Rant (note capital 'R')
Discussion
Anyone want to enlighten me before i get my service in the big smoke?Sheesh, he's got a lot of anger.
Well I bought a mug from him (I went all out on a present for father
), and it works very well, and I have not heard a bad word said about the NobleMods mug on this forum, and as far as I know the tea from it tastes nice. So 
. I also do not know of anyone trying to copy the mug to replicate its good drink holding abilities. Right I'm not sure where this is going so i'm going to stop typing now 
.
Well I bought a mug from him (I went all out on a present for father
), and it works very well, and I have not heard a bad word said about the NobleMods mug on this forum, and as far as I know the tea from it tastes nice. So . I also do not know of anyone trying to copy the mug to replicate its good drink holding abilities. Right I'm not sure where this is going so i'm going to stop typing now .joolski said:
And exactly why have you posted this here? He says he's not interested in this forum and we're all a bunch of ignorant idiots
adrian w said:
joolski said:
And exactly why have you posted this here? He says he's not interested in this forum and we're all a bunch of ignorant idiots
Adrian to be fair, he actually says "finding out about meets and there are some nice people on there" at the end, so you are miss quoting him somewhat.
I guess Jools posted it on here as he is a Noble owner, as is Graham, and thought other Noble owners would be interested to read it, Also has he lied at all (Graham)?
People use this forum as a base to get advice and recomendations, and some of the reports have been through somewhat rose tinted glasses, not yours I might add, before you jump all over me. All IMO.
Yes Graham is a friend of mine, through Noble ownership and I for one am grateful that Noblemods exist, and he makes the effort to make bits and offer a good quality product at a reasonable price, as I am a great believer in that most expensive is not always the best(just a far larger profit margin/overheads)If it was the case, I for one would be out of job and company. But you will always get people thinking that most expensive=best, which I dont mind, what I do mind is these people saying that it is better, with NO independant data to back it up.
I have done several buys in the past for other owners and stumped up seveal '000's upfront to benefit others( you included) ( Tyres from the States, drip trays, Rads) and I didnt make a penny out of them. Sorted out meets, paid in advance for Hotels for people( and had to wait months for payment in one case). But I still try and keep positive, then i get sarcasm in posts from new owners and I can see Grahams point........
joolski said:
Not me.....
I have the greatest respect for Graham, and, I think Noblemods has suffered from not being "THE BIG PLAYER" and people always feel safe with a large firm.
I for one will be using Graham, sometime soon when my wallet allows for several parts, and quite possible to help upgrade some of the "agricultural" stuff.
I wish he would come back to the forum, he has a wealth of knowledge and I know from a conversation I had with him that for most part, he is correct.
Do not get me wrong, I do not regret any mods I have had, I have learned a hell of a lot about my car, a lot of that from Graham.
I also know Mr X, and, in his defence, he has some great ideas and has teh factory and the name behind him. Could he do better for less? I am sure he can. Why charge so much for the upgrades he does? Probably because they are a "BIG PLAYER, and someone has to pay the bills.
So who is right and who is wrong?
They are both right, but, I now have a feeling that Graham has a wealth of experience building rally cars, these are constantly put to the test and pushed to the absolute limit. Does he have pedigree?
I think so, does Mr. X?
Yes, along with a factory name that makes your eyes water. (How easily one can be seduced).
We all have opinions, and I do not want to upset anyone, no doubt I will with my next sentence.
Mr X, can you please now advise how I fix my oil leak without trekking all the way down south?
Please, yer pays yer money and learn from mistakes, we all have our own opinions, I for one do, but lets be honest, you try one thing and hope it works out, if not, you complain.
I am not a complainer, in fact, I hate it, I just want things right, and if they are not, I tend to try and live with it and I forgive, some say too easily. You all know he is talking about my car, the oil p1ss1ing out from the cooler and it is no secret how much I paid, and I know I could have got it done for far less, I just went for what I thought was the safer option.
Now for my last point, do I know everything about cars, engines and am I a racer?
Of course the answer to this is an emphatic YES.
I am the font of all knowledge, and thanks to Graham I expect to join Jenson and Lewis towards the end of the year. (a bit of humour).
