Discussion
My gearbox is currently out being 'beefed-up' so I was wondering what clutch would you guys recommend goes in when it's put back together?
It's a GTO3 that's had some tweaks and is running just short of 390 Bhp but I plan to tweak it a little more - nothing excessive - probably 400-425 tops. So, is there a stronger clutch out there suited to that kind of power and where do I get one, guide prices etc?
Thanks
It's a GTO3 that's had some tweaks and is running just short of 390 Bhp but I plan to tweak it a little more - nothing excessive - probably 400-425 tops. So, is there a stronger clutch out there suited to that kind of power and where do I get one, guide prices etc?
Thanks
I would talk to these people, bit over the top but you wont break it.
http://www.helix-autosport.com/
http://www.helix-autosport.com/
Adrian W said:
I would talk to these people, bit over the top but you wont break it.
http://www.helix-autosport.com/
Have to say that I didn't find them very responsive/helpful. For that sort of power and torque I would have thought the OEM AP clutch was more than adequate. http://www.helix-autosport.com/
Just spoke to the factory and was told that the 5spd box uses a different clutch to the 6spd and that the part (AP) is only available from them or the dealer network - AP won't supply direct!
Was also told that there are no after market clutches - AP is the only one. That being the case, I just hope it's up to the job as others have suggested but as per Adrian's response, have contacted Helix to see if they have something to offer.
Good news is, they are in stock at £295 + VAT.
If anyone else knows of any alternatives to the OEM part, please let me know so I can consider it.
Thanks
Was also told that there are no after market clutches - AP is the only one. That being the case, I just hope it's up to the job as others have suggested but as per Adrian's response, have contacted Helix to see if they have something to offer.
Good news is, they are in stock at £295 + VAT.
If anyone else knows of any alternatives to the OEM part, please let me know so I can consider it.
Thanks
Colin,
We (Revolve, formally Roush) worked with Helix to get both a standard type clutch and a paddle type clutch developed for the Nobles. So the factory are not quite correct in stating that AP are the only ones who make Noble clutches. I believe now that Helix are in a position to supply covers as well as the plates.
Beefing up the standard 5sp is definitely a good idea (especially if yours has been tweaked) as several Nobles with the 5-speed have failed, particularly on track days - I saw cars leaving for the Factory for warranty work at the first Rockingham owners day I attended....
It's no urban myth that the 5-speed boxes fail.
Hope that helps,
YellowShed
PS By 5-speed box, I mean the whole transaxle including the diff, just to be clear
We (Revolve, formally Roush) worked with Helix to get both a standard type clutch and a paddle type clutch developed for the Nobles. So the factory are not quite correct in stating that AP are the only ones who make Noble clutches. I believe now that Helix are in a position to supply covers as well as the plates.
Beefing up the standard 5sp is definitely a good idea (especially if yours has been tweaked) as several Nobles with the 5-speed have failed, particularly on track days - I saw cars leaving for the Factory for warranty work at the first Rockingham owners day I attended....
It's no urban myth that the 5-speed boxes fail.
Hope that helps,
YellowShed
PS By 5-speed box, I mean the whole transaxle including the diff, just to be clear
how much is a 6 speed box and how different is it to the standard ford 6 speed unit?
My cars an everyday machine and if the open diff 5speed box is likelly to fail I wouldnt mind collecting the parts to upgrade before it happens so I can swop em out when I get the chance.
Is the 5 speed and M400 clutch different then? will they fit on the flywheel etc?
My cars an everyday machine and if the open diff 5speed box is likelly to fail I wouldnt mind collecting the parts to upgrade before it happens so I can swop em out when I get the chance.
Is the 5 speed and M400 clutch different then? will they fit on the flywheel etc?
YellowShed said:
Colin,
We (Revolve, formally Roush) worked with Helix to get both a standard type clutch and a paddle type clutch developed for the Nobles. So the factory are not quite correct in stating that AP are the only ones who make Noble clutches. I believe now that Helix are in a position to supply covers as well as the plates.
