Ten year car - keep an E39 or buy an F31 or G31?
Discussion
Hi all,
Could do with some thoughts with a conundrum I am currently having. I have a self-imposed desire to not buy a post 2024 car for the next 10 to 15 years as I don’t want to have the nannying electronics etc, nor do I want all the controls on a screen – I want buttons!
I currently have a 2024 Cupra Born as a company car which I like and am tempted to buy at the end of the lease in 18 months’ time. This would likely become my wife’s car to replace hers. It would suit 99% of her driving so it would be a good match.
That leaves me working out what to do for my car. I currently have a E39 530i Touring, which I do enjoy using It always seems to need ‘something’, but I am willing to accept that as it is an older car and cars always need maintaining regardless of age. I accept that is applies to any of the options below.
I’ve been having thoughts about selling it and replacing it with a newer touring/estate to match the 10 to 15 years life mentioned above. For this, assume I do 10,000 miles a year. I feel there are the following options:
1) Keep the E39. Its currently on 105,000 miles so 15 years use would take it to 250,000 miles. I’m sure the car is capable, but maintaining it will become more expensive as it gets (even) older.
2) Buy a F31 340i. The boot space is similar to the E39, but obviously newer. From research the B58 engines are reliable. I’d look to buy one at around 50,000 miles, so would end up at around 200,000 miles.
3) Buy a G31 540i. The boot space is bigger than both the E39 & F31 which would be good, and I suspect a 5 series would be more comfortable. Again, I believe the B58 engines to be reliable. One concern I do have is that the 540i’s all seem to be X-drive which may add complications to deal with. I’d look to buy one at around 50,000 miles, so would end up at around 200,000 miles.
4) Wildcard suggestion: Mk4 Focus ST estate (pre facelift)
5) Anything the good people of Pistonheads suggest!
So if you’ve got any thoughts to help me see a solution, I’m all ears!
Thanks, Matt
Could do with some thoughts with a conundrum I am currently having. I have a self-imposed desire to not buy a post 2024 car for the next 10 to 15 years as I don’t want to have the nannying electronics etc, nor do I want all the controls on a screen – I want buttons!
I currently have a 2024 Cupra Born as a company car which I like and am tempted to buy at the end of the lease in 18 months’ time. This would likely become my wife’s car to replace hers. It would suit 99% of her driving so it would be a good match.
That leaves me working out what to do for my car. I currently have a E39 530i Touring, which I do enjoy using It always seems to need ‘something’, but I am willing to accept that as it is an older car and cars always need maintaining regardless of age. I accept that is applies to any of the options below.
I’ve been having thoughts about selling it and replacing it with a newer touring/estate to match the 10 to 15 years life mentioned above. For this, assume I do 10,000 miles a year. I feel there are the following options:
1) Keep the E39. Its currently on 105,000 miles so 15 years use would take it to 250,000 miles. I’m sure the car is capable, but maintaining it will become more expensive as it gets (even) older.
2) Buy a F31 340i. The boot space is similar to the E39, but obviously newer. From research the B58 engines are reliable. I’d look to buy one at around 50,000 miles, so would end up at around 200,000 miles.
3) Buy a G31 540i. The boot space is bigger than both the E39 & F31 which would be good, and I suspect a 5 series would be more comfortable. Again, I believe the B58 engines to be reliable. One concern I do have is that the 540i’s all seem to be X-drive which may add complications to deal with. I’d look to buy one at around 50,000 miles, so would end up at around 200,000 miles.
4) Wildcard suggestion: Mk4 Focus ST estate (pre facelift)
5) Anything the good people of Pistonheads suggest!
So if you’ve got any thoughts to help me see a solution, I’m all ears!
Thanks, Matt
Is there an option 2.5) A very late F11 535i LCi? There are a few of those on AutoTrader with amazing looking specs (i.e. all 5 buttons on the little panel below the light controls to the RHS of the steering wheel). I wonder if they are Japanese imports.
I am also very much in your camp with regards to wanting physical buttons, straight 6 and not wanting x-drive complexity. I have been considering both your options and also F11 535ds. At the moment the F11 is my fave, despite being an older design. 3series boots are a bit pokey for me.
I think aiming to keep the E39 going might become tiresome.
During my looong deliberation I have also considered a Leon ST 300 4-drive (quick, good sized boot, less tyre sensitive 4wd system, not diesel). No straight 6 though and prices have not really softened at all in 2yrs+ ! Its sister the Golf-R is another obvious choice but I don't really like the look of the estate. If a Leon LUX turned up locally at the right price I could see myself in one and it removes the slight future concern about owning a diesel.
I will watch this thread with interest.
I am also very much in your camp with regards to wanting physical buttons, straight 6 and not wanting x-drive complexity. I have been considering both your options and also F11 535ds. At the moment the F11 is my fave, despite being an older design. 3series boots are a bit pokey for me.
I think aiming to keep the E39 going might become tiresome.
During my looong deliberation I have also considered a Leon ST 300 4-drive (quick, good sized boot, less tyre sensitive 4wd system, not diesel). No straight 6 though and prices have not really softened at all in 2yrs+ ! Its sister the Golf-R is another obvious choice but I don't really like the look of the estate. If a Leon LUX turned up locally at the right price I could see myself in one and it removes the slight future concern about owning a diesel.
I will watch this thread with interest.
Suspect the difference between option 2 and 3 will depend on whether you prioritise the larger rear passenger and boot space versus the more agility when driving on smaller roads?
I think if I recall when I was looking at similar recently that the newer 5 series were actually cheaper/better value given their age versus the F31 - presumably because the latter has so much appeal given it’s a handsome devil.
I think if I recall when I was looking at similar recently that the newer 5 series were actually cheaper/better value given their age versus the F31 - presumably because the latter has so much appeal given it’s a handsome devil.
Thanks both for your thoughts.
I agree the F31 is probably slightly better looking than the G31, but I like both so not that fussed. I'm happy if the G31 is cheaper to buy!
I like the look of the Golf R myself, but wondered if the Mk7 would now be too old, and not sure if they did an estate version in the Mk8. I'll have to check.
I'm not interested in diesel. Personal opinion - there's too much expensive stuff to go wrong with them at high mileage which would negate any fuel savings.
pb8g09 said:
Suspect the difference between option 2 and 3 will depend on whether you prioritise the larger rear passenger and boot space versus the more agility when driving on smaller roads?
I think if I recall when I was looking at similar recently that the newer 5 series were actually cheaper/better value given their age versus the F31 - presumably because the latter has so much appeal given it s a handsome devil.
Whilst I wouldn't often use the space currently, it should be in the future. It is also more flexible. I'm not against having a bigger car - before the E39 I have a mk4 Mondeo estate which was pretty big.I think if I recall when I was looking at similar recently that the newer 5 series were actually cheaper/better value given their age versus the F31 - presumably because the latter has so much appeal given it s a handsome devil.
I agree the F31 is probably slightly better looking than the G31, but I like both so not that fussed. I'm happy if the G31 is cheaper to buy!
SlowV6 said:
Is there an option 2.5) A very late F11 535i LCi? There are a few of those on AutoTrader with amazing looking specs (i.e. all 5 buttons on the little panel below the light controls to the RHS of the steering wheel). I wonder if they are Japanese imports.
I am also very much in your camp with regards to wanting physical buttons, straight 6 and not wanting x-drive complexity. I have been considering both your options and also F11 535ds. At the moment the F11 is my fave, despite being an older design. 3series boots are a bit pokey for me.
I think aiming to keep the E39 going might become tiresome.
During my looong deliberation I have also considered a Leon ST 300 4-drive (quick, good sized boot, less tyre sensitive 4wd system, not diesel). No straight 6 though and prices have not really softened at all in 2yrs+ ! Its sister the Golf-R is another obvious choice but I don't really like the look of the estate. If a Leon LUX turned up locally at the right price I could see myself in one and it removes the slight future concern about owning a diesel.
I will watch this thread with interest.
Oh - hadn't thought about that, probably put them in the slightly too old camp. I'm not against a Japanese import - the current E39 is. You share the same concern around boot space, and whether a 3 series is too small. I may have to go and look at some!I am also very much in your camp with regards to wanting physical buttons, straight 6 and not wanting x-drive complexity. I have been considering both your options and also F11 535ds. At the moment the F11 is my fave, despite being an older design. 3series boots are a bit pokey for me.
I think aiming to keep the E39 going might become tiresome.
During my looong deliberation I have also considered a Leon ST 300 4-drive (quick, good sized boot, less tyre sensitive 4wd system, not diesel). No straight 6 though and prices have not really softened at all in 2yrs+ ! Its sister the Golf-R is another obvious choice but I don't really like the look of the estate. If a Leon LUX turned up locally at the right price I could see myself in one and it removes the slight future concern about owning a diesel.
I will watch this thread with interest.
I like the look of the Golf R myself, but wondered if the Mk7 would now be too old, and not sure if they did an estate version in the Mk8. I'll have to check.
I'm not interested in diesel. Personal opinion - there's too much expensive stuff to go wrong with them at high mileage which would negate any fuel savings.
How much does money come into it? The difference in price between keeping the E39 and getting into one of the newer options I guess must be pretty large? Large enough to cover some pretty big bills on the E39?
Think the E39 era of cars are really enjoying a bit of a resurgence at the minute as some petrolheads are turned off newer stuff with the million electronic gizmos and almost boring bags of pace. Will we still feel the same way in 10 years time or will it just feel like a knackered POS? Who knows...
Think the E39 era of cars are really enjoying a bit of a resurgence at the minute as some petrolheads are turned off newer stuff with the million electronic gizmos and almost boring bags of pace. Will we still feel the same way in 10 years time or will it just feel like a knackered POS? Who knows...
- for the record I'm looking at getting into an E46 M3 at the minute as a forever car. Newer stuff, even the still-analogue E9X doesn't quite hold the same appeal as the older cars...
AlexGSi2000 said:
After multiple e39s and a few e60s, I'm now running a 2015 f11 530d - fits the bill nicely although nothing will ever be quite as good as an e39!
That's part of my worry! The E39 is just so solid to drive, and whilst I am sure anything else (F11, F31, G31) would drive well, are they as good?DaveyBoyWonder said:
How much does money come into it? The difference in price between keeping the E39 and getting into one of the newer options I guess must be pretty large? Large enough to cover some pretty big bills on the E39?
Think the E39 era of cars are really enjoying a bit of a resurgence at the minute as some petrolheads are turned off newer stuff with the million electronic gizmos and almost boring bags of pace. Will we still feel the same way in 10 years time or will it just feel like a knackered POS? Who knows...
You make a fair point. One which I hadn't really considered, and one which has occupied a few of my thoughts over the last 24 hours. Did some rough maths - I think it'd be about £18k to change, so call it £300 a month for 5 years, or £150 a month for 10 years. Whether the E39 would average more than that is the question. There's a good chunk of me willing to roll that dice.Think the E39 era of cars are really enjoying a bit of a resurgence at the minute as some petrolheads are turned off newer stuff with the million electronic gizmos and almost boring bags of pace. Will we still feel the same way in 10 years time or will it just feel like a knackered POS? Who knows...
- for the record I'm looking at getting into an E46 M3 at the minute as a forever car. Newer stuff, even the still-analogue E9X doesn't quite hold the same appeal as the older cars...
I'd like to agree with you that the E39 may become a bit of a classic in a few years, so may even go up in value? Not that that is the aim. For me, the really new stuff holds no interest.
HarryW said:
Of those I d go G31.
Always found the difference between 3 s and 5 s was not just the size but the overall fit, finish and quality, with the 5 being a big step up from the 3.
Given the used values are not a million miles apart a 5 is the no brainer between them.
Appreciate the input. I'd had similar thougths ref finish/quality as well.Always found the difference between 3 s and 5 s was not just the size but the overall fit, finish and quality, with the 5 being a big step up from the 3.
Given the used values are not a million miles apart a 5 is the no brainer between them.
Having checked, the F31 has 495L of boot space vs 410L on your e39 (is it really that small?). Factoring in you can get RWD F31 340i's whereas all G31s are all xdrive I wonder if this is your sweetspot to avoid complexity and size. The downside is the 2nd hand price - they really are bloody expensive for 7 to 10 Yr old cars! We won't see the like again though so if you look after it I feel it will hold onto a lot of value.
Clearly a G31 is going to be nicer inside, quieter and more refined. No contest there. Downside is they are big (I have a Mondeo mk4.5 TitX estate, which is a big fat car but a G31 is even longer) and more complex.
Clearly a G31 is going to be nicer inside, quieter and more refined. No contest there. Downside is they are big (I have a Mondeo mk4.5 TitX estate, which is a big fat car but a G31 is even longer) and more complex.
TarquinMX5 said:
The G31 540s were mild hybrids from 2019/20, not sure of exact introduction. May, or may not, be a consideration if you're looking to keep it for years.
Not for me I don't think. Added complication I am not interested in is my view.SlowV6 said:
Having checked, the F31 has 495L of boot space vs 410L on your e39 (is it really that small?). Factoring in you can get RWD F31 340i's whereas all G31s are all xdrive I wonder if this is your sweetspot to avoid complexity and size. The downside is the 2nd hand price - they really are bloody expensive for 7 to 10 Yr old cars! We won't see the like again though so if you look after it I feel it will hold onto a lot of value.
Clearly a G31 is going to be nicer inside, quieter and more refined. No contest there. Downside is they are big (I have a Mondeo mk4.5 TitX estate, which is a big fat car but a G31 is even longer) and more complex.
The E39 boot isn't that big! I changed from a Mk4 Mondeo estate to the E39 and the size difference was quite noticable. That said, I've never filled the boot of the E39. If the G31 is bigger then the Mk4 Mondeo it is a big car! That might actually be more of a negative than I thought.Clearly a G31 is going to be nicer inside, quieter and more refined. No contest there. Downside is they are big (I have a Mondeo mk4.5 TitX estate, which is a big fat car but a G31 is even longer) and more complex.
I agree ref an F31 but they are holding their value well. However, over 10 years, I'm not sure the extra price is much of an issue.
bolidemichael said:
Do you enjoy titivation? If so, the E39 will be great for that. Niche, I admit, but we exist (mainly on Pistonheads as no where else will have us!).
I am certainly not adverse to titivation. All my cars have required some to a lesser or greater degree. I enjoy reading the threads where people keep cars going (I certainly have read some of yours). I do have a thread for the E39 (https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=&t=1951481) if you have an interest, but so far it probably isn't very trilling!Some ramblings off the back of the last few posts.
I'm far from selling the E39, but I am aware that spares of some parts becoming rarer and expensive. For instance, the sill kick plates have become tatty over their 24 years so I looked at buying replacement. For all four BMW want about £600 for them. Part of me thinks it's madness, part of me says 'where else are you buying them?'.
So I would seriously consider buying certain parts which I don't need now, but may need in the future to keep it on the road. An example being the tail lights in the boot lid. I believe them NLA now, and they all fade/crack over time. A good set now may be worthwhile buying!
I am also aware that should I 'jump ship', I may be in the same place in 5/8/10 years where parts are expensive/difficult etc. BMW do seem pretty good at supporting older models (the E39 went out of production 22 years ago), but there is no guarantee I guess.
I'm far from selling the E39, but I am aware that spares of some parts becoming rarer and expensive. For instance, the sill kick plates have become tatty over their 24 years so I looked at buying replacement. For all four BMW want about £600 for them. Part of me thinks it's madness, part of me says 'where else are you buying them?'.
So I would seriously consider buying certain parts which I don't need now, but may need in the future to keep it on the road. An example being the tail lights in the boot lid. I believe them NLA now, and they all fade/crack over time. A good set now may be worthwhile buying!
I am also aware that should I 'jump ship', I may be in the same place in 5/8/10 years where parts are expensive/difficult etc. BMW do seem pretty good at supporting older models (the E39 went out of production 22 years ago), but there is no guarantee I guess.
I have a 2012 535i Touring and in some ways it's peak 5 series in my opinion due to a combination of looks, how it drives, just enough modern tech to still be relevant today, and in my experience capable of big miles if looked after. Mine is on 143K miles with a large history file, still feels tight as a nut and I really enjoy driving it too, even on twisty B roads....it's fun to hustle along.
Just realised I never came back to this thread after my last post. Thanks to everyone who gave their opinion, it was useful to get some different thoughts given to me to make me think.
Eventually came to the decision to keep the E39, I prefer the look of it over the others and find it drives really well. That said, I am partly tempted to go and drive a G31 to double check before too much time passes, but I won't be sad if I don't.
The comment that stuck with me above was 'what's the cost to change, and how long does that keep the E39 going?'. I just can't see the E39 costing significantly more (if anything) than the cost to change over nearly ten years, even with parts going up a bit etc. I checked the price of some of the parts I'd buy to keep it going and they weren't as bad as I thought! I am conscious that there will be some ongoing things like paint repair etc, but that's likely to be the case regardless whatever choice I make.
So, this old girl will stay on the driveway for a while:
Eventually came to the decision to keep the E39, I prefer the look of it over the others and find it drives really well. That said, I am partly tempted to go and drive a G31 to double check before too much time passes, but I won't be sad if I don't.
The comment that stuck with me above was 'what's the cost to change, and how long does that keep the E39 going?'. I just can't see the E39 costing significantly more (if anything) than the cost to change over nearly ten years, even with parts going up a bit etc. I checked the price of some of the parts I'd buy to keep it going and they weren't as bad as I thought! I am conscious that there will be some ongoing things like paint repair etc, but that's likely to be the case regardless whatever choice I make.
So, this old girl will stay on the driveway for a while:
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