the MX5 for me is just how small and innocent looknig it is, it just doesn't look aggressive enough for me....
kambites said:
I know it's a cliche but I'd have thought the obvious answer is an MX5. You can get one to suit pretty much any budget and they're about as bullet-proof as cars get. Not massively powerful and unlike hot-hatches it doesn't really have the right image to attract the boy-racers who push up insurance prices by association. They ride pretty well too, certainly no worse than most hot hatches.
The GT86 is also a good choice if you'd prefer a coupe and/or want the token rear seats.
What are repair/running costs like compared to a GT86? I can get a 60k mileage 2012 GT86 for £10,500 at a good dealership near me which I'm very tempted by, insurance is cheap as anything on these cars, too.The GT86 is also a good choice if you'd prefer a coupe and/or want the token rear seats.
Would depreciation be more than £1000 a year?
JLC25 said:
If you like your Clio, you could spend under 10k and get a really nice 182 trophy. Harry Metcalfe of creating Evo Magazine fame reckons it's the best hot hatch ever. It's depreciation free motoring too...
Megane R.S is a good shout. Abarth 695 Comp is great fun. 350z would leave you money in the bank and get you a V6 AND RWD as a left field choice to the GT86 (but will be thirsty)
I wouldn't worry about the Scirocco - they're very good cars and very quick in a straight line when needs be, but I chose a 182 over one and have not regretted it one bit (apart from long journeys...) -
Ah, my issue with things like 182s, Abarth, Fiesta STs etc is the looks, I just think they don't look the part which is why Scirroco, GT86 and Megane R.S are attracting me more than the others, the 350z is a nice car but I've heard it's not forgiving and the clutch is hard to control at low speeds which would be a problem for me as someone who has never experienced anything like this before.Megane R.S is a good shout. Abarth 695 Comp is great fun. 350z would leave you money in the bank and get you a V6 AND RWD as a left field choice to the GT86 (but will be thirsty)
I wouldn't worry about the Scirocco - they're very good cars and very quick in a straight line when needs be, but I chose a 182 over one and have not regretted it one bit (apart from long journeys...) -
Blanchimont said:
For 10k, you can get a high specced Megane 250.
The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
My main concerns with Megane R.S is that they are apparently a very hard ride, is expensive to repair, expensive to insure and might be too powerful for me as someone who is moving from something that basically does 0-60 in double the time it might be just too much and so something like a Scirroco or GT86 was looking better to me but I guess that leaves me asking you, how forgiving is this car? How sensitive is the clutch? and how much are the repairs/maitenence? The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
Thanks !
Wixzylol said:
grudas said:
I'd say a mk 3.5 MX5
will be rwd, well built, epic fun, can grab one for 10k in very good condition, folding hardtop, lsd etc.
What do you think of the GT86? I can get one from a good dealership with 60k miles for £10,500. 2012 plate.will be rwd, well built, epic fun, can grab one for 10k in very good condition, folding hardtop, lsd etc.
Problem with the MX5 for me is just how small and innocent looknig it is, it just doesn't look aggressive enough for me....
Gonna chuck in the S2000
You should at least try one.....
looks? subjective, but aging very well
Civic-like levels of ease (dullness?) around town
Elise-like levels of raw fun when you're 'on it'
Reliable even at 9000rpm
open air motoring or hardtop available
lots of fluff and stuff about "proper RWD, manual, NA values on the up" etc etc
You should at least try one.....
looks? subjective, but aging very well
Civic-like levels of ease (dullness?) around town
Elise-like levels of raw fun when you're 'on it'
Reliable even at 9000rpm
open air motoring or hardtop available
lots of fluff and stuff about "proper RWD, manual, NA values on the up" etc etc
Quickmoose said:
Gonna chuck in the S2000
You should at least try one.....
looks? subjective, but aging very well
Civic-like levels of ease (dullness?) around town
Elise-like levels of raw fun when you're 'on it'
Reliable even at 9000rpm
open air motoring or hardtop available
lots of fluff and stuff about "proper RWD, manual, NA values on the up" etc etc
Haven't they got an LSD as well? I think it's a Torsen kind, but still You should at least try one.....
looks? subjective, but aging very well
Civic-like levels of ease (dullness?) around town
Elise-like levels of raw fun when you're 'on it'
Reliable even at 9000rpm
open air motoring or hardtop available
lots of fluff and stuff about "proper RWD, manual, NA values on the up" etc etc
Wixzylol said:
Blanchimont said:
For 10k, you can get a high specced Megane 250.
