What's the "best" new mid-size hot hatch for around 30k?
Discussion
Growing up in the 80s, I've always been a massive hot hatch fan and in each era there has always been a standout favourite or one that the motoring press always rated above the others. For me, it would have been the 205 GTi/Golf GTi in the 80s, Escort Cosworth/Delta Integrale in the early 90s, Clio Williams/Pug 306 GTi-6 in the late 90s, EP3 Civic Type-R in the early 2000s and latterly probably between various versions of the Golf GTI/Focus ST/Focus RS.
Although one could argue that the latest crop of hot hatches might be too heavy, too fast and less fun than their 80s counterparts, I think it's safe to say that right now we're in another hot hatch "golden age", even if that golden age may be short-lived. However, the standard of the modern hot hatch is so high and the specs so similar, that I would be hard pushed to choose from the current crop and in all honesty, the only one that I have driven is the Golf GTI. Up until recently, I may have been tempted to go with the BMW M140i due to the USP of a straight 6 engine and RWD but with that car's demise, the choice is pretty much 2 litre turbo 4-pot with FWD or FWD-biased AWD.
So, which in your opinion is the best modern mid-size hatch for around 30k (I'm going to discount the Audi RS3/Mercedes A45 AMG/Megane Trophy R, as the level of performance is in a different league and in my opinion, they're far too expensive for what they are) and if the "best" isn't the one that you would buy, which one would you buy and why? The way I see, the current choice would look something like this.
Audi S3
VW Golf GTI/R
SEAT Leon Cupra
Mercedes A35 AMG
BMW M135i (new model)
Renault Megane RS
Peugeot 308 GTi
Honda Civic Type-R
Ford Focus ST
Hyundai i30N
Although one could argue that the latest crop of hot hatches might be too heavy, too fast and less fun than their 80s counterparts, I think it's safe to say that right now we're in another hot hatch "golden age", even if that golden age may be short-lived. However, the standard of the modern hot hatch is so high and the specs so similar, that I would be hard pushed to choose from the current crop and in all honesty, the only one that I have driven is the Golf GTI. Up until recently, I may have been tempted to go with the BMW M140i due to the USP of a straight 6 engine and RWD but with that car's demise, the choice is pretty much 2 litre turbo 4-pot with FWD or FWD-biased AWD.
So, which in your opinion is the best modern mid-size hatch for around 30k (I'm going to discount the Audi RS3/Mercedes A45 AMG/Megane Trophy R, as the level of performance is in a different league and in my opinion, they're far too expensive for what they are) and if the "best" isn't the one that you would buy, which one would you buy and why? The way I see, the current choice would look something like this.
Audi S3
VW Golf GTI/R
SEAT Leon Cupra
Mercedes A35 AMG
BMW M135i (new model)
Renault Megane RS
Peugeot 308 GTi
Honda Civic Type-R
Ford Focus ST
Hyundai i30N
I also favour the i30N, having seen a pair in Fuerteventura, recently, in black and red. I really fancied one. the coupe variant I saw in the metal today and I'm not keen on that. The downside seems to be the 275hp which is less than some others.
Though I am sure the Focus ST drives better, it looks a bit cartoonish, but that's personal taste and while I like the CTR, it only having 2 seats in the back is a dealbreaker. In terms of looks, I quite like the Megane RS though.
The sector is so competitive, at the moment, that, to be honest, I'd probably be looking at prices and deals rather than worrying which was ultimately "best".
Though I am sure the Focus ST drives better, it looks a bit cartoonish, but that's personal taste and while I like the CTR, it only having 2 seats in the back is a dealbreaker. In terms of looks, I quite like the Megane RS though.
The sector is so competitive, at the moment, that, to be honest, I'd probably be looking at prices and deals rather than worrying which was ultimately "best".
LuS1fer said:
I also favour the i30N, having seen a pair in Fuerteventura, recently, in black and red. I really fancied one. the coupe variant I saw in the metal today and I'm not keen on that. The downside seems to be the 275hp which is less than some others.
Though I am sure the Focus ST drives better, it looks a bit cartoonish, but that's personal taste and while I like the CTR, it only having 2 seats in the back is a dealbreaker. In terms of looks, I quite like the Megane RS though.
The sector is so competitive, at the moment, that, to be honest, I'd probably be looking at prices and deals rather than worrying which was ultimately "best".
You're probably right. The press really seem to rate the Civic but the looks are just too OTT for me (maybe if I was 15 years younger). The 308 is maybe a bit too much the other way and perhaps a bit off the pace. Audi S3 and Golf R both nice cars but have the "right" badge, so very unlikely to be where I left them. Oh and I just don't like the BMW. That still leaves 7 though and I don't really want to do 7 test drives! Mercedes a bit on the pricey side maybe and auto only, so I might discount that one too but you're right, on paper, there's not much in it between the others.Though I am sure the Focus ST drives better, it looks a bit cartoonish, but that's personal taste and while I like the CTR, it only having 2 seats in the back is a dealbreaker. In terms of looks, I quite like the Megane RS though.
The sector is so competitive, at the moment, that, to be honest, I'd probably be looking at prices and deals rather than worrying which was ultimately "best".
I think the i30N looks best as a hatchback in black too.
I love a hot hatch so this is a bit tongue in cheek, but...
Audi S3 - expensive, gets nicked
VW Golf GTI/R - too common, gets nicked
SEAT Leon Cupra - end of life, new one due soon
Mercedes A35 AMG- bit too bling?
BMW M135i (new model) - ugly, lost its USP
Renault Megane RS - poor interior, probably not a sensible new purchase
Peugeot 308 GTi - also-ran, weird interior, poor depreciation
Honda Civic Type-R - probably fantastic, but styling over the top
Ford Focus ST - new with good reviews but looks quite subtle/dull
Hyundai i30N - good value, supposedly fun old school FWD hot hatch.
i30N it is then. I love the Fastback, but probably a bit small for my needs unfortunately. A hot hatch should in my view be a bit rough and ragged around the edges, a bit too much power for the front wheels, bit of torque steer etc rather than being too competent! Makes it more fun!
Audi S3 - expensive, gets nicked
VW Golf GTI/R - too common, gets nicked
SEAT Leon Cupra - end of life, new one due soon
Mercedes A35 AMG- bit too bling?
BMW M135i (new model) - ugly, lost its USP
Renault Megane RS - poor interior, probably not a sensible new purchase
Peugeot 308 GTi - also-ran, weird interior, poor depreciation
Honda Civic Type-R - probably fantastic, but styling over the top
Ford Focus ST - new with good reviews but looks quite subtle/dull
Hyundai i30N - good value, supposedly fun old school FWD hot hatch.
i30N it is then. I love the Fastback, but probably a bit small for my needs unfortunately. A hot hatch should in my view be a bit rough and ragged around the edges, a bit too much power for the front wheels, bit of torque steer etc rather than being too competent! Makes it more fun!
If it has to be new then it's these two:
Focus Performance Pack ST
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
i30N Performance
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
But realistically it's these two with the lower depreciation helping cover the extra maintenance:
A45 AMG/CLA 45 with the Aero Pack:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Or the RS3:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Focus Performance Pack ST
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
i30N Performance
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
But realistically it's these two with the lower depreciation helping cover the extra maintenance:
A45 AMG/CLA 45 with the Aero Pack:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Or the RS3:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Sorry, but are they all 30K cars?? If so your premium brands will probably win over the masses, I'd sooner spend that money on an S3 for example than a Hyundai!
However... I assume they are not all the same price, the Hyundai has got a great write up, proper hot hatch stuff, grab it by the scruff of the neck, raw, simple and fun. The S3's are smart, tidy and classy, but always a bit of a detached driving experience; the Merc the more looney mobile performance offer with all that power. The new ST is supposed to be a good all rounder but it is not a pretty looking car, they ruined the lines on it all over imo, -especially the rear end. -Those lights!? WTF?
VW, yep Golf GTI as ever ticks all the boxes but looks like most other Golfs out there -mostly GTD's. Same with the R, bloody quick but perhaps a little too easy, clinical and lacking real involvement and fun? Peugeot, again like the Hyundai great fun, may be more of proper hot hatch in traditional eyes, but (badge snobs) it's a Peugeot.
To be honest I would probably have any of them depending on budgets and running costs, preference would Golf GTI, R, S3 or Hyundai. I have an Edition 30 Golf and after 6 years will always have a soft spot for a GTI. The R? I live in Cornwall, full of muddy and wet roads where 4 wheel drive is always helpful, hence the S3 also, and I do like a nice interior (my ED30 is well specced!). The Hyundai? I used to have a Clio RS 172, bloody loved that car, that or may be the Peugeot would hanker back to the proper old hot hatch root, does what it says on the tin. Simple, focused and bloody fun.
My pennies worth. I have friends/past ownership with an S3, R, Merc and GTI , so have some driving experience in them. All great cars in their own way and dependent on what ticks your box! If you have 30K to spend, what luxury. Er.... where do you start!!!???
I recently drove the Honda, Renault and Hyundai as a potential replacement for my S2000. I go against the grain a bit as I really didn’t warm to the Hyundai - even after two test drives.
Civic Type R
pros: best engine, best gearbox (by a mile), cracking seats, great ride quality, felt light and nimble.
Cons: it’s ugly. It’s massive.
Megane RS
Pros: best handling and ‘feel’. Looks good. Best sound. Interior I found fine. Some cracking deals on them at the moment.
Cons: plenty torque steer on the 300. Optional extras quickly ramp up cost.
i30n
Pros: lots of toys - all standard. Good looking. 5 year warranty.
Cons: noise, or lack of it. Dull interior. Felt bland and uninvolving.
Also test drive the Mini JCW which had a bit of character although the steering lacked any sort of feel and I’d struggle to come to terms with the image.
Ended up keeping the S2000. Nothing gave me the rawness and sense that I was connected to the machine like the S2000.
Civic Type R
pros: best engine, best gearbox (by a mile), cracking seats, great ride quality, felt light and nimble.
Cons: it’s ugly. It’s massive.
Megane RS
Pros: best handling and ‘feel’. Looks good. Best sound. Interior I found fine. Some cracking deals on them at the moment.
Cons: plenty torque steer on the 300. Optional extras quickly ramp up cost.
i30n
Pros: lots of toys - all standard. Good looking. 5 year warranty.
Cons: noise, or lack of it. Dull interior. Felt bland and uninvolving.
Also test drive the Mini JCW which had a bit of character although the steering lacked any sort of feel and I’d struggle to come to terms with the image.
Ended up keeping the S2000. Nothing gave me the rawness and sense that I was connected to the machine like the S2000.
Having test driven the Civic on two occasions I can understand what all the hype is about in the press, it really is very impressive. Appreciate the looks are very divisive, but almost as impressive as its handling etc is how usable it is, it's genuinely comfortable when not pressing on.
Pillskii said:
I recently drove the Honda, Renault and Hyundai as a potential replacement for my S2000. I go against the grain a bit as I really didn’t warm to the Hyundai - even after two test drives.
Civic Type R
pros: best engine, best gearbox (by a mile), cracking seats, great ride quality, felt light and nimble.
Cons: it’s ugly. It’s massive.
Megane RS
Pros: best handling and ‘feel’. Looks good. Best sound. Interior I found fine. Some cracking deals on them at the moment.
Cons: plenty torque steer on the 300. Optional extras quickly ramp up cost.
i30n
Pros: lots of toys - all standard. Good looking. 5 year warranty.
Cons: noise, or lack of it. Dull interior. Felt bland and uninvolving.
Also test drive the Mini JCW which had a bit of character although the steering lacked any sort of feel and I’d struggle to come to terms with the image.
Ended up keeping the S2000. Nothing gave me the rawness and sense that I was connected to the machine like the S2000.
Interesting thoughts. I'm thinking a little about changing my MK7.5 Fiesta ST for a car in the next size up, and these are the three on the shortlist primarily because I want a manual. Without having driven any of them yet, the Honda is out in front for me - I even like how it looks - but might have to check out the Renault offers. I've had assorted RS clios and a megane 250; and having driven a 1.5 diesel version hire car of the current gen megane, I thought even that was a decent steer and a decent spec'd cabin! Civic Type R
pros: best engine, best gearbox (by a mile), cracking seats, great ride quality, felt light and nimble.
Cons: it’s ugly. It’s massive.
Megane RS
Pros: best handling and ‘feel’. Looks good. Best sound. Interior I found fine. Some cracking deals on them at the moment.
Cons: plenty torque steer on the 300. Optional extras quickly ramp up cost.
i30n
Pros: lots of toys - all standard. Good looking. 5 year warranty.
Cons: noise, or lack of it. Dull interior. Felt bland and uninvolving.
Also test drive the Mini JCW which had a bit of character although the steering lacked any sort of feel and I’d struggle to come to terms with the image.
Ended up keeping the S2000. Nothing gave me the rawness and sense that I was connected to the machine like the S2000.
I've driven the new Fiesta ST, which is a cracker as well but I want something a little bigger.
(Alternatively, I could keep the Fiesta and change the Evora for a GT4, which would be a very similar cost to change. That's another thread - first world problems...)
I looked at all of the above when I was looking for a decent hot hatch (I am more of a coupe guy but they just don't make affordable fast coupe's anymore)
BMW/Mercs/VW's were straight out of the running for me they are too expensive and I'm not a fan of the looks of any of them
Peugeot/Renault - Sorry to say I'm one of them people that would not touch a french car with a barge pole
Hyundai I30N - This was my number 1 choice, test drove one loved it, I own a Hyundai at the minute and have grown quite fond of the brand BUT my best mate bought one before me and my inner snob says I can't have the same car as my best mate otherwise I'd have probably ordered one :')
Audi - Too expensive for me
Honda Type R - Not a fan of the looks or of Honda's in general
Focus ST - I did consider one of these but way out of my price range in terms of lease deals, Plus although I've heard people like it, I've not heard anyone say they loved it and consider it's £30K plus price tag and terrible lease deals it just took it out of the running for me
that left me with one choice - the Cupra, specifically the 290 Lux which I have on order
for the spec and price (900 down and £300 a month for 24months) I couldn't find anything close to it, has all the gimmicks and gadgets I want/need
Is fast enough in a straight line to put a smile on my face
I especially like the new copper accents on them and with the lux I get the Bucket seats to spice up the interior
the cupra forum seems a lot more helpful than most of the above
although it was my 2nd and maybe even third choice I still can't wait for it to arrive.... when it does arrive
would like to add if I had £30K in cash i'd probably be after something completely different and get a 2nd hand Mustang GT but hey ho :')
BMW/Mercs/VW's were straight out of the running for me they are too expensive and I'm not a fan of the looks of any of them
Peugeot/Renault - Sorry to say I'm one of them people that would not touch a french car with a barge pole
Hyundai I30N - This was my number 1 choice, test drove one loved it, I own a Hyundai at the minute and have grown quite fond of the brand BUT my best mate bought one before me and my inner snob says I can't have the same car as my best mate otherwise I'd have probably ordered one :')
Audi - Too expensive for me
Honda Type R - Not a fan of the looks or of Honda's in general
Focus ST - I did consider one of these but way out of my price range in terms of lease deals, Plus although I've heard people like it, I've not heard anyone say they loved it and consider it's £30K plus price tag and terrible lease deals it just took it out of the running for me
that left me with one choice - the Cupra, specifically the 290 Lux which I have on order
for the spec and price (900 down and £300 a month for 24months) I couldn't find anything close to it, has all the gimmicks and gadgets I want/need
Is fast enough in a straight line to put a smile on my face
I especially like the new copper accents on them and with the lux I get the Bucket seats to spice up the interior
the cupra forum seems a lot more helpful than most of the above
although it was my 2nd and maybe even third choice I still can't wait for it to arrive.... when it does arrive
would like to add if I had £30K in cash i'd probably be after something completely different and get a 2nd hand Mustang GT but hey ho :')
i30N - I am biased though.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The money kept in your pocket softens the below for some of the crap quality plastic inside the car
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The money kept in your pocket softens the below for some of the crap quality plastic inside the car
ZX10R NIN said:
If it has to be new then it's these two:
Focus Performance Pack ST
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
i30N Performance
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
But realistically it's these two with the lower depreciation helping cover the extra maintenance:
A45 AMG/CLA 45 with the Aero Pack:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Or the RS3:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
