The M15 and 6 pot supercars....
Discussion
SO I was discussing with a fair few phers at the weekend about the M!5 and several remarked upon the similarities to the Jag XJ220 - i.e. 6 pot twin turbo supercar with massive performance (indeed it was compared to the Jag in the Autocar article).
The Jag - desite being a pucker supercar from a premium marque (Albeit at a rather higher price point than the M15) did rather suffer from not having a V8/v12 in the engine compartment which rather hit sales.
Anyone think that noble shoudl ahve gone the V8 route with this car - or will the 6pot and twin turbo (same solution as the 911TT after all you could argue!) put off otherwise potential owners?
I was arguing that in the end if the performance and handling are there then buyers will be there - others weren't so sure and argued that soundtrack is very important at this level of the market (witness the AMV8 for example) and as such it would be an issue.
What do you lot think?
The Jag - desite being a pucker supercar from a premium marque (Albeit at a rather higher price point than the M15) did rather suffer from not having a V8/v12 in the engine compartment which rather hit sales.
Anyone think that noble shoudl ahve gone the V8 route with this car - or will the 6pot and twin turbo (same solution as the 911TT after all you could argue!) put off otherwise potential owners?
I was arguing that in the end if the performance and handling are there then buyers will be there - others weren't so sure and argued that soundtrack is very important at this level of the market (witness the AMV8 for example) and as such it would be an issue.
What do you lot think?
lol Martin
The Jag was a different kettle of fish surely. IIRC they promised a high cylinder engine, but down specced it when cash got tight whilst simultaneously enforcing peoples purchase contracts. A pretty disgusting affair all round.
On whether or not the lack of bespoke engine is an issue, I guess the market will decide. By all accounts they have loads of deposits in, so looks like there are buyers.
Not saying bespoke - I'd rather that a small volume manufacturer (be it TVR / Morgan / Noble) bought in the powerplant - makes for good reliability and ease of parts supply.
Also good point that the XJ was originally promised with a v12 and 'downgraded' to a V6.
My point was more that some people I chatted with suggested that the car would probably sell it's allocation no problem - but probably wouldn't steal buyers away from gallardos / 430's purely becuase the powerplant is a v6...
I'm not so sure - if the performance can be demonstrated to be superior then for some bragging rights and ultimate ability will outweigh traditional values about supercars being V12's etc
Also good point that the XJ was originally promised with a v12 and 'downgraded' to a V6.
My point was more that some people I chatted with suggested that the car would probably sell it's allocation no problem - but probably wouldn't steal buyers away from gallardos / 430's purely becuase the powerplant is a v6...
I'm not so sure - if the performance can be demonstrated to be superior then for some bragging rights and ultimate ability will outweigh traditional values about supercars being V12's etc
mr_tony said:
Not saying bespoke - I'd rather that a small volume manufacturer (be it TVR / Morgan / Noble) bought in the powerplant - makes for good reliability and ease of parts supply.
Also good point that the XJ was originally promised with a v12 and 'downgraded' to a V6.
My point was more that some people I chatted with suggested that the car would probably sell it's allocation no problem - but probably wouldn't steal buyers away from gallardos / 430's purely becuase the powerplant is a v6...
I'm not so sure - if the performance can be demonstrated to be superior then for some bragging rights and ultimate ability will outweigh traditional values about supercars being V12's etc
I think you are spot on. There are plenty of people who would never consider an M15 for a variety of reasons, but as long as they have enough buyers I guess they aren't worried. The mags keep on wittering on about stealing Porsche sales etc. but I'm not so sure that is where the buyers will come from.
I agree...if you want a Porche you buy a Porche. If Noble sell the quota then they've filled a niche from where I'm looking. There will allways be people who want to be different/go against the grain (me being one of them 
) and a lot of them are real drivers. To them the M15 must look allmost irresistable. I know if I was as rich as Justin I'd have put my deposit down about 15 nano seconds after he did 
Martin.
) and a lot of them are real drivers. To them the M15 must look allmost irresistable. I know if I was as rich as Justin I'd have put my deposit down about 15 nano seconds after he did Martin.
These are the V6 'supercars' that I could think of:
Maserati Merak
Maserati Mistral
Maserati Biturbo
Maserati Ghibli
Venturi Atlantique
Dino 246
Honda NSX
Delorean
Alpine-Renault GTA
Lancia Stratos
Some, but not all, are mid engined like the M15.
And in answer to your question, yes I think Noble have missed a trick: the M15 needs a normally aspirated V8, V10 or V12. Perhaps they're saving that for the M16 ....
Maserati Merak
Maserati Mistral
Maserati Biturbo
Maserati Ghibli
Venturi Atlantique
Dino 246
Honda NSX
Delorean
Alpine-Renault GTA
Lancia Stratos
Some, but not all, are mid engined like the M15.
And in answer to your question, yes I think Noble have missed a trick: the M15 needs a normally aspirated V8, V10 or V12. Perhaps they're saving that for the M16 ....
V6GTO said:They have an existing relationship with Ford who could supply one. In fact Roush even tune it on the Mustang.
So if they went V8 for the next car, where do you think they should/could source it?
Alternatively look to Chevrolet, BMW or maybe even AMG.
>> Edited by jeremyc on Monday 24th April 18:19
I think people are missing the point. The V6 lump is a good 40kg or more lighter than a V8, and with 455lbft of torque is every bit as "good", and probably even better than most of the V8 lumps out there.
Nobles are about driving passion (hence their tagline), not posing / noise value. Lee is quoted as saying that the M15 passes all drive by noise, and doesn't have a flap to make it louder post 5000rpm (outside the drive by tests) ala AMV8 et. all.
Having spent a considerable amount of time in a V8 engined car, I just couldn't get used to the fact it's all over by around 6000rpm - hardly makes for the intense driving experience.
But then I was 'brought up' on turbo cars.
J
Nobles are about driving passion (hence their tagline), not posing / noise value. Lee is quoted as saying that the M15 passes all drive by noise, and doesn't have a flap to make it louder post 5000rpm (outside the drive by tests) ala AMV8 et. all.
Having spent a considerable amount of time in a V8 engined car, I just couldn't get used to the fact it's all over by around 6000rpm - hardly makes for the intense driving experience.
But then I was 'brought up' on turbo cars.
J
joust said:
Having spent a considerable amount of time in a V8 engined car, I just couldn't get used to the fact it's all over by around 6000rpm - hardly makes for the intense driving experience.
Been to any F1 GPs this year Justin
Martin.
Edited to add:- I've seen the F1 V8s testing in Jerez and Valencia this spring and they look/sound/go every bit as good as the V10s they replace
>> Edited by V6GTO on Monday 24th April 22:08
V6GTO said:
Having spent a considerable amount of time in a V8 engined car, I just couldn't get used to the fact it's all over by around 6000rpm - hardly makes for the intense driving experience.
Been to any F1 GPs this year Justin
Martin.
Edited to add:- I've seen the F1 V8s testing in Jerez and Valencia this spring and they look/sound/go every bit as good as the V10s they replace
>> Edited by V6GTO on Monday 24th April 22:08
Dear Justin
As a by product of owning a Noble, you automatically qualify for posing
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