Buying from UK auctions - worth it for a DIYer?
Discussion
Hi all,
Has anyone here bought from Copart or similar UK auction sites recently?
I’m half tempted to buy something to use myself, mainly to save a few quid, but also because I quite enjoyed fixing my cars in the past. I’ve repaired a few over the years and I’m fairly happy with DIY stuff, especially electrical faults, trim, sensors, small mechanical bits, even upholstery, etc. The difference is that with my own cars I usually knew the history
That said, I know my limits. I wouldn’t be taking on an engine swap, cambelt change or anything needing serious tools/equipment (never say never).
For those who’ve done it, is it actually worth the time and effort?
Would you still use Copart, or are there better places in the UK for a private buyer? What sort of damage/issues would you look for, and what would you run a mile from?
Also, do the fees, storage and transport costs kill the deal most of the time? I keep seeing cars that look cheap at first glance, but I’m wondering if by the time everything is added up it’s not much of a bargain
All opinions welcome
Has anyone here bought from Copart or similar UK auction sites recently?
I’m half tempted to buy something to use myself, mainly to save a few quid, but also because I quite enjoyed fixing my cars in the past. I’ve repaired a few over the years and I’m fairly happy with DIY stuff, especially electrical faults, trim, sensors, small mechanical bits, even upholstery, etc. The difference is that with my own cars I usually knew the history
That said, I know my limits. I wouldn’t be taking on an engine swap, cambelt change or anything needing serious tools/equipment (never say never).
For those who’ve done it, is it actually worth the time and effort?
Would you still use Copart, or are there better places in the UK for a private buyer? What sort of damage/issues would you look for, and what would you run a mile from?
Also, do the fees, storage and transport costs kill the deal most of the time? I keep seeing cars that look cheap at first glance, but I’m wondering if by the time everything is added up it’s not much of a bargain
All opinions welcome
Personally I would avoid co part - It's a scrap yard with extra steps. Cars mistreated, misdescribed, moved on forklifts, fuel tanks drilled through, parts missing, staged photographs to hide damage and so on.
I've bought all of my cars from BCA/British car auctions since around COVID when used prices went bananas. I and the friends/family that I've sourced cars for have had some good luck, but then we have had a fair share of pups too -Best way to describe it is gambling with cars.
Virtually nothing we bought has been dealer or even honest private sale quality mind. There's nearly always a reason a car was traded in
Fees can be very chunky, for example on the lowest tier at BCA blue fees on a £5k car are nearly £800! Cheapies are even more painful, how about £400 on a £500 car sound? Also don't forget delivery, which is £200-£500 on top.
That's not to mention that the cars often aren't all that cheap given the risk. The prices at auction often aren't far off what you might be able to snag as a private sale if you look around, with the downside that you can't inspect the car until you legally own it, and unless you're buying very new and expensive cars, auctions often won't entertain refunds or returns and the reports aren't worth the paper they're written on.
I've bought all of my cars from BCA/British car auctions since around COVID when used prices went bananas. I and the friends/family that I've sourced cars for have had some good luck, but then we have had a fair share of pups too -Best way to describe it is gambling with cars.
Virtually nothing we bought has been dealer or even honest private sale quality mind. There's nearly always a reason a car was traded in
Fees can be very chunky, for example on the lowest tier at BCA blue fees on a £5k car are nearly £800! Cheapies are even more painful, how about £400 on a £500 car sound? Also don't forget delivery, which is £200-£500 on top.
That's not to mention that the cars often aren't all that cheap given the risk. The prices at auction often aren't far off what you might be able to snag as a private sale if you look around, with the downside that you can't inspect the car until you legally own it, and unless you're buying very new and expensive cars, auctions often won't entertain refunds or returns and the reports aren't worth the paper they're written on.
I have a mate who fixes and sells a few cars on a 'semi-retired' basis.
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
OutInTheShed said:
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins.
Asking dealers what cheap rubbish they've taken in trade-in and want gone for cash used to be a good option I've used several times in the past, but I got the impression that dealers were less keen on it now, after some fingers being burned with idiots buying a very blatant fixer-upper as a trade sale, and it going against the dealer when they tried to resist a return on it as it was considered to be a retail sale (with all the consumer rights associated with that) as soon as you sold it to a non-trade person, irrespective of everyone knowing what they were buying.Don't do it unless your are a gambler that doesn't get upset losing, or you have a friend who knows what they are doing.
Used to do salvage before big business took it over, when there were lots of small places you could pick from stock and negotiate with.
Used to buy from auction when they were somewhat honest, not big business, and you could build relationships with them and the fees were not so ridiculous.
Not done either for years, the game has changed beyond recognition.
Oh and the BCA own retail outlets, you ain't getting the good stuff through the auction.
Used to do salvage before big business took it over, when there were lots of small places you could pick from stock and negotiate with.
Used to buy from auction when they were somewhat honest, not big business, and you could build relationships with them and the fees were not so ridiculous.
Not done either for years, the game has changed beyond recognition.
Oh and the BCA own retail outlets, you ain't getting the good stuff through the auction.
My best mate does it regularly. Fixes the absolute minimum needed to get it road legal, usually does nothing more than cable tieing loose bodywork. Gets cars in the 2 to 4 year old range for a couple of grand runs them until they need maintenance and sells.
Even if he sells for £3k under the next cheapest one not at Copart it's always atleast free motoring, often making a small amount.
Think he's only been stung once on a Merc when he went a bit more upmarket, it hard a broken auto box, he just put it back into Copart and I think he lost about £1000 on that one.
They are clearly abused at Copart. Some come with a single wheel nut in each wheel, underbody damage from the forks, desirable bits stolen between the photos and it being delivered, delivery drivers who couldn't care less because the cars already broken, airbags that have been hidden for the photos. All sorts of stuff like that.
My mate picked a van up, it must have been used by a hydraulics company, he'd spied a pump bolted in the back that was worth £5k second hand. When it was delivered it had gone. Luckily he was able to send that one back as not as described.
Even if he sells for £3k under the next cheapest one not at Copart it's always atleast free motoring, often making a small amount.
Think he's only been stung once on a Merc when he went a bit more upmarket, it hard a broken auto box, he just put it back into Copart and I think he lost about £1000 on that one.
They are clearly abused at Copart. Some come with a single wheel nut in each wheel, underbody damage from the forks, desirable bits stolen between the photos and it being delivered, delivery drivers who couldn't care less because the cars already broken, airbags that have been hidden for the photos. All sorts of stuff like that.
My mate picked a van up, it must have been used by a hydraulics company, he'd spied a pump bolted in the back that was worth £5k second hand. When it was delivered it had gone. Luckily he was able to send that one back as not as described.
InitialDave said:
OutInTheShed said:
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins.
Asking dealers what cheap rubbish they've taken in trade-in and want gone for cash used to be a good option I've used several times in the past, but I got the impression that dealers were less keen on it now, after some fingers being burned with idiots buying a very blatant fixer-upper as a trade sale, and it going against the dealer when they tried to resist a return on it as it was considered to be a retail sale (with all the consumer rights associated with that) as soon as you sold it to a non-trade person, irrespective of everyone knowing what they were buying.The CRA has changed all that, at lest in theory, but a dealer selling a trade-in out the back door is protected if he does the paperwork right, more so if there is a paper trail to another business. Also we're in Devon, if you take a 50 mile radius from here once you start looking at the subset of people who have oil under their fingernails, you're never very far a mutual acquaintance.
If you look at AT and sort the whole sorry lot on price, I see cars with no MOT for sale from businesses. Would they sell them to Joe Public? Or would you need to present yourself as a trader, which isn't hard, a business card and a business bank account? Or would you need trade plates or something?
InitialDave said:
Asking dealers what cheap rubbish they've taken in trade-in and want gone for cash used to be a good option I've used several times in the past, but I got the impression that dealers were less keen on it now, after some fingers being burned with idiots buying a very blatant fixer-upper as a trade sale, and it going against the dealer when they tried to resist a return on it as it was considered to be a retail sale (with all the consumer rights associated with that) as soon as you sold it to a non-trade person, irrespective of everyone knowing what they were buying.
Never really thought about this route, but it does make sense. Probably the only way to skip the auction fees.I suppose the difficult bit is that I’m looking for something to use myself, so I’m probably being a bit pickier than someone buying purely to fix and move on. The chances of a dealer having exactly the sort of cheap trade-in I’d actually want to keep are might be fairly slim.
That said, it might still be worth a few emails or calls to local dealers, worst they can say is no. I might have to offer a contract explicitly saying that this is not a normal retail sale from a business to a consumer.
rolandka said:
InitialDave said:
Asking dealers what cheap rubbish they've taken in trade-in and want gone for cash used to be a good option I've used several times in the past, but I got the impression that dealers were less keen on it now, after some fingers being burned with idiots buying a very blatant fixer-upper as a trade sale, and it going against the dealer when they tried to resist a return on it as it was considered to be a retail sale (with all the consumer rights associated with that) as soon as you sold it to a non-trade person, irrespective of everyone knowing what they were buying.
Never really thought about this route, but it does make sense. Probably the only way to skip the auction fees.I suppose the difficult bit is that I m looking for something to use myself, so I m probably being a bit pickier than someone buying purely to fix and move on. The chances of a dealer having exactly the sort of cheap trade-in I d actually want to keep are might be fairly slim.
That said, it might still be worth a few emails or calls to local dealers, worst they can say is no. I might have to offer a contract explicitly saying that this is not a normal retail sale from a business to a consumer.
You might find a used car dealer who will but will have little choice, and they will have regular traders taking anything decent.
OutInTheShed said:
I have a mate who fixes and sells a few cars on a 'semi-retired' basis.
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
Fair enough. I'm happy to make money if I somehow found a clean route that worked. I can see the appeal of doing something like your mate does.He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
I need to spend some time researching such auctions.
Any pointers are welcome.
rolandka said:
OutInTheShed said:
I have a mate who fixes and sells a few cars on a 'semi-retired' basis.
He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
Fair enough. I'm happy to make money if I somehow found a clean route that worked. I can see the appeal of doing something like your mate does.He gets cars from a couple of dealers who take them as trade ins. Also I think the odd 'trade sale' cheapie on AT, or ebay, faceplant etc.
The auctions, in his opinion, are the main contributor to the huge void between WBAC/trade-in values and forecourt prices.
So there is money to be made bypassing the auction system.
But to make money, you have to sell. That involves having some skill as a salesman, and dealing with the 'orrible public.
You need to, at first glance, be making money for old rope, to cover the costs you haven't thought of and the Consumer Rights Act responsibilities.
There is also the risk of buying the odd total lemon. Some cars go to Pete's Place to die, not get better.
If I wanted a project to fix up for myself, I'd look at owners club FB pages, place some wanted ads, look at ebay auctions etc.
The thing is, you are competing with a lot of hobbyist buyers for some vehicles, and also with breakers.
Old Land Rovers are the classic around here, the price of a non-running Landy is inflated by the fact you can easily break one and sell some of the parts for inflated prices to other buyers/keepers of non-running Landies.
I think maybe the 'classic' auctions and other non-mainstream-motor-trade auctions might be of more interest?
I need to spend some time researching such auctions.
Any pointers are welcome.
Again though, I cherry pick the best, usually misdiagnosed faults on good cars, like the Golf Tdi, Fiesta ST, I posted in the shed thread.
We have a source of them, built up over many years doing work for main agents. Even that is under threat from promises by a big auction house.
It really isn't easy to compete with them these days.
I have a friend though, that scours club Facebook pages when he wants something to play with, and he does ok with them, but you have to factor in time scouring and viewing, then getting it from A to B, He has me to do that lol, if they can't be driven.
Trying to find things very local can lead you into bad decisions.
Indeed.
It's a good hobby for a car nut who's retired.
My mate makes some money, but on that front' he'd probably be better off getting a min wage job.
He also has some kind of half share in a car transporting trailer and a suitable vehicle or two to do the towing.
And he has the right space to play cars without attracting any attention.
He's also very clued up about cars generally and specially so with a few.
But it's getting harder, with so much electronics.
It's a good hobby for a car nut who's retired.
My mate makes some money, but on that front' he'd probably be better off getting a min wage job.
He also has some kind of half share in a car transporting trailer and a suitable vehicle or two to do the towing.
And he has the right space to play cars without attracting any attention.
He's also very clued up about cars generally and specially so with a few.
But it's getting harder, with so much electronics.
Thanks all, really useful replies and it pretty much confirms what I suspected/
Annoyingly, none of this has really put me off either. If anything, my stupid brain is now even more curious.
But I suppose that only works if you get lucky and pick the right type of problem.
Appreciate the reality check though
Annoyingly, none of this has really put me off either. If anything, my stupid brain is now even more curious.
But I suppose that only works if you get lucky and pick the right type of problem.
Appreciate the reality check though
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