The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
My main concerns with Megane R.S is that they are apparently a very hard ride, is expensive to repair, expensive to insure and might be too powerful for me as someone who is moving from something that basically does 0-60 in double the time it might be just too much and so something like a Scirroco or GT86 was looking better to me but I guess that leaves me asking you, how forgiving is this car? How sensitive is the clutch? and how much are the repairs/maitenence? The interior is a little basic, but it's well built, and if you enjoy driving, there's not a huge amount that can match the Megane as an all rounder.
I've had 3, and other than consumables never cost me a penny, and they were all tracked, and driven hard. I had to replace the thermostat on one, but it's a £30 part, and took about an hour to fit myself.
They can take power, well too. 320hp from an intercooler, downpipe, and a map is achievable reliably. There's a reason they're always at track days, they're reliable, fast, brilliant fun.
Drive one, make sure it has a cup back, as it gets a front LSD.
Thanks !
If you go to main dealers, it's pretty pricey, the same as most main dealers. Specialists are much more reasonable. Ktec Racing, who are a well known RS specialist charge £500 for all belts, pumps, tensioners etc, all OEM equipment.
The clutch can take 360hp without any trouble, with this in mind it's not too bad. It will be heavier than your current Clios, but it's not too bad. It's about the same weight as a EP3 Civic Type R, with a new clutch.
Maintenance wise they're pretty strong. It's mainly niggly things, like swivel hub bearings (£250, every 60kish) Thermostats (£30 parts, easy to self fit) and that's about it.
The car whilst pootling around is fine, keep it off boost and don't prod it, it behaves like a normal Megane. Give it some stick, and rev it right out (It's the only turbo car I've driven that doesn't tail off at the top end) and lean on it into the corners and it comes alive in your hands. It's the best Jekyll and Hyde car I've driven.
I was driving brand new GT86's off the ships when they come into the country, and I drove about 30, with a mix of autos and manuals, and by the end of the day, it reminded me what I enjoy about the Meganes.
The too powerful thing, I wouldn't worry about it. If you go out, in the wet, and clog it, you'll end up with wheelspin. if you're conscious you've got 250hp + (most std cars dyno at about 260-270hp) under your right foot, and don't just mat the throttle mid corner, and allow the diff to lock and work effectively, you'll be fine.
I know someone with a 250, that has 350+hp, does multiple track days, drives it hard and it's never failed him once.
RS Meganes, tend to be owned by proper drivers too, and rarely are owned by people who thrash them. My old, white 250, did multiple ring trips, Spa, loads of UK trackdays and was utterly reliable. It got an oil change after every trackday, and was always well looked after. I got a box file full of paperwork with the car.
Honestly, drive one. You'll then be able to see how the clutch is, see how the car feels, because compared to my old EP3, it felt a lot chunkier. The only downside to the car, is the bloody width of the thing, it's over 2m wide mirror to mirror.
I've had a MK2 Megane RS and 3 MK3s, they are far and away the best option within your budget if you want to have something relatively modern IMO. It will do everything for you and they are so easy to live with, clutch will only be marginally heavier to what youre used to, gearbox is better while not being perfect but significantly better than the box in my Clio 200 cup. You will still be able to get a decent spec within budget, must have's are Recaro's, RS Monitor (for throttle mapping) and Climate Control, then Visibility pack and Keyless is a lovely bonus for a daily.
I would argue the Honda's I've owned (Integra and S2k) are more fun but they're a pain in the ass to live with day to day and definitely go against you not liking a basic interior.
The Scirocco is a lovely car and don't discount it, but its in a completely different class to the Megane, its a warm hatch in reality.
