GT86/BRZ owners thoughts please
Discussion
I have loved these since they first came out and it’s about the only car choice I can really get excited about at the moment. In the past I’ve owned a celica t sport and an mr2 roadster and they were my two favourite cars. Almost bought an FN2 civic type r GT last time around but in a slight twist I ended up with an e92 bmw 325i. The beemer has been a very good car but it is a bit grown up and much more of a cruiser than a sports car.
Looking at the GT86 in particular (not seen many brz) they do unfortunately seem to start at the top of my budget. I had almost ruled them out on the grounds that they are sooooooo expensive and there are lots of nice newer cars out there for the same or less money. But then if they hold their money it might be a wise choice, especially as I think it’s a car I would love.
My questions (or reservations) concern reliability and running costs. The bmw is actually quite efficient for a 3.0 6 pot and will return 35 mpg all day long. It would be nice if the Toyota could at least equal that. Also I’ve heard some horror stories about shoddy build quality and silly maintenance issues like changing spark plugs requiring engine out.
It would be great if anyone who has owned one could comment on what they are like to live with thanks.
Looking at the GT86 in particular (not seen many brz) they do unfortunately seem to start at the top of my budget. I had almost ruled them out on the grounds that they are sooooooo expensive and there are lots of nice newer cars out there for the same or less money. But then if they hold their money it might be a wise choice, especially as I think it’s a car I would love.
My questions (or reservations) concern reliability and running costs. The bmw is actually quite efficient for a 3.0 6 pot and will return 35 mpg all day long. It would be nice if the Toyota could at least equal that. Also I’ve heard some horror stories about shoddy build quality and silly maintenance issues like changing spark plugs requiring engine out.
It would be great if anyone who has owned one could comment on what they are like to live with thanks.
I loved them too when they finally went on sale!
There was a competition on here and 86 winners got to drive one up the Goodwood hill-climb at the UK release. I was one of the 86, but they allocated me an Auto.
But it was still a pretty good drive.
In 2014 I got a cash lump sum from taking a work-place pension early so for my birthday I had a test drive in a manual one and really liked how it drove. But I couldn't make the numbers work, so as a BMW owner for nearly a decade I went and bought a Z4 Coupe!
So I can't help with the ownership/reliability experience, but the driving experience is great!
There was a competition on here and 86 winners got to drive one up the Goodwood hill-climb at the UK release. I was one of the 86, but they allocated me an Auto.
But it was still a pretty good drive.
In 2014 I got a cash lump sum from taking a work-place pension early so for my birthday I had a test drive in a manual one and really liked how it drove. But I couldn't make the numbers work, so as a BMW owner for nearly a decade I went and bought a Z4 Coupe!
So I can't help with the ownership/reliability experience, but the driving experience is great!
had mine for 6 yrs. not a daily, but love it for what it is.
reliable. no rattles on mine (ex demo, i think they may have fixed them. but that's the point - easily fixed)
35mpg easily on average. less on a thrash, more on motorway...
no need for engine out for plugs at 60k. take to a Suburu indie for that. i'm sure even experienced Toyo dealers aren't taking engine out either.
whole point of the 86 is fun at low costs. a used Cayman is a different kettle of worms. (obligatory mention of Porsche in all sports car threads
)
reliable. no rattles on mine (ex demo, i think they may have fixed them. but that's the point - easily fixed)
35mpg easily on average. less on a thrash, more on motorway...
no need for engine out for plugs at 60k. take to a Suburu indie for that. i'm sure even experienced Toyo dealers aren't taking engine out either.
whole point of the 86 is fun at low costs. a used Cayman is a different kettle of worms. (obligatory mention of Porsche in all sports car threads
)I owned one for a while a couple of years back.
The handling was brilliant and fun.
However, I feel the engine let's it down big time. It really is gutless and doesn't even like to rev. If you compare it to say the K20 in the Civic Type R you mentioned, the K20 is by far the better engine. They both claim a similar power output but in reality the Civic will feel much quicker, sound better and be more entertaining to boot.
On top of that there are various rattles and build quality issues I was not happy with for a car at that price point. Some people also have issues with crunchy gearboxes, you take them back to Toyota and they say "it's a characteristic of the car".
Take one for a long test drive and make your mind up. I made the mistake of only going for a very short test drive, I was sold by the way the car looked and what it stood for.
The handling was brilliant and fun.
However, I feel the engine let's it down big time. It really is gutless and doesn't even like to rev. If you compare it to say the K20 in the Civic Type R you mentioned, the K20 is by far the better engine. They both claim a similar power output but in reality the Civic will feel much quicker, sound better and be more entertaining to boot.
On top of that there are various rattles and build quality issues I was not happy with for a car at that price point. Some people also have issues with crunchy gearboxes, you take them back to Toyota and they say "it's a characteristic of the car".
Take one for a long test drive and make your mind up. I made the mistake of only going for a very short test drive, I was sold by the way the car looked and what it stood for.
I had one for a while and I don't have any complaints at all.
I'm not sure where you get bad build quality from - they are perfectly fine IME
As for spark plugs - the sparks plugs are in an awkward position (boxer engine) and I've also heard its an engine out job (probably every 60-80000 miles)
The engine could be more ruthless but the light rear end makes up for that. You can have lots of fun without breaking speed limits. You should get over 30mpg in city centers. ~40mpg on motorway.
Interiors are nice... Its all about the fun though and I expect its going to be more fun than most German stuff in this category. If you need more fun then I guess youre looking at: MX5, VX220, S2 Elise, Honda S2000. All of them sacrifice space and rear seats though.
I had an FN2 Civic before the GT86 and although they are quite different cars they were both absolutely identical on the fun scale. The K20 engine vs rear wheel drive... It was impossible to choose.
The main difference is the GT86 might be more reliable as they're newer.
I'm not sure where you get bad build quality from - they are perfectly fine IME
As for spark plugs - the sparks plugs are in an awkward position (boxer engine) and I've also heard its an engine out job (probably every 60-80000 miles)
The engine could be more ruthless but the light rear end makes up for that. You can have lots of fun without breaking speed limits. You should get over 30mpg in city centers. ~40mpg on motorway.
Interiors are nice... Its all about the fun though and I expect its going to be more fun than most German stuff in this category. If you need more fun then I guess youre looking at: MX5, VX220, S2 Elise, Honda S2000. All of them sacrifice space and rear seats though.
I had an FN2 Civic before the GT86 and although they are quite different cars they were both absolutely identical on the fun scale. The K20 engine vs rear wheel drive... It was impossible to choose.
The main difference is the GT86 might be more reliable as they're newer.
Cheers for the replies.
I guess it would need a proper test drive to see. The 1.8 engine in the celica was gutless but the Vvtli made up for it in the same way as Honda vtec. But manic though! I didn’t mind the normal vvti in the mr2 as it was even lighter so felt perky enough.
For me it would be a daily driver, around 9k miles a year. That’s mainly A and B roads though with a little town and motorway use. And yes, I do need the occasional use of back seats for 4 year old and the boot with folding seats for longer items I sometimes carry so a 2 seat convertible is unfortunately out.
Can they work as a daily? I am a bit worried that it might not be so much fun on a wet winter morning when I might miss the comfort of the bmw.
Being a big fan of jap cars I wouldn’t rule out going back to look at the fn2. Might be a little older but a good 2010 type r can be had for £6k whereas the GT86 starts at around £10k for a 62 plate which is quite a big difference.
My other options at the moment are newer hot hatches but I don’t really find them all that interesting or exciting. Something like a fiesta st would probably be a better fit for me but I’m just not inspired by it.
I guess it would need a proper test drive to see. The 1.8 engine in the celica was gutless but the Vvtli made up for it in the same way as Honda vtec. But manic though! I didn’t mind the normal vvti in the mr2 as it was even lighter so felt perky enough.
For me it would be a daily driver, around 9k miles a year. That’s mainly A and B roads though with a little town and motorway use. And yes, I do need the occasional use of back seats for 4 year old and the boot with folding seats for longer items I sometimes carry so a 2 seat convertible is unfortunately out.
Can they work as a daily? I am a bit worried that it might not be so much fun on a wet winter morning when I might miss the comfort of the bmw.
Being a big fan of jap cars I wouldn’t rule out going back to look at the fn2. Might be a little older but a good 2010 type r can be had for £6k whereas the GT86 starts at around £10k for a 62 plate which is quite a big difference.
My other options at the moment are newer hot hatches but I don’t really find them all that interesting or exciting. Something like a fiesta st would probably be a better fit for me but I’m just not inspired by it.
They are super cheap to run, tyres seem to last forever. If you buy a car within 5 year warranty it can be extended every year if you want. Spark plugs change every 60,000 so probably it's only a job most owners will do once during ownership. It runs much better on super unleaded, but still I only get early 30s mpg, will do 40mpg on long trips though.
As a daily it's adequate, I would say quite a lot of road noise, awkward gearbox at low speed, and I don't like the flat spot in the engine, and round town it is sports car stiff.
However when you are driving quickly, none of this is a problem and it's one of the most fun cars I've ever driven, the chassis and steering are top notch, it's fast enough if you keep the revs up. Big boot with the seats down, bluetooth phone, keyless entry, AC, means it's very usable as well.
As a daily it's adequate, I would say quite a lot of road noise, awkward gearbox at low speed, and I don't like the flat spot in the engine, and round town it is sports car stiff.
However when you are driving quickly, none of this is a problem and it's one of the most fun cars I've ever driven, the chassis and steering are top notch, it's fast enough if you keep the revs up. Big boot with the seats down, bluetooth phone, keyless entry, AC, means it's very usable as well.
Had my 2017 GT86 for almost 2 years and covered just over 14.5k miles (car is on 17.7k total miles). I use it every day.
Other than servicing it hasn't cost me a dime in consumables, despite taking in a Nurburgring and Snetterton trackday. Still on original discs/pads and tyres which seems alien to me! Fuel economy on my short commute to work is high 20s, a 120 mile round trip yesterday taken at 70mph yielded 47mpg. Faster cruising speeds (80-90mph) will still get you around 40mpg.
Servicing costs are quite high at Toyota main dealer, £265 for a minor service and £365 for an intermediate. Intervals are 12k miles or 1 year, and they alternate between minor and intermediate. I think there's a big service at 6 years or 80k miles but I'm a while away from that just yet.
I've made 2 warranty claims which my local Toyota dealer have resolved without fuss - 4 replacement wheels as they corroded, and two front windows & window buffers. There are no squeaks or rattles, everything just works as it should.
Coming from a supercharged MINI Cooper S the engine did feel pretty gutless to begin with, but you soon learn that it just needs more revs. It's also not the most exciting engine, but I wouldn't call it slow. It was neck and neck with a friends Accord Type R on the straights at Snetterton for comparison.
Handling out of the box is good fun, but I do find it difficult to read when the roads are cold or greasy, though this is down to the factory fit Michelin Primacy tyres. It's excellent in the wet or the dry, very progressive and very predictable. Ride quality on the facelifted cars are meant to be better, I've never tried a pre facelift car so I couldn't tell you what they're like, but mine is acceptable around the lanes. It's firm but nicely damped, the complete opposite of my last MINI which was firm but very crashy.
Road noise it quite high, there's little insulation in the doors so it can get a little noisy at higher speeds. The engine is quiet and wind noise is well suppressed, it's just the tyre noise that can get a little weary (though I did do nearly 600 miles with just one stop last summer, so not that horrendous)
I have been considering whether to sell it or not as I am in the process of buying a house, but the thought of selling it actually made me feel a little sad! So I'll probably keep it for the time being.
Other than servicing it hasn't cost me a dime in consumables, despite taking in a Nurburgring and Snetterton trackday. Still on original discs/pads and tyres which seems alien to me! Fuel economy on my short commute to work is high 20s, a 120 mile round trip yesterday taken at 70mph yielded 47mpg. Faster cruising speeds (80-90mph) will still get you around 40mpg.
Servicing costs are quite high at Toyota main dealer, £265 for a minor service and £365 for an intermediate. Intervals are 12k miles or 1 year, and they alternate between minor and intermediate. I think there's a big service at 6 years or 80k miles but I'm a while away from that just yet.
I've made 2 warranty claims which my local Toyota dealer have resolved without fuss - 4 replacement wheels as they corroded, and two front windows & window buffers. There are no squeaks or rattles, everything just works as it should.
Coming from a supercharged MINI Cooper S the engine did feel pretty gutless to begin with, but you soon learn that it just needs more revs. It's also not the most exciting engine, but I wouldn't call it slow. It was neck and neck with a friends Accord Type R on the straights at Snetterton for comparison.
Handling out of the box is good fun, but I do find it difficult to read when the roads are cold or greasy, though this is down to the factory fit Michelin Primacy tyres. It's excellent in the wet or the dry, very progressive and very predictable. Ride quality on the facelifted cars are meant to be better, I've never tried a pre facelift car so I couldn't tell you what they're like, but mine is acceptable around the lanes. It's firm but nicely damped, the complete opposite of my last MINI which was firm but very crashy.
Road noise it quite high, there's little insulation in the doors so it can get a little noisy at higher speeds. The engine is quiet and wind noise is well suppressed, it's just the tyre noise that can get a little weary (though I did do nearly 600 miles with just one stop last summer, so not that horrendous)
I have been considering whether to sell it or not as I am in the process of buying a house, but the thought of selling it actually made me feel a little sad! So I'll probably keep it for the time being.
Haven’t driven one so can’t help you there, but I am looking at getting into a car again and these were on the list. However, for me, I can’t justify it due to the cost of getting into one, which I would probably have stomached but the engine is going to need work to get it to the level of power I would like, even if it did just mean a remap to get more midrange and get rid of the flat spot, but then I’m not overly convinced it’ll hold its value long term either, I think they’ll dip to 5K within a few years, just a feeling I’ve got. For less money, I think I’ll look into a BBR tuned MX5 Mk3/3.5 instead, much faster, very nearly as good handling, and drop top. Then in a few years, maybe look again when they’re 5K and get a supercharged one!
The price does bother me too.
For my 10k budget I'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel. I've seen them for 9k but they are very high mileage and I'm willing to bet in need of that expensive spark plug service.
I bought my Celica at 10 years old and 70k miles for just £3k so an 8 year old GT86 with similar miles for £10k feels a bit much. Maybe it will continue to hold value but as you say the bubble could soon burst and values plummet as people turn to turbocharged alternatives which have more power.
For my 10k budget I'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel. I've seen them for 9k but they are very high mileage and I'm willing to bet in need of that expensive spark plug service.
I bought my Celica at 10 years old and 70k miles for just £3k so an 8 year old GT86 with similar miles for £10k feels a bit much. Maybe it will continue to hold value but as you say the bubble could soon burst and values plummet as people turn to turbocharged alternatives which have more power.
TameRacingDriver said:
Haven’t driven one so can’t help you there, but I am looking at getting into a car again and these were on the list. However, for me, I can’t justify it due to the cost of getting into one, which I would probably have stomached but the engine is going to need work to get it to the level of power I would like, even if it did just mean a remap to get more midrange and get rid of the flat spot, but then I’m not overly convinced it’ll hold its value long term either, I think they’ll dip to 5K within a few years, just a feeling I’ve got. For less money, I think I’ll look into a BBR tuned MX5 Mk3/3.5 instead, much faster, very nearly as good handling, and drop top. Then in a few years, maybe look again when they’re 5K and get a supercharged one!
out the box the 86 is a bit more sporty than a 5, but the 5 can be greatly improved with FI and coilovers at reasonable cost. for any kind of daily use the 86 has a lot more practicality though. depreciation, not sure of your point there? 8 yr old car already 10k or below. seems ok, of course it will go down more...
