Used Car with a FSH but no invoices/receipts

[anonymous-user]

Hello gents,

Just a quick one. I am looking at a car right now from a main dealership. It is a performance car, with a full service history done at yearly intervals due to the mileage (Most Main Dealer, some independent), low miles for it's age (50K at 2011), and the MOT history is superb, with no worrying notes.

All handbooks, folders, keys are with it, but there are no receipts or invoices of the work done. With it being a performance car, the use of the correct fluids and changing them on time is very important as you know.

The problem I'm facing, is that I can't view it until mid next week, and the salesman has put across the pitch of someone viewing the car today, and the only way he can guarantee it being safe, is if I buy it today.

I don't feel like blindly buying a car that I haven't seen or drove, and as stated the lack of evidence of work being done is off-putting.

Thoughts?

Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 3rd October 11:01

[n3il123]

In my experience getting anything else other than the book is the exception these days, sometimes the book is missing too "cos history is on 'puter".

[loskie]

of course someone else is coming to buy it today

[anonymous-user]

loskie said:

of course someone else is coming to buy it today

My thoughts exactly. The car has been up for about a week.. I'm thinking just wait it out, and if it's still available come my day off, then head down and have a look at it.

[sparkythecat]

It's likely that any invoices in the previous owners name will have been binned, 'cos GDPR innit'.

[anonymous-user]

Why can’t previous owners name and address be blacked out or even snipped off ? Instead of stupidly tossing valuable history?!

[steveo3002]

seems to be the norm thesedays , guess it also helps hide the ones with sketchy history too

[BugLebowski]

Always buy on condition. Sounds like the salesperson is trying to force you into buying unseen which would put me right off. A fully stamped service book is always good but it's not exactly fool proof either.

[ZX10R NIN]

If it goes it wasn't meant to be, on the flipside if it's still for sale when you're able to view then you're in the box seat.

[Trevor555]

TrackDays29 said:

Hello gents,

Just a quick one. I am looking at a car right now from a main dealership. It is a performance car, with a full service history done at yearly intervals due to the mileage (Most Main Dealer, some independent), low miles for it's age (50K at 2011), and the MOT history is superb, with no worrying notes.

I don't feel like blindly buying a car that I haven't seen or drove, and as stated the lack of evidence of work being done is off-putting.

Thoughts?

Edited by TrackDays29 on Saturday 3rd October 11:01

It sounds like it could be a good one.

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

If they do, a simple chargeback on your credit card, print the advert off, and you'll need to request the deposit back from the dealer before the credit company will act.

If you buy the car you may be able to visit the dealers to get a print out of invoices. Most will say they wont do it anymore due to GDRP. But if you offer to pay for their time they may print them all off and simply tear off the bit showing the customers details.

This GDPR thing is awful for cars histories. I've seen plenty of dealers simply chuck it straight in the bin when I've delivered a car.

[HTP99]

Trevor555 said:

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

It isn't a distance sale if you go and see it and you do not have "the right" to cancel!

[anonymous-user]

Trevor555 said:

If you buy the car you may be able to visit the dealers to get a print out of invoices. Most will say they wont do it anymore due to GDRP. But if you offer to pay for their time they may print them all off and simply tear off the bit showing the customers details.

This GDPR thing is awful for cars histories. I've seen plenty of dealers simply chuck it straight in the bin when I've delivered a car.

Thanks for that. I've been doing some digging around, and it would appear the majority of main dealers now do actually just throw the invoices into the bin due to GDPR, and keep the service book.

I have a good feeling about it, as he has just sent a 'personal' video of the vehicle, and it does look in excellent condition.

Basically mentioned that there is a lot interest in it. Probably true, and the previous owner's pride and joy, but apparently had to get rid of it due to his age and the stiff suspension wasn't good enough for him anymore.

Last service had the usual lubrication, oil and filter changes. They will be doing a service of their own before sale because it is due again in November. It has only did 2K Miles since the previous. 6 Months warranty as standard which is a bonus.

He told me it wouldn't be refundable because they could be potentially losing a sale between now and waiting for me checking it out next week.

Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 3rd October 13:37

[Trevor555]

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

It isn't a distance sale if you go and see it and you do not have "the right" to cancel!

You're a car dealer aren't you?

It's a distance sale up until the point you go and view the car, and can cancel at that point on seeing the car in person.

If you don't agree I suggest you have a google of the distance sale regulations.

Edited by Trevor555 on Saturday 3rd October 13:47

[HTP99]

Trevor555 said:

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

It isn't a distance sale if you go and see it and you do not have "the right" to cancel!

You're a car dealer aren't you?

It's a distance sale up until the point you go and view the car.

If you don't agree I suggest you have a google of the distance sale regulations.

Yes, I know what a distance sale is, however what you have written is suggesting it is a distance sale due to leaving a deposit over the phone, go and see it and you are still covered under distance selling regs, when you aren't.

[Trevor555]

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

It isn't a distance sale if you go and see it and you do not have "the right" to cancel!

You're a car dealer aren't you?

It's a distance sale up until the point you go and view the car.

If you don't agree I suggest you have a google of the distance sale regulations.

Yes, I know what a distance sale is, however what you have written is suggesting it is a distance sale due to leaving a deposit over the phone, go and see it and you are still covered under distance selling regs, when you aren't.

Do you keep peoples deposits then if they turn up to see the car and don't like it having deposited over the phone?

[HTP99]

Trevor555 said:

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

HTP99 said:

Trevor555 said:

Deposit it over the phone with a credit card, it'll be a distance sale.

Go and view the car, you have the right to cancel at that point and get the deposit back if the car's not to your liking.

Pretty much all dealers know this so won't fight you in returning the deposit.

It isn't a distance sale if you go and see it and you do not have "the right" to cancel!

You're a car dealer aren't you?

It's a distance sale up until the point you go and view the car.

If you don't agree I suggest you have a google of the distance sale regulations.

Yes, I know what a distance sale is, however what you have written is suggesting it is a distance sale due to leaving a deposit over the phone, go and see it and you are still covered under distance selling regs, when you aren't.

Do you keep peoples deposits then if they turn up to see the car and don't like it having deposited over the phone?

We don't "hold" cars for people with a deposit, a deposit is a commitment to buy it, we clearly explain to people that if they want to leave a deposit then they are buying it.

We do accurately describe the car, send photo's if they wish and detail the service history, if they turn up and the alloys are trashed or there is huge scratch down the side or the service history description was all lies, so therefore the car wasn't as described, then they can have their money back, we don't refund their deposit if they decide they don't like the drive/don't like the colour/have others to see/want to think about it/re-negotiate etc, but they would know this as it would have been explained on the phone or via e-mail.

Had one yesterday, he missed out on a car last week, he cobbled a bit more money together and expressed an interest in an alternative that we had, he even said in his e-mail that if it was as clean and tidy as the pictures suggest and the history was all up to scratch, he would leave a deposit for it over the phone, as he'd already missed out on the other one.

I re-iterated that it was a commitment to buy the car, he rang me to clarify as he was a bit confused as a dealer near him was happy to hold 2 for him until he'd gone to see them, it turns out that the car was for his wife and to cart the kids about, they had driven one, but they had not actually looked in the boot and not tried the kids in the back "oh I have a friend with one, we will try his".

E-mailed me back, thanking me for what I'd done so far and for my suggestion that he looks a bit more into it, the kids do fit, the boot is big enough and it is what they want, but his wife wants a black one, ours is grey.

[Jefferson Steelflex]

For the OPs benefit, I had a similar situation with my Merc R129 in that some of the service stamps weren't supported by any receipts. Although some of them were from 2011-15 I still thought I'd contact the (same) garage where the stamp had come from - they found the invoices, blanked out the name and address of the customer, and scanned them over to me. I received 4 invoices in total, and luckily no surprises on any of the work done. In fact, I found that some items had been replaced that I hadn't known about, so added peace of mind.

I'd never rely on a stamp in a book, there are no GDPR issues with receiving an anonymised invoice if that is a concern for the supplying garage, and they should have copies of invoices/receipts going back a number of years.

[anonymous-user]

Thanks for the replies. Just a quick update. I decided to get a pre-purchase inspection done, and the only problems the mechanic found were the tailgate has been repainted, slight kerbing on the alloys, and the drivers seat bolster is slightly worn down. Diagnostic tool came back with no problems as well.

Oh, and he says there is actually an aftermarket mod on it too. I don't know much about that side of things, but he tells me it's a K&N Air Filter.

This was supposed to be an 'unspoilt' example, so I hope there are no other mods as well.

It's a Honda Civic Type R FN2. Anyone have any knowledge in this area?





A standard engine bay in comparison as far as I am aware.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 6th October 22:22

[ALawson]

K&N probably makes a bit more noise and a few BHP, should be reversible if the original parts are included. Other mod may be more of a PIA to reverse.

Both need declaring to insurance company.

[defblade]

I doubt the K&N has added anything but noise, and probably lost a few BHP as it's just sitting in half the airbox so will be pulling plenty of hot engine bay air in as well.
All the hoses replaced with bright red silicone ones (compared to the example you posted). A different oil cap, too.
Has been owned by someone who likes to fiddle about a bit, I'd say... at that stage I'd rather buy from the owner than a garage, so I could get a feel for whether they spent all the budget on bling rather than boring routine servicing... and ask them things like "why did you dump a K&N into half the airbox"?


Might be a perfectly good car, but I'd approach with caution and certainly not be rushed by the salesman. Although it's not the most common car ever, they did make more than one of them