The GT86s interior is pretty horrible when you actually get in, although it does look better than the Megane admittedly. I picked the S2k over this when I looked for my first RWD.
I would argue the Honda's I've owned (Integra and S2k) are more fun but they're a pain in the ass to live with day to day and definitely go against you not liking a basic interior.
The Scirocco is a lovely car and don't discount it, but its in a completely different class to the Megane, its a warm hatch in reality.
The GT86s interior is pretty horrible when you actually get in, although it does look better than the Megane admittedly. I picked the S2k over this when I looked for my first RWD.
I have to say that if you want something fun then it has to be the RS250 it's the best handling car in it's segment (M135i Golf R included) if you want a bit of plushness then look for a Lux with the Cup Chassis fitted & preferably the Recaros too, but they're hard to find:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
or if you want something a little softer then I'd personally recommend the 2.5T Focus in ST-3 spec:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
The Meganes don't have heavy running costs & should cost the same to run as a Scirocco, they're also just as reliable as a VAG product too so I wouldn't let reliability be a reason not to choose one.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
or if you want something a little softer then I'd personally recommend the 2.5T Focus in ST-3 spec:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
The Meganes don't have heavy running costs & should cost the same to run as a Scirocco, they're also just as reliable as a VAG product too so I wouldn't let reliability be a reason not to choose one.
Edited by ZX10R NIN on Tuesday 19th March 13:35
A good budget you've got and a great set of cars you've mentioned.
Fiesta ST would probably be my number one pick. It's the most fun car I've ever driven. Quick, fun, reliable, nimble, frugal and just a nice place to be. I couldn't fault it at all. The only issue with the size would be if you wanted such a small car and/or need something bigger.
Megane 250's are amazing value. One of the best FWD driver-focused hot hatches out there and actually pretty solid cars too. The only issue with them is that you really need to drive them properly to understand what all the fuss is about. It would be more to run than the Fiesta though.
Scirocco 2.0 TSI is a good shout. A lovely daily with a nice bit of poke. Not massively fun to drive though. They're still good to have a blast in, don't get me wrong, but the alternatives will give you bigger thrills. I really enjoy mine for what it is, I just personally find that it's missing something.
MK2 Focus ST's are great value. You really can't beat that 5-cylinder noise for the money, if 4-cylinders isn't your thing. 208 GTI really doesn't do anything for me, although they are really quire cheap. MK5/6/ED30 Golf GTI would be something to consider. If you don't mind having a dual-clutch, you could look at a MK4 Clio 200T (EDC). Really underrated cars IMO.
Fiesta ST would probably be my number one pick. It's the most fun car I've ever driven. Quick, fun, reliable, nimble, frugal and just a nice place to be. I couldn't fault it at all. The only issue with the size would be if you wanted such a small car and/or need something bigger.
Megane 250's are amazing value. One of the best FWD driver-focused hot hatches out there and actually pretty solid cars too. The only issue with them is that you really need to drive them properly to understand what all the fuss is about. It would be more to run than the Fiesta though.
Scirocco 2.0 TSI is a good shout. A lovely daily with a nice bit of poke. Not massively fun to drive though. They're still good to have a blast in, don't get me wrong, but the alternatives will give you bigger thrills. I really enjoy mine for what it is, I just personally find that it's missing something.
MK2 Focus ST's are great value. You really can't beat that 5-cylinder noise for the money, if 4-cylinders isn't your thing. 208 GTI really doesn't do anything for me, although they are really quire cheap. MK5/6/ED30 Golf GTI would be something to consider. If you don't mind having a dual-clutch, you could look at a MK4 Clio 200T (EDC). Really underrated cars IMO.
Blanchimont said:
Lots of good RenaultSport stuff
All of this can pretty much be applied to the whole RenaultSport range. Parts are generally cheap to buy, specialists are plentiful too. Where build quality is poor on french cars is things like the interior. A VW Scirocco interior is nicer than a Megane R.S. The R.S in much more of a drivers car than the Scirocco. I would go with the Megan 10 times out of 10.Gassing Station | Car Buying | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff