Cylinder Head cracked 5-months after rebuild..
Discussion
As the title says..
Bought an Audi S3 ('10 plate) from a dealership, they initially told me it had just had a 'brand new' engine put in. Once discussions went further, it turned out it had just been rebuilt but I was told it was 'pretty much the same thing' and I'd have a full 12-month warranty on it. The engine was rebuilt in the same garage I purchased from.
5-months in, it's leaking oil and coolant. I take it in and they tell me it's got a crack in the cylinder head and it'd cost £4.5k to repair. Not economical for them nor me, they advise. They tell me the warranty infact has a £1k limit and I'd have to cough up the rest if I was to go down that route.
After long discussions, we agree that they'd find me a decent replacement at cost price and provide me with a courtesy car in the meantime. I was initially happy with this considering it'd be the right car, but this has now been going on for 3-months and the cars they're suggesting are just no good.
I've threatened with rejection a few times but after looking into it, as the crack wasn't there when I purchased it, I can't reject on these grounds.
I've tried contacting ADR/ombudsman for advice with no joy.
I'm eager to find out whether I have any legal rights here.. With them rebuilding the engine on site, would the necessary testing shown that the cylinder head was flawed?
Bought an Audi S3 ('10 plate) from a dealership, they initially told me it had just had a 'brand new' engine put in. Once discussions went further, it turned out it had just been rebuilt but I was told it was 'pretty much the same thing' and I'd have a full 12-month warranty on it. The engine was rebuilt in the same garage I purchased from.
5-months in, it's leaking oil and coolant. I take it in and they tell me it's got a crack in the cylinder head and it'd cost £4.5k to repair. Not economical for them nor me, they advise. They tell me the warranty infact has a £1k limit and I'd have to cough up the rest if I was to go down that route.
After long discussions, we agree that they'd find me a decent replacement at cost price and provide me with a courtesy car in the meantime. I was initially happy with this considering it'd be the right car, but this has now been going on for 3-months and the cars they're suggesting are just no good.
I've threatened with rejection a few times but after looking into it, as the crack wasn't there when I purchased it, I can't reject on these grounds.
I've tried contacting ADR/ombudsman for advice with no joy.
I'm eager to find out whether I have any legal rights here.. With them rebuilding the engine on site, would the necessary testing shown that the cylinder head was flawed?
You are theoretically entitled to a repair, replacement or partial refund within 6 months of purchase, if the damage is outside of normal wear and tear (which I think a cracked head is). However, if they're offering you a roughly equivalent car I could imagine a small claims judge thinking that was a fair compensation after 5 months of owning the car.
It kind of sucks, but actually in your position I would probably just try to negotiate the best replacement car possible and cut my losses.
Good luck!
It kind of sucks, but actually in your position I would probably just try to negotiate the best replacement car possible and cut my losses.
Good luck!
Thanks for the replies.
Yes, they said £2k for the part, £2.5k in labour..
I've since found out they've claimed £1k through my warranty and welded the crack (I don't think for a second it'd have cost that much to weld the cylinder head...) - They initially said they'd need my signature to authorise the claim but have since just gone ahead and done it..
They said this might last up to a year or so, I think in the hope that I'd take it back and sell it on privately but I'm not willing to do that.
Andy, could you link one of the eBay listings? I can't seem to find any. I might well suggest they buy and fit one, though again they're stating '£2.5k in labour'.. I guess that's a load of rubbish?
Yes, they said £2k for the part, £2.5k in labour..
I've since found out they've claimed £1k through my warranty and welded the crack (I don't think for a second it'd have cost that much to weld the cylinder head...) - They initially said they'd need my signature to authorise the claim but have since just gone ahead and done it..
They said this might last up to a year or so, I think in the hope that I'd take it back and sell it on privately but I'm not willing to do that.
Andy, could you link one of the eBay listings? I can't seem to find any. I might well suggest they buy and fit one, though again they're stating '£2.5k in labour'.. I guess that's a load of rubbish?
What is their stated hourly rate?
£2500 / £40 per hr = 62.5 hours
£2500 / £60 per hr = 41.6 hours
£2500 / £80 per hr = 31.25 hours
£2500 / £100 per hr = 25 hours
At £100/hr it will take 12.5 hours / 1.5 days to remove the head and then same to refit it.
I guess that's not unreasonable.
If their rate is £50/hour, though, 50 hours to remove and refit seems excessive.
£2500 / £40 per hr = 62.5 hours
£2500 / £60 per hr = 41.6 hours
£2500 / £80 per hr = 31.25 hours
£2500 / £100 per hr = 25 hours
At £100/hr it will take 12.5 hours / 1.5 days to remove the head and then same to refit it.
I guess that's not unreasonable.
If their rate is £50/hour, though, 50 hours to remove and refit seems excessive.
RSTurboPaul said:
What is their stated hourly rate?
£2500 / £40 per hr = 62.5 hours
£2500 / £60 per hr = 41.6 hours
£2500 / £80 per hr = 31.25 hours
£2500 / £100 per hr = 25 hours
At £100/hr it will take 12.5 hours / 1.5 days to remove the head and then same to refit it.
I guess that's not unreasonable.
If their rate is £50/hour, though, 50 hours to remove and refit seems excessive.
It's a different kind of car, but mine has been at the mechanic's since 30th March and needed the cylinder head to be removed, sent away to have the valve guides (and bent valves) replaced. I was told it took about ~1.5 days to get the head off, and I'm assuming about the same to put it back - but I've been quoted "about 30 hours" for the entire job. At £90 + vat an hour, I'm expecting a labour charge of ~£3.5k inc vat. £2500 / £40 per hr = 62.5 hours
£2500 / £60 per hr = 41.6 hours
£2500 / £80 per hr = 31.25 hours
£2500 / £100 per hr = 25 hours
At £100/hr it will take 12.5 hours / 1.5 days to remove the head and then same to refit it.
I guess that's not unreasonable.
If their rate is £50/hour, though, 50 hours to remove and refit seems excessive.
So as mentioned in the previous post - it obviously depends on labour rates, but ~£2.5k for removing and refitting a cylinder head sounds about right to me.
Hifty said:
Thanks for the replies.
Yes, they said £2k for the part, £2.5k in labour..
I've since found out they've claimed £1k through my warranty and welded the crack (I don't think for a second it'd have cost that much to weld the cylinder head...) - They initially said they'd need my signature to authorise the claim but have since just gone ahead and done it..
They said this might last up to a year or so, I think in the hope that I'd take it back and sell it on privately but I'm not willing to do that.
Andy, could you link one of the eBay listings? I can't seem to find any. I might well suggest they buy and fit one, though again they're stating '£2.5k in labour'.. I guess that's a load of rubbish?
The garage have had the car back and gone ahead and stripped it down and welded the head and told you it "should last a year or so" that is NO WAY an acceptable fix especially without your consent. Yes, they said £2k for the part, £2.5k in labour..
I've since found out they've claimed £1k through my warranty and welded the crack (I don't think for a second it'd have cost that much to weld the cylinder head...) - They initially said they'd need my signature to authorise the claim but have since just gone ahead and done it..
They said this might last up to a year or so, I think in the hope that I'd take it back and sell it on privately but I'm not willing to do that.
Andy, could you link one of the eBay listings? I can't seem to find any. I might well suggest they buy and fit one, though again they're stating '£2.5k in labour'.. I guess that's a load of rubbish?
I'd have passed on the car the moment the guys started spouting "new engine" "rebuilt engine" same thing etc, I'm assuming you did not purchase the car from an Audi dealer.
No, a hyundai dealership. I was a bit skeptical but he reassured me it was pretty much a 'brand new' engine. My bad for believing a salesman I guess..!
They said it'd had been a customers car which had been repeatedly misfiring, audi apparently commissioned them (?) to just rebuild it but the customer decided to px mid way through.
Does anyone know whether to weld the crack, they would have had to take the cylinder head off? Because if so, it would have made sense to just replace..? I'm also awaiting a reply from the warranty company to see whether they'd have needed my signature to claim. If not, they might have forged it and I'd be onto an easy win..
They said it'd had been a customers car which had been repeatedly misfiring, audi apparently commissioned them (?) to just rebuild it but the customer decided to px mid way through.
Does anyone know whether to weld the crack, they would have had to take the cylinder head off? Because if so, it would have made sense to just replace..? I'm also awaiting a reply from the warranty company to see whether they'd have needed my signature to claim. If not, they might have forged it and I'd be onto an easy win..
