Exhaust options?

[lucozade]

Hi all,

My 3R may or may not have a cracked manifold. It's 13 months old (yes 1 month out of warranty!) and has 11000 miles on the clock :cry: . Anyway I'm not going to debate the obvious issue here but just want to know alternatives at this stage.

I'm told the one originally fitted to the 3R is no longer used for whatever reason (probably because they crack too easy!) and that I may require the M400 one.

I've read through various posts on exhausts/manifolds and wondered if anybody else had any experience of replacing, i.e. should I just get the M400 one or are there better alternative systems out there?

[alex s]

I have just ( last week) had a new exhaust made. My manifolds were Knackered too, split to hell and back. I ended up getting the M400 ones as there was a time issue for me as the exhaust guys were fitting it. Must say not too happy paying a premium to replace what was in essence a faulty part !!
I know Matt is in the process of trying to get some cast ones made, which I was going to go with, but the lead time was delayed ( through no fault of his I might add) the M400 ones are the standard ones that have a second skin welded on at the point where all 3 pipes join. I also know these have failed on one car, but this is the only option at the mo. I did ask the exhaust guys how much to make some new ones up, and was quoted £800 !!! The standard ones are £80, the M400 are £140 + vat. Hope that helps.
Alex.

[joust]

Without getting into any discussion about timing, £140 for a manifold is "excellent value" compared top the Ur-Quattro which chews them about once every 2-3 years (and no, they can't fix the design) and it's £600 each time

£140 is a positive bargin in that respect!

J

[lucozade]

alex s said:

I have just ( last week) had a new exhaust made. My manifolds were Knackered too, split to hell and back. I ended up getting the M400 ones as there was a time issue for me as the exhaust guys were fitting it. Must say not too happy paying a premium to replace what was in essence a faulty part !! I know Matt is in the process of trying to get some cast ones made, which I was going to go with, but the lead time was delayed ( through no fault of his I might add) the M400 ones are the standard ones that have a second skin welded on at the point where all 3 pipes join. I also know these have failed on one car, but this is the only option at the mo. I did ask the exhaust guys how much to make some new ones up, and was quoted £800 !!! The standard ones are £80, the M400 are £140 + vat. Hope that helps. Alex.

Much appreciated Alex.
Dealer has just called to say they have managed to fix the manifold by welding it. Although I guess the inevitable is soon to happen.

[alex s]

Justin, it is not so much the cost of the manifolds, it is the 7 hours labour to replace them.

[joust]

alex s said:

Justin, it is not so much the cost of the manifolds, it is the 7 hours labour to replace them.

Nod - it's about the same on the Ur - so total bill at £50/hr is nearly £1k....

J

[Mr Noble]

Vegantune had a VORTEX system there when I was down having my sexy tail lights fitted.

They said it made a Noble sound like a McMerc SLR.

Now that would be nice!!

Don't know where they are up to with it though.

Are they on here to comment please?

Greg

[alex s]

Greg, the vortex was for the 2.5, think they did one for the 3 as well, very well made, just too much money for me.
Adrian W has got a vegan exhaust. might beworth asking him.
Alex

[Mr Noble]

Think there is going to be a lot to see and examine at the Parade!!

Hope I don't see too many things I want........too much £££!!

GN

[mc101]

Guys

I had a first hand look over the vegantune system last week (and heard it running) -- looks very nice and much tidier than the factory affair. Sounds alot nicer too at idle.

Alas its a bit beyond my means at the moment having just had a fair amount sorted at the service!

ps; equally cheesed off owner over BOTH manifolds failing in the first 7K miles (19 months) along with the rear collector. Looks like they are made of cheese. Went for the replacement/reinforced ones and a new collector -- its the TIME not the parts thats the killer.

[gizard]

So is there no way to fit new manifolds without taking out the engine?

[alex s]

It is not a engine out job, just quite hard to get to the front manifold, undertray has to come off ( hundreds of screws!!)Factory quoted 7 hours for both, i got the rear changed in about an hour. the front is the time consuming one.

[lucozade]

So the factory know that this is an issue yet are not willing to honour that fact if a manifold has an early retirement.

I must say from some of the issues I have had recently I am becoming exceptionally disappointed in the approach of the factory. A dealer is no good to anybody if they don't have factory support.

So disappointed in fact that I've started looking at different marques.

[worty]

What sort of money is the vegantune system anyone know ?

[alex s]

Loads!!Around the £3000 mark!! Nice system, but too expensive for me.

[JOUST]

lucozade said:

I must say from some of the issues I have had recently I am becoming exceptionally disappointed in the approach of the factory. A dealer is no good to anybody if they don't have factory support.

Any claim you have is against the supplying dealer though, including if you believe that it isn't reasonable for the failure to have occured in the timeline. If that is the case then you should persue your rights, not 'accept' that you have to pay.

Remember the SoGA gives you up to six years to file a complaint about a miss-sell under the act, but you can only enforce that against the dealer, not the factory.

The factory backed warranty is in addition to your statutory rights, not instead of. Not sure why people therefore have gripes with the factory when the factory supplied one expires - you still have your normal SoGA rights preserved.

Further information is available here
www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/your-rights/fs_c04.shtml

J

[Siban]

So again we have multiple Noble owners experiencing issues with poor manifold quality, and even worse not being able to get replacements.

We had this thread kicked off my by me in April.

www.pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?t=174590&f=26&h=0&hw=manifold

Final response from Simon was:

"I have looked into this, and indeed there does seem to be a shortage of these bespoke parts from SA at the moment. However, we are now onto the case and will get back to you very soon regarding future availability.

Simon Hucknall
Press Officer
Noble Automotive Ltd."

So message back to Simon Hucknall. We didn't hear anything last time and again you have grumbling owners about manifold problems and supply's.

Any response now?



>> Edited by Siban on Thursday 25th August 15:10

[worty]

alex s said:

Loads!!Around the £3000 mark!! Nice system, but too expensive for me.

Ouch !

[lucozade]

JOUST said:

lucozade said: I must say from some of the issues I have had recently I am becoming exceptionally disappointed in the approach of the factory. A dealer is no good to anybody if they don't have factory support. Any claim you have is against the supplying dealer though, including if you believe that it isn't reasonable for the failure to have occured in the timeline. If that is the case then you should persue your rights, not 'accept' that you have to pay. Remember the SoGA gives you up to six years to file a complaint about a miss-sell under the act, but you can only enforce that against the dealer, not the factory. The factory backed warranty is in addition to your statutory rights, not instead of. Not sure why people therefore have gripes with the factory when the factory supplied one expires - you still have your normal SoGA rights preserved. Further information is available here www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/your-rights/fs_c04.shtml J

thanks Justin,

I'm very well versed on this subject but thanks for the recap.

I can't discuss detail online but I'm very surprised at the stance taken by the factory most recently even whilst my car was in warranty the dealer has had to swallow a lot of charges instead of passing them onto me. I'm starting to get a picture that the dealer is not obtaining the support they require. That's why I'm dissapointed.

if the manifold is a known weak area then I'm very surprise the dealers are getting the cold shoulder treatment, irrespective if its in warranty of out of warranty. Apparently, the part, plus fitting is in the region of £600.

My car is now out of warranty and I really don't want to have to use "my rights" option if anything now goes bang but I do get the impression that the dealer will now be making a loss on my car if they honour any further work.

[amg merc]

I don't know of many M12's where the exhaust box top bracket hasn't been re-welded at least once! I did suggest a stainless steel band around the box with a bolt pick-up on it (so you bolt to this instead of going directly onto the box where the vibration weakens it).