I do not profess to know anything about engines etc apart form what I have gleaned from Mr X and Graham, and as for being a racer, I would like to this I am not that bad, after all, Graham has tutored me on most of my track days, and at the beginning of each session I was being overtaken by all and sundry, at the end of the session, not one Noble passed me (it was Brands), in fact, I was on the tail of the quickest of em all on the day (thanks Graham) and alexs will attest to that.
Hope the above muddled part rant clears up my view and shows that I am firmly sat on the fence.
I for one will be using Graham, sometime soon when my wallet allows for several parts, and quite possible to help upgrade some of the "agricultural" stuff.
I wish he would come back to the forum, he has a wealth of knowledge and I know from a conversation I had with him that for most part, he is correct.
Do not get me wrong, I do not regret any mods I have had, I have learned a hell of a lot about my car, a lot of that from Graham.
I also know Mr X, and, in his defence, he has some great ideas and has teh factory and the name behind him. Could he do better for less? I am sure he can. Why charge so much for the upgrades he does? Probably because they are a "BIG PLAYER, and someone has to pay the bills.
So who is right and who is wrong?
They are both right, but, I now have a feeling that Graham has a wealth of experience building rally cars, these are constantly put to the test and pushed to the absolute limit. Does he have pedigree?
I think so, does Mr. X?
Yes, along with a factory name that makes your eyes water. (How easily one can be seduced).
We all have opinions, and I do not want to upset anyone, no doubt I will with my next sentence.
Mr X, can you please now advise how I fix my oil leak without trekking all the way down south?
Please, yer pays yer money and learn from mistakes, we all have our own opinions, I for one do, but lets be honest, you try one thing and hope it works out, if not, you complain.
I am not a complainer, in fact, I hate it, I just want things right, and if they are not, I tend to try and live with it and I forgive, some say too easily. You all know he is talking about my car, the oil p1ss1ing out from the cooler and it is no secret how much I paid, and I know I could have got it done for far less, I just went for what I thought was the safer option.
Now for my last point, do I know everything about cars, engines and am I a racer?
Of course the answer to this is an emphatic YES.
I am the font of all knowledge, and thanks to Graham I expect to join Jenson and Lewis towards the end of the year. (a bit of humour).
I do not profess to know anything about engines etc apart form what I have gleaned from Mr X and Graham, and as for being a racer, I would like to this I am not that bad, after all, Graham has tutored me on most of my track days, and at the beginning of each session I was being overtaken by all and sundry, at the end of the session, not one Noble passed me (it was Brands), in fact, I was on the tail of the quickest of em all on the day (thanks Graham) and alexs will attest to that.
Hope the above muddled part rant clears up my view and shows that I am firmly sat on the fence.
Dear Jools,
edit edit edit. This forum is for owners and all those that support the owners and their cars. Graham's contributions both personal and commercial via Noblemods have allways been unbiased, honest and based on a wealth of knowledge and experience. I had not read the "rant" before but if its true that Roush tested his exhaust and then went away and developed their own a few months later then that is a very valid and interesting sequence of events. That's not to say that Graham held the worldwide exclusive rights to Noble exhaust developments and of course in the aftermarket world anyone can develop anything they like. The danger is that what you develop may be copied. I don't know who's exhaust is best but what I do know is that for Graham to have been hounded off this forum is a loss for us all.
I would like all suppliers, big and small, to be able to contribute to this forum.
I also think that whenever a supplier makes a contribution they should declare their interest.
That way we will all be able to judge whether they are genuinely trying to add to the discussion or just trying to rubbish a rivals product.
The older members of this list know the nicknames used by the various suppliers but the newer ones may not so lets have some clarity on these please when they post in the future.
I don't want this forum dominated by Roush or Noblemods or anyone else. Just my 2 pennyworth.