I see your point. Can't stand the old A45 though. It's the anti-Mercedes in my eyes i.e. a Mercedes should look expensive and classy, the A45 just looks cheap and chavy. RS3 not without appeal, not least for the 5-pot motor but I'd rather that engine in a TT or a used M3/C63 for that money. Not worth having a target painted on my back to drive an A3, albeit a very fast one. Focus Performance Pack ST
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
i30N Performance
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/new...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
But realistically it's these two with the lower depreciation helping cover the extra maintenance:
A45 AMG/CLA 45 with the Aero Pack:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Or the RS3:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Kev_Mk3 said:
i30N - I am biased though.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The money kept in your pocket softens the below for some of the crap quality plastic inside the car
Read your thread. Your i30 looks great. Thanks for sharing. The i30N seems very well-liked on here, so worth seeking out a test drive. https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The money kept in your pocket softens the below for some of the crap quality plastic inside the car
Metaliban said:
I looked at all of the above when I was looking for a decent hot hatch (I am more of a coupe guy but they just don't make affordable fast coupe's anymore)
BMW/Mercs/VW's were straight out of the running for me they are too expensive and I'm not a fan of the looks of any of them
Peugeot/Renault - Sorry to say I'm one of them people that would not touch a french car with a barge pole
Hyundai I30N - This was my number 1 choice, test drove one loved it, I own a Hyundai at the minute and have grown quite fond of the brand BUT my best mate bought one before me and my inner snob says I can't have the same car as my best mate otherwise I'd have probably ordered one :')
Audi - Too expensive for me
Honda Type R - Not a fan of the looks or of Honda's in general
Focus ST - I did consider one of these but way out of my price range in terms of lease deals, Plus although I've heard people like it, I've not heard anyone say they loved it and consider it's £30K plus price tag and terrible lease deals it just took it out of the running for me
that left me with one choice - the Cupra, specifically the 290 Lux which I have on order
for the spec and price (900 down and £300 a month for 24months) I couldn't find anything close to it, has all the gimmicks and gadgets I want/need
Is fast enough in a straight line to put a smile on my face
I especially like the new copper accents on them and with the lux I get the Bucket seats to spice up the interior
the cupra forum seems a lot more helpful than most of the above
although it was my 2nd and maybe even third choice I still can't wait for it to arrive.... when it does arrive
would like to add if I had £30K in cash i'd probably be after something completely different and get a 2nd hand Mustang GT but hey ho :')
Thanks worth knowing...and I was kind of looking for a decent lease deal, so will look into that. Am I right in thinking that the Cupra is DSG only now though?BMW/Mercs/VW's were straight out of the running for me they are too expensive and I'm not a fan of the looks of any of them
Peugeot/Renault - Sorry to say I'm one of them people that would not touch a french car with a barge pole
Hyundai I30N - This was my number 1 choice, test drove one loved it, I own a Hyundai at the minute and have grown quite fond of the brand BUT my best mate bought one before me and my inner snob says I can't have the same car as my best mate otherwise I'd have probably ordered one :')
Audi - Too expensive for me
Honda Type R - Not a fan of the looks or of Honda's in general
Focus ST - I did consider one of these but way out of my price range in terms of lease deals, Plus although I've heard people like it, I've not heard anyone say they loved it and consider it's £30K plus price tag and terrible lease deals it just took it out of the running for me
that left me with one choice - the Cupra, specifically the 290 Lux which I have on order
for the spec and price (900 down and £300 a month for 24months) I couldn't find anything close to it, has all the gimmicks and gadgets I want/need
Is fast enough in a straight line to put a smile on my face
I especially like the new copper accents on them and with the lux I get the Bucket seats to spice up the interior
the cupra forum seems a lot more helpful than most of the above
although it was my 2nd and maybe even third choice I still can't wait for it to arrive.... when it does arrive
would like to add if I had £30K in cash i'd probably be after something completely different and get a 2nd hand Mustang GT but hey ho :')
How fast do you want to go? If you like the A35 but think it's too expensive, have you considered an A250 AMG Line? £25k would get you a very lightly used one, 6.0 to 60, a truly fab cabin (if it's your thing - I love it) and cracking residuals. That would be my choice, and one will probably be on the drive next year. Loads of good cars to choose from, but which will 'feel' special?
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