Thoughts? Clio RS200 vs Fiesta ST

[subbacultcha]

Hi PH'ers...

Something that has probably been done to death on here but i'll start up a new thread...

Thinking of spending around £8-9k on a hot hatch.

Currently thinking is Clio RS200 or Fiesta ST.

To me the ST is a better car - maybe not quite as good as the 200 but as an all rounder much better and you seem to get a lot newer car for your money? The 200's seem to have horror stories about the gearbox as well but that could just be forums doing forum things...

Any thoughts / advice would be appreciated... as would any other ideas around that money.

Cheers !

[Rawhide]

I love a good Renaultsport Clio, and have had four in total. The Clio RS200 has such lovely balance and steering, but I never entirely gelled with it as a daily package. It felt underpowered compared with the Clio 182, was hard to get off the line without bucking etc, I was scared of ripping the beautiful Recaro seat fabric, and lusted for an engine transplant. The gearbox felt sloppy and I worried about it's longevity though this is a problem with most of the Clios I believe.

My example was mint, but I was indifferent to see it go. I didn't lose a penny on it so no regrets.

[The Rotrex Kid]

Are you talking Clio 3 (2.0 NA Manual 3 door) or Clio 4 (1.6T EDC 5 door)?

[subbacultcha]

The Rotrex Kid said:

Are you talking Clio 3 (2.0 NA Manual 3 door) or Clio 4 (1.6T EDC 5 door)?

ah good shout - the Clio 3 bud.

have heard some terrible things about the gearbox on the 4.

[Networkgeek]

Hello OP

I can't say anything about the Fiesta ST, as I haven't been in one before. I can however talk about the RS200, as I have one. I daily drive an M2 and I've kept onto my Clio, that's how good they are.

In everyday life, the Fiesta will be a much better car. Only really because they have a lot more torque from the 1.6T engine, but the Clio has a very old-school, hot hatch feel about it. The engine wants to be revved, the chassis is so sweet and the brakes are very good (on the cup model).

I love relatively low-powered hot hatches, especially those with wide arches and a manual gearbox.

Neg -

- 3rd and 4th synchro will need to be fixed. But it's not expensive, I've had mine done
- Crashy suspension on rough roads (Cup model only)
- Lacks low-down torque for daily driving

Pos -

- Wide arches
- Big brembo brakes (cup model)
- Incredible handling
- Cheap to repair and run
- They sound fantastic for a 4 cylinder

I love my Clio, I intend to keep it for a few more years and it'll outstay my M2. The M2 is great, but it lacks the chuckable character of the Clio.

Writing this makes me want to go for a hoon, but icy roads and I have work to do

[Stallzy]

subbacultcha said:

Hi PH'ers...

Something that has probably been done to death on here but i'll start up a new thread...

Thinking of spending around £8-9k on a hot hatch.

Currently thinking is Clio RS200 or Fiesta ST.

To me the ST is a better car - maybe not quite as good as the 200 but as an all rounder much better and you seem to get a lot newer car for your money? The 200's seem to have horror stories about the gearbox as well but that could just be forums doing forum things...

Any thoughts / advice would be appreciated... as would any other ideas around that money.

Cheers !

In a sort of similar situation myself, but looking for something maybe less hot and with more practicality or comfort options. STs seem great but you gotta make sure you get security sorted imo early. My area doesn't seem to be too bad for it but travelling out and parking somewhere, it would be some peace of mind.

208 GTI gets recommended a lot but don't have much experience. Also ZX10R NIN on here seems to really like the Megane RS cars the most. There's quite a lot of suggestions in my "Not driven for 3 years - second car advice" which is now on page 2, nearly page 3 as I'm going to have to pause my car searching a bit over the next few weeks or maybe into late January as don't really think right before or after Christmas is good timing for a multitude of reasons, both in terms of personal safety and also sorting out insurance and paperwork etc with the mail strikes, and having less options to travel with the rail strikes too.

I'll link it if you want to have a quick skim through at the suggestions: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Most options probably got exhausted there to be fair lol, but still some more suggestions like a Suzuki Swift Sport (SSS) or Mazda 3 / MPS have come up from me reading other threads.

I'm still quite confused in what direction to go with my own search lol so will be interesting to see what direction you go

[subbacultcha]

Stallzy said:

208 GTI gets recommended a lot but don't have much experience. Also ZX10R NIN on here seems to really like the Megane RS cars the most.

would be super interested in the 208 (ex 309 GTI and 306 Rallye owner!) but I just can't face that stupid steering wheel...

megane is a good shout, will look into that - cheers!

[Stallzy]

subbacultcha said:

would be super interested in the 208 (ex 309 GTI and 306 Rallye owner!) but I just can't face that stupid steering wheel...

megane is a good shout, will look into that - cheers!

Yeah, I'm not too sure about it either, or the position of the dials lol. I need to get out and see a good selection of these cars in person, but I may get drawn to something like a VW Up or MK8 Fiesta St and then just end the search there lol, but probs is worth assessing all the options.

Oh, also the 308 GTI maybe but that might also have the same steering wheel and dial setup lol

[g40steve]

Stallzy said:

Yeah, I'm not too sure about it either, or the position of the dials lol. I need to get out and see a good selection of these cars in person, but I may get drawn to something like a VW Up or MK8 Fiesta St and then just end the search there lol, but probs is worth assessing all the options.

Oh, also the 308 GTI maybe but that might also have the same steering wheel and dial setup lol

MK 8.5 here, reminds me of my Clio Trophy from 2006 but updated with every bit of kit




I have had lots of RS’s clio & meggy etc but the HFS on the ST in this weather is worth sooo much, OP go & test them the ST has bags of extra kit

[mikeswagon]

subbacultcha said:

The Rotrex Kid said:

Are you talking Clio 4 (2.0 NA Manual 3 door) or Clio 5 (1.6T EDC 5 door)?

ah good shout - the Clio 4 bud.

have heard some terrible things about the gearbox on the 5.

Clio 200, mk3 is 2.0 manual, mk4 is the 1.6 edc.

I've got a '11 200 Cup. Didn't specifically go out looking for a Cup, but after looking for ages during lockdown, this one came up with decent miles/price etc. Most of the lightweight things I can live with, but I wish they'd left front fogs and reach adjust on the steering. You always here the negatives about a particular model online, I'm on 73k and the gearbox seems fine. With a mixture of A roads and town driving I get 34mpg, not great but I expected as much.

I suspect the ST might be easier to live with day to day, having the turbo.

Requoted with the original numbers from yesterday so I don't think I'm losing any more marbles.

Edited by mikeswagon on Tuesday 13th December 10:10

[navmangt]

Networkgeek said:

..... brakes are very good (on the cup model).

....
- Big brembo brakes (cup model)

All 197s and 200s got the same brake setup as far as I'm aware, 4 pot calipers up front either painted red or not depending if you ticked the cup option.

[Networkgeek]

navmangt said:

All 197s and 200s got the same brake setup as far as I'm aware, 4 pot calipers up front either painted red or not depending if you ticked the cup option.

I didn't know that, I saw the red callipers on the Cup pack cars and assumed they were better.

[Stallzy]

g40steve said:

MK 8.5 here, reminds me of my Clio Trophy from 2006 but updated with every bit of kit




I have had lots of RS’s clio & meggy etc but the HFS on the ST in this weather is worth sooo much, OP go & test them the ST has bags of extra kit

Ooh, beautiful! I never was particularly keen on red cars but at least from photos, I'm tempted. Need to see them in person haha. I was a huge fan of Magnetic Grey for years and that's the colour I had on my Fiesta (ST-Line 140 7.5), but I don't think I could have another car in the same colour or maybe grey at all next lol as I fancy a change. Steering more towards black or blue but red may be an option.

Also not sure about 3 door / 5 door. 5 door would be handy if I needed to drive friends once I had more confidence, but at least with the MK7.5 and also my instructor's cars, I feel like looking over your shoulder to check the rear blindspot is harder because of the divide between the doors, if that makes sense.

Also what does HFS mean because I can't figure it out

[Canon_Fodder]

Stallzy said:

Also what does HFS mean because I can't figure it out

Heated Front Screen.

A little Ford touch that is quite useful in cold climates

[ZX10R NIN]

subbacultcha said:

Hi PH'ers...

Something that has probably been done to death on here but i'll start up a new thread...

Thinking of spending around £8-9k on a hot hatch.

Currently thinking is Clio RS200 or Fiesta ST.

To me the ST is a better car - maybe not quite as good as the 200 but as an all rounder much better and you seem to get a lot newer car for your money? The 200's seem to have horror stories about the gearbox as well but that could just be forums doing forum things...

Any thoughts / advice would be appreciated... as would any other ideas around that money.

Cheers !

The Fiesta a cracking modern small hot hatch the N/A Clio 197/200 with the Cup Chassis imo the best small hot hatch big engine small body combo.

I'll list a couple of alternates first that are very good modern hot hatches.

DS3 Performance (same car as the 208 GTI) 205:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202208168...

Peugeot Sport 208 GTI:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202212082...

Out of the full size hot hatches the Astra GTC VXR is the pick unless you can find a Cup Chassis RS250/265:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202212112...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202211111...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202211231...

Edited by ZX10R NIN on Monday 12th December 21:08

[CG2020UK]

subbacultcha said:

would be super interested in the 208 (ex 309 GTI and 306 Rallye owner!) but I just can't face that stupid steering wheel...

megane is a good shout, will look into that - cheers!

I’ve had 2 208GTIs and love them.

I get some people like the steering wheel and some just don’t. However a lot don’t set it up right. The key to remember is you look over the top of the wheel to see the dials instead of through it then it works brilliantly, it’s like a permanent heads up display.

Brilliant cars that are very good to live with and proper fun. Quicker than the ST or RS200. Very good spec and easily best in class interior, more roomy than the Fiesta I had before. You’ll get +40mpg out of one, they are reliable and it’s not a thief magnet. It also sounds nicer than the Mk7 ST.

It offers a different flavour of hot hatch to the RS200 or ST so would definitely recommend a test drive for sure.

Edited by CG2020UK on Monday 12th December 20:58

[ChrisH72]

HFS = Heated Front Screen. A Ford feature which is really handy in this weather if your car lives outside.

I have a mk7.5 ST3



A few years ago I did have a test drive of a Clio RS200 and was quite impressed. It felt pretty raw and old school but in the end I went down a different route with a BMW. I've had the Fiesta over 2 years now and can't fault it. It really is a proper laugh to chuck around and has always felt plenty quick enough in standard form to me. As well as the heated screen it has heated seats which are very toastie on these cold mornings. A heated wheel would be nice which I believe the mk8 ST3 has. I keep looking at the mk8 but they're still £15k whereas my 7.5 is only worth half that but feels like more than half the car.

[LightningBlue]

Stallzy said:

g40steve said:

Also not sure about 3 door / 5 door. 5 door would be handy if I needed to drive friends once I had more confidence, but at least with the MK7.5 and also my instructor's cars, I feel like looking over your shoulder to check the rear blindspot is harder because of the divide between the doors, if that makes sense.

Personally I’ve never given a thought about anyone wanting to get in - it’s my car and I’d rather get something that works for me. With any three door I’ve just asked rear passengers to get in the passenger side so it doesn’t mess up my seat position, it’s your car so get what you prefer the look of, and 3 doors hatches are usually sleeker looking than 5.

[acme]

I’ve had a 2017 ST3 for almost four years. Pound for pound a great car.

A few issues to ensure you’re happy with; the recaros aren’t great, the seat bolsters are angled at 45 degrees so you loose a big chunk of the seat & they make a Yaris GR’s supposedly lofty perch more akin to a Capri! Yep they’re that bad. And I am slim.

The ride is not so much stiff as crashy especially at low speed, and I deliberately got a late one to benefit from
the ST200’s suspension which is allegedly better.

Though on motorways it’s not too bad.

Lots of buttons around the stereo but it’s fine and much better than a touch screen.

Beware the black hole of death behind the handbrake where you can loose all sorts of things, I knew beforehand and still dropped my keys down it!

I’ll add I’m hardly the target audience age wise, & you have to accept being associated with yoofs with loud exhausts, it makes me laugh!

Enjoy.

[subbacultcha]

thanks for all the replies folks - all very useful !