Regards
Paul C
edit edit edit. This forum is for owners and all those that support the owners and their cars. Graham's contributions both personal and commercial via Noblemods have allways been unbiased, honest and based on a wealth of knowledge and experience. I had not read the "rant" before but if its true that Roush tested his exhaust and then went away and developed their own a few months later then that is a very valid and interesting sequence of events. That's not to say that Graham held the worldwide exclusive rights to Noble exhaust developments and of course in the aftermarket world anyone can develop anything they like. The danger is that what you develop may be copied. I don't know who's exhaust is best but what I do know is that for Graham to have been hounded off this forum is a loss for us all.
I would like all suppliers, big and small, to be able to contribute to this forum.
I also think that whenever a supplier makes a contribution they should declare their interest.
That way we will all be able to judge whether they are genuinely trying to add to the discussion or just trying to rubbish a rivals product.
The older members of this list know the nicknames used by the various suppliers but the newer ones may not so lets have some clarity on these please when they post in the future.
I don't want this forum dominated by Roush or Noblemods or anyone else. Just my 2 pennyworth.
Regards
Paul C
Edited by paulcundy on Tuesday 3rd April 12:44
Dear Paul,
Au contraire mon ami ! I did not get the wrong idea, nor did I write the Rant.
It was posted here as I thought that other owners would be interested.
As for the policy of vendors posting in this forum, I have no problem with that at all.
Many 'facts' which are posted here are often examined very carefully, and queried when required.
--Jools
Au contraire mon ami ! I did not get the wrong idea, nor did I write the Rant.
It was posted here as I thought that other owners would be interested.
As for the policy of vendors posting in this forum, I have no problem with that at all.
Many 'facts' which are posted here are often examined very carefully, and queried when required.
--Jools
joolski said:
Dear Paul,
Au contraire mon ami ! I did not get the wrong idea, nor did I write the Rant.
It was posted here as I thought that other owners would be interested.
As for the policy of vendors posting in this forum, I have no problem with that at all.
Many 'facts' which are posted here are often examined very carefully, and queried when required.
--Jools
Au contraire mon ami ! I did not get the wrong idea, nor did I write the Rant.
It was posted here as I thought that other owners would be interested.
As for the policy of vendors posting in this forum, I have no problem with that at all.
Many 'facts' which are posted here are often examined very carefully, and queried when required.
--Jools
Zut alors! just re-read your original. Got completely the wrong end of the stick. Maintenant Je compris!
please delete the first sentence of my post!
Regards
Paul C
I can see where Graham is coming from, but isn't it a bit contradictory to complain that people here don't know much about car engineering and then complain when they get seduced by the lure of a big well known tuning company?
It's the same with whatever marque. Very few know much about these things at any level of depth, including the vendors and we all run herd like towards the best marketing! As he says, no one wants to believe their 3k exhaust is no better than a 1k one and its an easy upsell regardless of value.
Anyway I still think I got done on servicing by a company no longer with us, so that just shows I'm not writing this from any position of competence!
It's the same with whatever marque. Very few know much about these things at any level of depth, including the vendors and we all run herd like towards the best marketing! As he says, no one wants to believe their 3k exhaust is no better than a 1k one and its an easy upsell regardless of value.
Anyway I still think I got done on servicing by a company no longer with us, so that just shows I'm not writing this from any position of competence!
Edited by DanH on Tuesday 3rd April 16:15
Its a shame that Graham feels that he does. The 'commercial' world operates on commercial terms. Graham, doing it for beer money, operates on beer money terms.
I for one value the option of having a mainstream commercial organisation that can take the car, do whatever they need to do and then hand it back. In addition said company is 20 minutes away by train from my work place which means I don't lose any working time to have things like this fitted. In addition, I always have the protection of it being a mainstream commercial organisation should anything go wrong.
Graham has posted that if you buy the system from him, take it to company X to fit it, then to company Y to test it, then add this, that and god knows what else you get the same thing for £100s less, but I have to say I'm really not that interested in it.
To have a rant therefore based on the fact that many people have clearly made the same decision is a bit strange. If it really is 'beer money', why care if someone else offers a complete package at a premium?
His assertion that things were copied is a strange one as if he was that worried about it he would have ensured appropriate IPR protection. But then that would have cost £1000s to do, and hence he would have had to charge a lot more.
Mr X's company provides a valued service to me. If I am paying over the odds in people's eyes, then fine, but then I place a certain value on hours or a day of my time, and choose appropriately.
I do think we need to assume people that have bought Noble's are wise enough to make their own choices. If people have chosen to go to place A rather than place B for their purchases then they need to respect that.
J
I for one value the option of having a mainstream commercial organisation that can take the car, do whatever they need to do and then hand it back. In addition said company is 20 minutes away by train from my work place which means I don't lose any working time to have things like this fitted. In addition, I always have the protection of it being a mainstream commercial organisation should anything go wrong.
Graham has posted that if you buy the system from him, take it to company X to fit it, then to company Y to test it, then add this, that and god knows what else you get the same thing for £100s less, but I have to say I'm really not that interested in it.
To have a rant therefore based on the fact that many people have clearly made the same decision is a bit strange. If it really is 'beer money', why care if someone else offers a complete package at a premium?
His assertion that things were copied is a strange one as if he was that worried about it he would have ensured appropriate IPR protection. But then that would have cost £1000s to do, and hence he would have had to charge a lot more.
Mr X's company provides a valued service to me. If I am paying over the odds in people's eyes, then fine, but then I place a certain value on hours or a day of my time, and choose appropriately.
I do think we need to assume people that have bought Noble's are wise enough to make their own choices. If people have chosen to go to place A rather than place B for their purchases then they need to respect that.
J
Edited by joust on Tuesday 3rd April 19:26
joust said:
Its a shame that Graham feels that he does. The 'commercial' world operates on commercial terms. Graham, doing it for beer money, operates on beer money terms.
I for one value the option of having a mainstream commercial organisation that can take the car, do whatever they need to do and then hand it back. In addition said company is 20 minutes away by train from my work place which means I don't lose any working time to have things like this fitted. In addition, I always have the protection of it being a mainstream commercial organisation should anything go wrong.
Graham has posted that if you buy the system from him, take it to company X to fit it, then to company Y to test it, then add this, that and god knows what else you get the same thing for £100s less, but I have to say I'm really not that interested in it.
To have a rant therefore based on the fact that many people have clearly made the same decision is a bit strange. If it really is 'beer money', why care if someone else offers a complete package at a premium?
His assertion that things were copied is a strange one as if he was that worried about it he would have ensured appropriate IPR protection. But then that would have cost £1000s to do, and hence he would have had to charge a lot more.
Mr X's company provides a valued service to me. If I am paying over the odds in people's eyes, then fine, but then I place a certain value on hours or a day of my time, and choose appropriately.
I do think we need to assume people that have bought Noble's are wise enough to make their own choices. If people have chosen to go to place A rather than place B for their purchases then they need to respect that.
J
I for one value the option of having a mainstream commercial organisation that can take the car, do whatever they need to do and then hand it back. In addition said company is 20 minutes away by train from my work place which means I don't lose any working time to have things like this fitted. In addition, I always have the protection of it being a mainstream commercial organisation should anything go wrong.
Graham has posted that if you buy the system from him, take it to company X to fit it, then to company Y to test it, then add this, that and god knows what else you get the same thing for £100s less, but I have to say I'm really not that interested in it.
To have a rant therefore based on the fact that many people have clearly made the same decision is a bit strange. If it really is 'beer money', why care if someone else offers a complete package at a premium?
His assertion that things were copied is a strange one as if he was that worried about it he would have ensured appropriate IPR protection. But then that would have cost £1000s to do, and hence he would have had to charge a lot more.
Mr X's company provides a valued service to me. If I am paying over the odds in people's eyes, then fine, but then I place a certain value on hours or a day of my time, and choose appropriately.
I do think we need to assume people that have bought Noble's are wise enough to make their own choices. If people have chosen to go to place A rather than place B for their purchases then they need to respect that.
J
Edited by joust on Tuesday 3rd April 19:26
I don't understand the exhaust thing, there are only so many ways you can bend pipework to eject the gases, if you consider motorbikes there are hundreds of very similar looking exhaust systems all making different claims. With regard to IPR/copywrite/patent no chance its all been done before. I was quite happy to pay a premium for an exhaust that was demonstrated to work on the rollers.
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