Well, perhaps they've spotted this thread as I was called yesterday and offered a couple of options.
The one I've gone with is a '12 Audi TT (Tdi 170). 2 years newer than the S3 and despite being a diesel, felt it was the better option in this case.
I've been provided with a VIN and reg but can't seem to find a site that will allow me to check the in depth spec.. Can anyone point me in the right direction? VinDecoderz seems to work but it also states it has every single item available, including 17", 18" and 19" alloys...
The one I've gone with is a '12 Audi TT (Tdi 170). 2 years newer than the S3 and despite being a diesel, felt it was the better option in this case.
I've been provided with a VIN and reg but can't seem to find a site that will allow me to check the in depth spec.. Can anyone point me in the right direction? VinDecoderz seems to work but it also states it has every single item available, including 17", 18" and 19" alloys...
Oh dear, I've been hearing mixed reviews of the diesel tt..hadnt realised it was so hated. Is there a reason or is it just because its an audi, "sports" diesel?
I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
Of course it's nowhere near an s3, but i'm looking at resale value as much as anything as I can't imagine I'll be in it for too long..
The reg is NG11TRV.
I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
Of course it's nowhere near an s3, but i'm looking at resale value as much as anything as I can't imagine I'll be in it for too long..
The reg is NG11TRV.
Hifty said:
Oh dear, I've been hearing mixed reviews of the diesel tt..hadnt realised it was so hated. Is there a reason or is it just because its an audi, "sports" diesel?
I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
If you like it and it's a good way out of your current situation then don't be dissuaded by comments on here. I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
The TT has a poor rep on here as it tries hard to be a sports car but is no better to drive than a very average hatchback. The ride is meant to be terrible, particularly on the S-Line models and the notion that they even produced a diesel one doesn't help it's case. On the plus side, many think that they look pretty and the interiors are meant to be quite nice (it's what Audi do well).
If it floats your boat and solves your current problem then go for it.
Hifty said:
Oh dear, I've been hearing mixed reviews of the diesel tt..hadnt realised it was so hated. Is there a reason or is it just because its an audi, "sports" diesel?
I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
Of course it's nowhere near an s3, but i'm looking at resale value as much as anything as I can't imagine I'll be in it for too long..
The reg is NG11TRV.
That car does have perfect MOT history. Although it's not difficult to get a dodgy MOT it's still a good starting point.I used to have a golf gt tdi 170 and loved it so was assuming it'd be a similar jump.
Of course it's nowhere near an s3, but i'm looking at resale value as much as anything as I can't imagine I'll be in it for too long..
The reg is NG11TRV.
2Btoo said:
If you like it and it's a good way out of your current situation then don't be dissuaded by comments on here.
The TT has a poor rep on here as it tries hard to be a sports car but is no better to drive than a very average hatchback. The ride is meant to be terrible, particularly on the S-Line models and the notion that they even produced a diesel one doesn't help it's case. On the plus side, many think that they look pretty and the interiors are meant to be quite nice (it's what Audi do well).
If it floats your boat and solves your current problem then go for it.
Well until I've driven it, I'm not signing anything over. My only concern was the ride which I've heard was a bit rough; I notice this also has the upgraded 19" alloys which isn't going to help matters..! The TT has a poor rep on here as it tries hard to be a sports car but is no better to drive than a very average hatchback. The ride is meant to be terrible, particularly on the S-Line models and the notion that they even produced a diesel one doesn't help it's case. On the plus side, many think that they look pretty and the interiors are meant to be quite nice (it's what Audi do well).
If it floats your boat and solves your current problem then go for it.
I'm not after looks, though I like a good cabin which is why I initially went with Audi.
I'll give it a whirl and see how I get on. I imagine it's going to feel great though after driving a little Hyundai IX20 around for the last 3-months...!
Thanks for the info!
ninjag said:
That car does have perfect MOT history. Although it's not difficult to get a dodgy MOT it's still a good starting point.
Good to know, thanks. Do you know of any way to check it's history? It states it has full main dealer history but then follows by '3 main dealership services'. On a 7 year old car with 79K miles, that doesn't mean full to me..Gassing Station | Car Buying | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff