M400's

[hobo]

Right, the T350c has just had its 18,000 service, and its my intention to get rid before its next major one, i.e 24,000, so I find myself looking at possible replacements.

These M400's, just how good are they ? I have only ever seen one, at a recent TVR track day, but unfortunately it broke nearly straight away & therefore was unable to have a drive/passenger ride.

Obviously they are quick, obviously they handle extremely well, so in that respect there is nothing to worry about.

What I am interested in is the following:

1) It would be my only car, so how practical are they ? Boot space, ground clearance (what is it).

2) Reliability. I understand hand built cars are prone to 'quirks' but what about the engine. I assume its pretty standard stuff & as a result should be fairly bulletproof, but it it ?

3) Servicing cost. I do circa 15,000 miles a year, so between 2 & 3 a year. TVR is same, every 6,000 miles, and cost around £600 for the minor & £1000 for the major. Is this similar ?

4) How do people react to Nobles ? I mean, people love TVR's & in all the time I've had it I've never had a bad reaction, or some prick key it, etc. Also, touch wood, it doesn't seem to be a car that people steal.

Also have been considering Sagaris (although fancy a change of marque for no other reason that to try them) or Porsche (GT2 or GT3).

[matt_fp]

All of the below based on my experience of working with them in both fast road and race enviroments.

hobo said:

1) It would be my only car, so how practical are they ? Boot space, ground clearance (what is it).

Boot space, well there isn't any. However the Noble supplied luggage set allows for a surprisingly large amount of clober to be stowed within the cabin, certainly enough for a weekend away for two. Ground clearnce on the M400 is improved over that of the GTO/3/3R due to the lack of a front splitter, speedbumps etc. are no problem but aggresive ones will have to be taken at 45 degrees for clam preservation.

hobo said:

2) Reliability. I understand hand built cars are prone to 'quirks' but what about the engine. I assume its pretty standard stuff & as a result should be fairly bulletproof, but it it ?

Engines are Ford Duratec based with extensive modifications. As such the many millions of pounds of development Ford carried out on the engines (top end oiling at low temperature, cam wear rates, rocker wear rates etc. etc.) is all still very valid. The M400 is the latest development of the M12 line and as such is very well developed. Quirks tend to be limited to the odd rattle/sqeak or glitch with a minor system. I know of several which are used daily and they are reliable.

hobo said:

3) Servicing cost. I do circa 15,000 miles a year, so between 2 & 3 a year. TVR is same, every 6,000 miles, and cost around £600 for the minor & £1000 for the major. Is this similar ?

Pretty much although those who have cars serviced by the dealer/service network will be able to give you more details on that point. However I would say budget for running it on Optimax or similar, if it was mine I would.

hobo said:

4) How do people react to Nobles ? I mean, people love TVR's & in all the time I've had it I've never had a bad reaction, or some prick key it, etc. Also, touch wood, it doesn't seem to be a car that people steal.

I've never seen anyone react badly to a Noble, or heard of one being keyed, vandalised etc. People seem to genuinely respect the cars, even if they don't quite know what it is

Best Regards
Matt


>> Edited by matt_fp on Friday 19th August 14:57

[chillidog]

1) No boot, just some space for slim objects behind the seats and on the slim parcel shelf.

2) Reliability seems pretty good. Nothing serious to report thus far after several trackdays.

3) Similar costs to what you've stated for the TVR.

4) People love them - don't get one if you're a shrinking violet. If people steal them they either crash them or find they can't sell them on ... see reports on the thefts from the factory.

So overall so far so good (well great actually).
--
Richard

[amg merc]

hobo said:

How do people react to Nobles?

Sounds like your questions have been covered off but I'll add my response to this one...

With genuine respect and awe. If you had a Ferrari it wouldn't generate anything as much interest OR respect (just this lunch time my hand was shaken by a Petrolhead simply because I MENTIONED that I owned a Noble - it isn't even with me today!!!)

Tip #732A: Carry some glass cleaner with you - you'll need it!

Tip # 432 Get used to being photographed!

[joust]

hobo said:

1) It would be my only car, so how practical are they ? Boot space, ground clearance (what is it).

Ground clearance is fine - I've yet to find a multi-story that it has problems in.

Boot space - err - well, you can get the nice 6 set of bags that fit in it, and you can easily put 2 people's clothes for a week in them, but after that, you are into "innovative" solutions.

If you are on your own you are fine, the passenger seat takes 2 weeks tesco shopping fine, but if you have a passenger then you have to make use of the spaces behind the seats, on the parcel shelf, and under your legs.

Saying that, you can fit a squishy golf club bag behind the headrests on the parcel shelf, and everything else seems to always find a home

hobo said:

2) Reliability. I understand hand built cars are prone to 'quirks' but what about the engine. I assume its pretty standard stuff & as a result should be fairly bulletproof, but it it ?

I'd happily now say it's totally bulletproof, despite having been through quite a few rebuilds on the 2.5.

This is a standard Ford lump that's been played with, not a complete bespoke design. All my problems with car no. 26 are well documented, but are part of the experience of having car no. 26. Sure, I seemed to be the test pilot for overheating, turbos and various other bits, but that's par for the course. Now they are well into 800+ cars the new engines are so well sorted (all have now been mapped by Roush engineering, the peeps that did the UK Ford GT mapping), and the turbo/cooling problems well and truely fixed that it's fair to say it's now been years it seems since we had anyone on here talking about engine problems.

With the racing guys also pushing more and more power out of the cars, the engine seems to be seriously solid.

hobo said:

3) Servicing cost. I do circa 15,000 miles a year, so between 2 & 3 a year. TVR is same, every 6,000 miles, and cost around £600 for the minor & £1000 for the major. Is this similar ?

Spot on, check out www.lotus-elise.org.uk/noble for my M12 costs and before "optionals" you are right on the nose on the costs for a Noble service.

hobo said:

4) How do people react to Nobles ? I mean, people love TVR's & in all the time I've had it I've never had a bad reaction, or some prick key it, etc. Also, touch wood, it doesn't seem to be a car that people steal.

Grin. Smile. Wave. You'll have to get used to being in a bit of a "goldfish bowl" when driving it, and also put up with refueling taking 5-15 minutes more as you'll have camera phone's and questions galore. As for stealing them, after the two that were nicked from the factory didn't managed to get sold on after 2 months, the market for them is seriously "tight" and people wouldn't bother. The recent annoucement of the £50 per track day insurance cover from Autotorque (www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=201567&f=26&h=0) shows that Noble's are a better risk than the 'rest'.

hobo said:

Also have been considering Sagaris (although fancy a change of marque for no other reason that to try them) or Porsche (GT2 or GT3).

Each to their own, but as with most things, drive them all and then make your choice (at which point we'll be welcoming you to the fold )