Purchased car, found faults, dealer doesnt want to know
Discussion
Hi,
I have (sadly) purchased a car (in a rush) and am now regretting it. Since taking ownership of the car a little over a week ago ive found what I deem to be several faults with the car, however the dealer is being very obstinate and they are claiming that the vehicle is fine and passed their "pre sales checks".
I spoke with them several times about my desire to return (reject) the car and they are basically stonewalling me and have had a legal consultinacy firm acting on their behalf, contact me to state that I have no grounds to return the car under the 2015 CRA.
I am getting so stressed and anxious about this situation now I really dont know where to turn. I am no legal expert so I dont know where I stand.
They have since told me to get a engineers report done on the car so that I can "back up my allegations", however even if that report comes back as long as a shopping list, I am not confident of any resoluition.
Any help or guidance would be greatfully recieved.
Thanks,
Ben.
I have (sadly) purchased a car (in a rush) and am now regretting it. Since taking ownership of the car a little over a week ago ive found what I deem to be several faults with the car, however the dealer is being very obstinate and they are claiming that the vehicle is fine and passed their "pre sales checks".
I spoke with them several times about my desire to return (reject) the car and they are basically stonewalling me and have had a legal consultinacy firm acting on their behalf, contact me to state that I have no grounds to return the car under the 2015 CRA.
I am getting so stressed and anxious about this situation now I really dont know where to turn. I am no legal expert so I dont know where I stand.
They have since told me to get a engineers report done on the car so that I can "back up my allegations", however even if that report comes back as long as a shopping list, I am not confident of any resoluition.
Any help or guidance would be greatfully recieved.
Thanks,
Ben.
Speak to your local trading standards. Might need to search your council's website. Also speak to your local citizen's advice bureau.
Might also want to list the faults here just to get feedback from PHers. If it's "tyres are nearly due for replacement" then that's not really something you can deal with as that should have been negotiated at the time. If it's "keeps stalling at the lights" then they need to sort it out.
FYI even "sold as seen" part-ex cars need to be covered by them. https://www.google.com/search?q=trade+sale+sold+as...
It's also interesting that they've got a legal firm in on the act already. It's like they've done this before!
Might also want to list the faults here just to get feedback from PHers. If it's "tyres are nearly due for replacement" then that's not really something you can deal with as that should have been negotiated at the time. If it's "keeps stalling at the lights" then they need to sort it out.
FYI even "sold as seen" part-ex cars need to be covered by them. https://www.google.com/search?q=trade+sale+sold+as...
It's also interesting that they've got a legal firm in on the act already. It's like they've done this before!
Edited by Hoofy on Friday 17th December 13:59
What Car said:
(Within 30 days of purchase) The law states that a vehicle must be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. If it’s not, you’re entitled to hand it back and get all your money refunded. It’s worth noting, though, that the seller might not accept your rejection, in which case you'll have to start court proceedings against them if you want a refund.
To be of satisfactory quality, a car must not be faulty or broken when purchased, and it must be of a standard that a reasonable person would expect, taking into account its age and mileage if it’s secondhand.
https://www.whatcar.com/news/your-legal-rights-if-...To be of satisfactory quality, a car must not be faulty or broken when purchased, and it must be of a standard that a reasonable person would expect, taking into account its age and mileage if it’s secondhand.
I think your next step should be to try and get a second independent opinion about the faults you've found. If you have a local garage perhaps they could examine the car and give an estimate for repairing the issues?
You could also try telling us here what the faults are in detail, you may get a range of views but at least gives some context.
If other people agree that the issues mean it's not of satisfactory quality, as described, and fit for purpose, then I'd try and get the engineer's report and see what it says, then go back to the dealer and press your claim.
Thanks for the replies so far. Its a 2011 Passat Diesel with 101,000 on the clock. I paid 5500 for it.
There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me.
There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time).
The steering pulls to the right side.
There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake.
I did test drive the car, but none of these faults were evident when I was pootling around their estate at 30mph.
I have an RAC inspection booked for next week.
There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me.
There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time).
The steering pulls to the right side.
There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake.
I did test drive the car, but none of these faults were evident when I was pootling around their estate at 30mph.
I have an RAC inspection booked for next week.
I'll try to clumsily quote/reply from my understanding of cars.
"There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward."
Is this all the time? (I notice it on most cars when starting up.)