Beefing up the standard 5sp is definitely a good idea (especially if yours has been tweaked) as several Nobles with the 5-speed have failed, particularly on track days - I saw cars leaving for the Factory for warranty work at the first Rockingham owners day I attended....
It's no urban myth that the 5-speed boxes fail.
Hope that helps,
YellowShed
PS By 5-speed box, I mean the whole transaxle including the diff, just to be clear
Thanks for the update Trevor... a quaife diff was fitted some time ago so just need the gearbox strengthened and will have a new clutch fitted as a matter of course. We (Revolve, formally Roush) worked with Helix to get both a standard type clutch and a paddle type clutch developed for the Nobles. So the factory are not quite correct in stating that AP are the only ones who make Noble clutches. I believe now that Helix are in a position to supply covers as well as the plates.
Beefing up the standard 5sp is definitely a good idea (especially if yours has been tweaked) as several Nobles with the 5-speed have failed, particularly on track days - I saw cars leaving for the Factory for warranty work at the first Rockingham owners day I attended....
It's no urban myth that the 5-speed boxes fail.
Hope that helps,
YellowShed
PS By 5-speed box, I mean the whole transaxle including the diff, just to be clear
I'll wait and see what Helix come back with then.
I was beginning to think I was the only one who knew this, after taking so much flak on the other thread for daring to point this fact out. Lakelord said:
I'll wait and see what Helix come back with then.
Have spoken with Terry at Helix who informed me that during development, they came up with a number of prototypes for Lee however Lee, as we know, chose to work with AP exclusively for brakes and clutches. Helix not happy. 
Anyway, they were very helpful and said that if I were to send them the bits that have been removed, they'll have a look and see if they have anything suitable and can fabricate one if required. They hold M400 clutches in stock and much cheaper than the OEM part for the GT03
All I need do now is get hold of the garage and get the bits despatched to them and see what they come up with.
p.s. Definitely not a myth as to 5spd's letting so. This is how all this started!!
I've also spoken with Helix today, very helpful. 
Unfortunately for me their options aren't gonna hold up, Based on the additional clamp load increases and differing clutch plate options, it looks like uprating the clutch will only see it capable of dealing with a little over 500lb/ft.
There also appears to be a twin plate option with them (possibly) as well which is a healthier 620lb/ft rated. Sadly, neither of these are likely to hold up so it looks likely that I will be having a custom twin plate unit and flywheel from Tilton.
Mike.
Unfortunately for me their options aren't gonna hold up, Based on the additional clamp load increases and differing clutch plate options, it looks like uprating the clutch will only see it capable of dealing with a little over 500lb/ft.
There also appears to be a twin plate option with them (possibly) as well which is a healthier 620lb/ft rated. Sadly, neither of these are likely to hold up so it looks likely that I will be having a custom twin plate unit and flywheel from Tilton.
Mike.
Adrian W said:
That'll be a different flywheel then!
Hopefully, it would be a fair bit of additional engineering work I'd rather not do if it isn't. 
There are several flywheel and clutch options, (including carbon) I'll be going down to see them in the near future, need to mine is slipping and my new Turbo's are chomping at the bit to be installed.
We've worked with them before and they're also doing a "special" for my Impreza which we're aiming to get some bigger numbers from later in the year.
Mike.
Edited by Mike Tuckwood on Thursday 5th March 17:14
NobleGuy said:
I only remember two or three actual gearboxes (discounting diffs) breaking and being mentioned on here in 3 years or so, and at least one of those was a 6-spd - 5th gear is the weak point on them (apparently).
Yes, Lee himself managed to break one 6-speed and a second one went in a customer car IIRC at the same meeting at Donington a few years back - and that was after he'd just replaced the box, too!! The 6-speeds break for a different reason - 5th gear as you correctly identified - which we believe we have addressed on chillidog's car (previously running over 500lbft of torque - maybe more tonight !!!!) 
There were other problems racers faced with the 6-speed, but again, we feel that our solution has prevented them from being a factor in chillidog's car.
YellowShed
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