I am out of Ideas, help required please
Discussion
I have had the problem where the noble quit on me last week, it was blowing fuse 9 which controled alternator etc.
The alternator was taken out and was repaired. The fuse is no longer blowing.
Drove the car home, it was fine, day or 2 later, went to start it and nothing!!! This time the fuse is not blowing, so i thought wonder has the battery cells got damaged the day i ran it into the ground...
So put a new battery in it just today. once again drove 20miles, stopped the car, left it for a few hours and now it wont start again - i can assure u no lights etc left on.
Bump started the car got it home, turned it off and it just chugs for a second then clicks trying to start!
I really need some help or advice on this - it does appear that the alternator is giving the battery charge, but all symptons suggest it isnt, The car wont turn over, but yet it will still play CD player etc. If u put a set up jump leads on the starter motor, it starts straight away also.
The alternator was taken out and was repaired. The fuse is no longer blowing.
Drove the car home, it was fine, day or 2 later, went to start it and nothing!!! This time the fuse is not blowing, so i thought wonder has the battery cells got damaged the day i ran it into the ground...
So put a new battery in it just today. once again drove 20miles, stopped the car, left it for a few hours and now it wont start again - i can assure u no lights etc left on.
Bump started the car got it home, turned it off and it just chugs for a second then clicks trying to start!
I really need some help or advice on this - it does appear that the alternator is giving the battery charge, but all symptons suggest it isnt, The car wont turn over, but yet it will still play CD player etc. If u put a set up jump leads on the starter motor, it starts straight away also.
Mike Tuckwood said:
Sounds like the alternator isn't actually charging the battery and it's just running it down?
Mike.
I would have thought the same - but last time this happened, the car just ground to a halt. Ie the CD player shut off, the wipers just started going slow, then the car just gave up and stalled as the battery was drained. This time the car still seems like it has battery power, as the CD-player etc still runs fine etc.Mike.
Not unless its just a matter of time before it shuts down again, ie there is enough life in the new battery to run these things at the moment but not enough to start the car.
In fairness as soon as the new battery was put in, it worked fine, but then again last time we put the battery on a trickle to charge it, it made no difference! The trickle was put on at the starter motor end though. Not unless there is some wiring issue between the starter and the battery!
So i went out to the car this morning after reading your replys (thanks again so much for everyones suggestions)
The car started with a serious splutter - Just about fired up before it packed it in. Did the light test and it seeemed to brighten up (though it was a very sunny day and hard to tell)
I had a quick look and changed all the fuses in the rear behind the drivers seat. The car seems to be starting up perfect now- I wont hold my breath though... gonna take the car for a 10-15 mins drive once i get home from work, i will then see if it starts again.
The car started with a serious splutter - Just about fired up before it packed it in. Did the light test and it seeemed to brighten up (though it was a very sunny day and hard to tell)
I had a quick look and changed all the fuses in the rear behind the drivers seat. The car seems to be starting up perfect now- I wont hold my breath though... gonna take the car for a 10-15 mins drive once i get home from work, i will then see if it starts again.
If you have a voltmeter, check the voltage with the car off, then start the car and check the voltage with the engine running. Should get ~12 volts with the engine off, ~13.8-14.4 volts with the engine running. If you don't, your alternator isn't charging - might be the alternator, or the voltage regulator. One important thing to check every time you start your car is to make sure that the battery light goes on before you press the "start" button. If it doesn't, your alternator won't be getting the field current it needs to start charging.
If your alternator is OK, with the engine off put an ammeter on the battery to see if there are any current drains. If you see any drains, pull the fuses one-by-one to isolate the drain to a single circuit, then go through that circuit using the wiring diagrams in the US manual to track down the drain. Remember, though, it may take a bit for the current readings to stabilize, as some of the electronics (like alarm or stereo) may have to go into hibernation. Take a reading, then see if that reading changes over the next half hour or so before you start tearing out fuses and checking the schematics.
If there aren't any drains, check all the wiring coming off the alternator and the rear harness for heat damage. At least in the cars I've seen, the harness near the relays in the engine compartment is very susceptible to the heat coming off the front turbo. Even if the wires have been wrapped in that orange heat shielding, check to make sure that they aren't stiff from the wire insulation melting. Route the alternator wiring, along with the wiring to the A/C compressor clutch as far away from the front downpipe as possible - I like to route them across towards the side of the car rather than straight towards the bulkhead. If the wiring from the alternator is damaged, during the repair I'd suggest replacing the alternator output wire with a larger gauge wire as the current wire is right on the edge for the amount of current it can carry. If you do replace the wire, you need to replace it all the way to the main distribution splice in the rear of the tunnel.
It's a good idea to put some heat shielding around your battery - it can get hot enough to melt the battery casing, which is much hotter than what will shorten the life of your battery.
If your alternator is OK, with the engine off put an ammeter on the battery to see if there are any current drains. If you see any drains, pull the fuses one-by-one to isolate the drain to a single circuit, then go through that circuit using the wiring diagrams in the US manual to track down the drain. Remember, though, it may take a bit for the current readings to stabilize, as some of the electronics (like alarm or stereo) may have to go into hibernation. Take a reading, then see if that reading changes over the next half hour or so before you start tearing out fuses and checking the schematics.
If there aren't any drains, check all the wiring coming off the alternator and the rear harness for heat damage. At least in the cars I've seen, the harness near the relays in the engine compartment is very susceptible to the heat coming off the front turbo. Even if the wires have been wrapped in that orange heat shielding, check to make sure that they aren't stiff from the wire insulation melting. Route the alternator wiring, along with the wiring to the A/C compressor clutch as far away from the front downpipe as possible - I like to route them across towards the side of the car rather than straight towards the bulkhead. If the wiring from the alternator is damaged, during the repair I'd suggest replacing the alternator output wire with a larger gauge wire as the current wire is right on the edge for the amount of current it can carry. If you do replace the wire, you need to replace it all the way to the main distribution splice in the rear of the tunnel.
It's a good idea to put some heat shielding around your battery - it can get hot enough to melt the battery casing, which is much hotter than what will shorten the life of your battery.
I have just been out, once again it caughed on startup i drove 2-3 miles, stopped it and tried to start it again.
The Battery light is now on when i am driving, so there is clearly something not working at the alternator side, preventing the battery from charging.
I cannot stress how annoyed I am at this as the alternator has been in for repair, and I have paid for a half assed job being done!
The Battery light is now on when i am driving, so there is clearly something not working at the alternator side, preventing the battery from charging.
I cannot stress how annoyed I am at this as the alternator has been in for repair, and I have paid for a half assed job being done!
After having similar issues with mine recently I'd def check the alternator wiring as Jim suggests. I found when i took the grey heat sheathing off, where the alternator wires met the a/c wires things didn't look very good at all and after replacing the blue/black 1.5mm wires and the main red 6mm wires and then using extra heat proofing around the new wires, my car's been fine since.
It's a right pain to do this with just jacks and axel stands so if you know anyone who's got a lift/pit it would save loads of time.
Leon
It's a right pain to do this with just jacks and axel stands so if you know anyone who's got a lift/pit it would save loads of time.
Leon
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