Ran a gt86 as a daily car for nearly 2 years was great, only sold really as rear seats and leg room became too small for growing children.
They basically drive like a slightly faster mx5 which is no bad thing if ever driven an mx5, also great fun. They have most things would need in a everyday car too even heated seats so not sure why would have issues coming from BMW.
They basically drive like a slightly faster mx5 which is no bad thing if ever driven an mx5, also great fun. They have most things would need in a everyday car too even heated seats so not sure why would have issues coming from BMW.
That's definitely worth knowing thanks.
I probably wouldn't have issues coming from the BMW. Although my BMW is SE spec so quite soft really, it's also a big heavy car which makes it less fun on a twisty B road but then it does feel solid, safe and comfortable when I'm not in the mood for hooning around.
I probably wouldn't have issues coming from the BMW. Although my BMW is SE spec so quite soft really, it's also a big heavy car which makes it less fun on a twisty B road but then it does feel solid, safe and comfortable when I'm not in the mood for hooning around.
I've had mine for 4 years and 17k miles now and cannot think what I would swap her for. Unless a Supra will fit in the garage...
You will beat 35mpg on the motorway easily, and get less on B roads when you are smiling but that's what she is for. Build quality is fine. She's not cost me anything other than the annual services.
You will beat 35mpg on the motorway easily, and get less on B roads when you are smiling but that's what she is for. Build quality is fine. She's not cost me anything other than the annual services.
Thanks for everyone’s input in the thread. I didn’t know they could be so economical! I test drive one years ago it was good. But it had a fake/ piped in induction noise and I really didn’t like it in the test drive. But for all the other positives I think I would just need to live with it.
It’s between one of these and a fiesta at fir my next car I think. I do about 20k a year so what ever I have needs to be economical. Had enough of driving a boring diesel!
It’s between one of these and a fiesta at fir my next car I think. I do about 20k a year so what ever I have needs to be economical. Had enough of driving a boring diesel!
ChrisH72 said:
The price does bother me too.
For my 10k budget I'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel. I've seen them for 9k but they are very high mileage and I'm willing to bet in need of that expensive spark plug service.
I bought my Celica at 10 years old and 70k miles for just £3k so an 8 year old GT86 with similar miles for £10k feels a bit much. Maybe it will continue to hold value but as you say the bubble could soon burst and values plummet as people turn to turbocharged alternatives which have more power.
To be fair the Celica's were £16-18K new, whereas the GT86 were £25-26K new. For my 10k budget I'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel. I've seen them for 9k but they are very high mileage and I'm willing to bet in need of that expensive spark plug service.
I bought my Celica at 10 years old and 70k miles for just £3k so an 8 year old GT86 with similar miles for £10k feels a bit much. Maybe it will continue to hold value but as you say the bubble could soon burst and values plummet as people turn to turbocharged alternatives which have more power.
The best thing is the weight. Tyres last longer, decent MPG and the rear end is more fun.
I'm bored of hearing how it doesn't have enough power by people who haven't driven one. Buy an M4 if you want more power
E92 325 - 143bhp/tonne
GT86 - 165bhp/tonne
MX5 mk3 2.0 142bhp/tonne
Audi A5 2.0 TFSI (245bhp) - 160bhp/tonne
I'd be more concerned about the amount of rear seat space.
I'm bored of hearing how it doesn't have enough power by people who haven't driven one. Buy an M4 if you want more power
E92 325 - 143bhp/tonne
GT86 - 165bhp/tonne
MX5 mk3 2.0 142bhp/tonne
Audi A5 2.0 TFSI (245bhp) - 160bhp/tonne
I'd be more concerned about the amount of rear seat space.
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