If all the time and when moving mainly when reversing, make sure the boot lid is properly closed/sealed. When idle can you see exhaust fumes coming out from anything other than the exhaust eg in the engine bay?
Have you tried driving it at a constant speed down a motorway for 30 minutes just to make sure the DPF is clear (as above).
"The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me."
Sounds dodgy!
"There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time)."
Not sure what that's about. What kind of warning? Got a pic?
"The steering pulls to the right side."
Might need realigning at a local tyre place. Should be cheap.
"There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake."
Is it hotter than the others when you go for a drive? Could be a stuck caliper. Is the disc worn more? How much brake pad is left?
I'm sure other more informed car mechanics will be along shortly to correct me if I'm talking b
ks. 
"There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward."
Is this all the time? (I notice it on most cars when starting up.)
If all the time and when moving mainly when reversing, make sure the boot lid is properly closed/sealed. When idle can you see exhaust fumes coming out from anything other than the exhaust eg in the engine bay?
Have you tried driving it at a constant speed down a motorway for 30 minutes just to make sure the DPF is clear (as above).
"The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me."
Sounds dodgy!
"There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time)."
Not sure what that's about. What kind of warning? Got a pic?
"The steering pulls to the right side."
Might need realigning at a local tyre place. Should be cheap.
"There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake."
Is it hotter than the others when you go for a drive? Could be a stuck caliper. Is the disc worn more? How much brake pad is left?
I'm sure other more informed car mechanics will be along shortly to correct me if I'm talking b
ks. ben_uk1981 said:
There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
This is an MOT fail right away - I had an Alfa Romeo 147 diesel with this problem:"Do not drive until repaired (dangerous defects): Front Exhaust fumes causing a danger to health of persons on board front exhaust flexy leak (6.1.2 (b) (ii))"
This means they have sold you an unroadworthy car and you have a right to reject it.
Go to citizens advice, trading standards, get a trained law professional involved.
ben_uk1981 said:
Hi,
I spoke with them several times about my desire to return (reject) the car and they are basically stonewalling me and have had a legal consultinacy firm acting on their behalf, contact me to state that I have no grounds to return the car under the 2015 CRA.
Ben.
This legal firm that's contacted you.I spoke with them several times about my desire to return (reject) the car and they are basically stonewalling me and have had a legal consultinacy firm acting on their behalf, contact me to state that I have no grounds to return the car under the 2015 CRA.
Ben.
You've told them you have faults with the car and they've said you have no right to return the car under the 2015 CRA?
There's some legal people on here. I'd like to know their thoughts on that approach.
And I'm sure who ever regulates these types of firms will be interested also.
georgeyboy12345 said:
ben_uk1981 said:
There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
This is an MOT fail right away - I had an Alfa Romeo 147 diesel with this problem:"Do not drive until repaired (dangerous defects): Front Exhaust fumes causing a danger to health of persons on board front exhaust flexy leak (6.1.2 (b) (ii))"
This means they have sold you an unroadworthy car and you have a right to reject it.
Go to citizens advice, trading standards, get a trained law professional involved.
So not necessarily a MOT fail
You had an Alfa, with a leaking exhaust. The OP has not said the exhaust is leaking.
Binding front caliper probably, pulling to that side.
Diesel smell in car, or exhaust fumes?
Diesel smell could be a leak, possibly in return line.
Exhaust smell could be a hole in exhaust under car.
In any case, did it get a new MOT when you bought it?
£50 could be a quick way to prove it’s currently unroadworthy.
Diesel smell in car, or exhaust fumes?
Diesel smell could be a leak, possibly in return line.
Exhaust smell could be a hole in exhaust under car.
In any case, did it get a new MOT when you bought it?
£50 could be a quick way to prove it’s currently unroadworthy.
ben_uk1981 said:
Thanks for the replies so far. Its a 2011 Passat Diesel with 101,000 on the clock. I paid 5500 for it.
There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me.
There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time).
The steering pulls to the right side.
There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake.
I did test drive the car, but none of these faults were evident when I was pootling around their estate at 30mph.
I have an RAC inspection booked for next week.
The loose rear suspension and the pulling to one side could both be alignment related. Certainly taking it for an alignment should help clarify whether (a) it can be easily fixed and (b) there are any more fundamental suspension issues.There is a smell of diesel fumes in the cabin (could be self producing or could be from outside, like when following a truck / bus). I can smell it more when reversing but not so much when going forward.
The rear suspension seems very slidy. I have had the great opportunity of driving a FWD rally car before, but ive never felt a car at the rear like this. Going at 70mph on a bumpy flyover motorway was interesting with the rear floating around behind me.
There is a start / stop warning every time you start the engine (but it does start every time).
The steering pulls to the right side.
There seems to be a scraping noise coming from the front right brake.
I did test drive the car, but none of these faults were evident when I was pootling around their estate at 30mph.
I have an RAC inspection booked for next week.
Is the scraping brake noise all the time, or just when braking? Could be the disc is rusty on the inside face?
The start/stop warning could be the battery being low on charge/old, or possibly just the cold temperatures? Or if the smell is DPF regen related, the start/stop could be the same as that?
The RAC inspection is a good start I think, see what they say and go from there.
Thanks for all the replies so far.
Yep, this is a fail on my part really, so I hold my hands up that I should have test driven it some more.
I only did a very short test drive around the industrial estate that the dealer was based on, so nothing high speed etc.
I have the RAC man coming tomorrow so we will see what he says.
Thanks again.
Yep, this is a fail on my part really, so I hold my hands up that I should have test driven it some more.
I only did a very short test drive around the industrial estate that the dealer was based on, so nothing high speed etc.
I have the RAC man coming tomorrow so we will see what he says.
Thanks again.
Canon_Fodder said:
The RAC inspection is the right call OP.
If that provides solid evidence of faults then I believe they will accept the rejection.
I take the fact that they have a legal adviser as an encouraging sign.
I would have a guess the legal advisor is in fact Bert in the pub who learnt his trade on Internet forums If that provides solid evidence of faults then I believe they will accept the rejection.
I take the fact that they have a legal adviser as an encouraging sign.
Looking at an explanation of the cra2015 from here
https://www.themotorombudsman.org/knowledge-base/w...
The rac inspection should be revealing one way or other.
Ian
https://www.themotorombudsman.org/knowledge-base/w...
Motor Ombudsman said:
Within the first 30 days, if there’s a problem that means your car doesn’t meet these standards, it develops a serious fault or you find that it isn’t what was advertised to you, you can raise this with the seller and ask for your money back. In this instance, you will be entitled to a full refund.
...
It’s worth bearing in mind that, if the issue occurs in the first six months after buying the car, it’s up to the selling dealership or garage to prove that it was of satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described when they sold it to you. However, if you want to reject your car for a full refund within the first 30 days, or the problem happens six months or more after you bought the vehicle, you – the consumer, needs to be able to prove that the car was not of satisfactory quality, unfit for purpose or not as described when you bought it. This will normally be through either a diagnosis from a garage or dealership, or an independent technical report. You can find more information about independent technical reports here.
So at this point, the garage won't take your word for it that there are serious faults present. This seems consistent with the above....
It’s worth bearing in mind that, if the issue occurs in the first six months after buying the car, it’s up to the selling dealership or garage to prove that it was of satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described when they sold it to you. However, if you want to reject your car for a full refund within the first 30 days, or the problem happens six months or more after you bought the vehicle, you – the consumer, needs to be able to prove that the car was not of satisfactory quality, unfit for purpose or not as described when you bought it. This will normally be through either a diagnosis from a garage or dealership, or an independent technical report. You can find more information about independent technical reports here.
The rac inspection should be revealing one way or other.
Ian
Yes, the report found that there were hazourdous fumes entering the cockpit, plus oil leaks, poor tracking and other bits.
My worry now, is that with the Christmas shut down everything is closed and my 30 days return window is rapidly closing. I have already posted written letters with the report and backed that up with emails to both the dealer and his "legal team".
Anyone know the fine details of that 30 days aspect? If you signal your intent within 30 days is that enough or does the refund / transaction have to be compelted within 30 days total? My 30 days expires on the 6th of Jan, so I may be in trouble if thats the case.
My worry now, is that with the Christmas shut down everything is closed and my 30 days return window is rapidly closing. I have already posted written letters with the report and backed that up with emails to both the dealer and his "legal team".
Anyone know the fine details of that 30 days aspect? If you signal your intent within 30 days is that enough or does the refund / transaction have to be compelted within 30 days total? My 30 days expires on the 6th of Jan, so I may be in trouble if thats the case.
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