Andy Bates of AB Performance on Dragons Den
Discussion
SeanyD said:
Saw this last night and did wonder if he was a PH'er, is he?
I don't think he is, but I could be wrong. He does use the Locost forum though as my other half was informed of his appearance kn dragons den by the man himself. He was very hush hush about it all until the show had been aired though. khm said:
thought he did very well, got the best dragon for the job IMO only thing he slipped on was when talking about potential should have quote radical sports cars - they haven't done so bad have they !!
A couple of things sprung to mind though.His is one of many BEC mini-group c cars - surprised that Peter - I know cars me - Jones didn't mention this.
The other was that I reckon Jones could be a pain in the arse to work with as he really didn't come across as knowledgeable enough when he was interviewed on TG. His medalling could prove problematic IMO as he just doesn't seem to know that area of the market.
Still, I wish them both the best of luck.
I thought he came across well too.
Although if I'd been him, I'd probably have come up with some figures about the trackday market... talking about the number of BECs in existence doesn't really sell the size of the potential market.
What amused be was that you could see some of them sat there thinking: It's a car. With a motorbike engine. I don't understand. But I'll ask a question because I think I should. Oh bugger, I've just highlighted that I REALLY don't understand.
Although if I'd been him, I'd probably have come up with some figures about the trackday market... talking about the number of BECs in existence doesn't really sell the size of the potential market.
What amused be was that you could see some of them sat there thinking: It's a car. With a motorbike engine. I don't understand. But I'll ask a question because I think I should. Oh bugger, I've just highlighted that I REALLY don't understand.
Andy is probably THE man when it comes to (at least Fireblade engined) kit cars and the like - I know he's working on something of his own so shall check out the show on iplayer!!
www.abperformance.co.uk
(and no he's not paying me for the plug lol - he's worked on my fireblade engined striker so can vouch for his work!)
www.abperformance.co.uk
(and no he's not paying me for the plug lol - he's worked on my fireblade engined striker so can vouch for his work!)
He has worked on my car in the past. About 18 months ago I was up there and he gave me a sneaky preview of that car while in the wooden buck stage in the unit next door. I am glad he has got his sights set on bigger things. One thing he showed me was the fact the chassis was to use identical uprights on all 4 corners unlike many rivals. This gave the advantage of only having to carry 1 spare uright which will fit any corner. Little details like that impressed, saving money and time. Good luck to him, he was also very helpful to me when I was broken down in the middle of the French Alps in my BEC, he had several avenues for me to explore regarding tracing the fault.
Having just watched it for the first time, I think he should not have taken that investment. His AB performance workshop is his bread and butter income, the Sabre is a side project with potential to be profitable if they can shift enough units. Say it takes off and he becomes the next Radical, and is shifting 10 road cars, 20 race cars for his own championship per year, and all the parts / servicing / repairs of the vehicles. Great.
If Sabre does not take off as intended, then he has just given away 35% of his existing garage business, which I think he will struggle to survive on 65% of his existing income. £50K is not a monstrous amount, would probobly just cover the build of 2 quality demonstrators to the levels of say Radical, road and trackday versions. I'd have not gone above 20% ideally. In fact, ideally seperated out the Sabre to a stand alone investment, I think giving him 35% of AB Peformance for £50k is not a bad deal for the Dragon, and I think he knew it.
I wish him all the best though, hopefully the Dragon can get him so huge exposure and take it to the next level.
If Sabre does not take off as intended, then he has just given away 35% of his existing garage business, which I think he will struggle to survive on 65% of his existing income. £50K is not a monstrous amount, would probobly just cover the build of 2 quality demonstrators to the levels of say Radical, road and trackday versions. I'd have not gone above 20% ideally. In fact, ideally seperated out the Sabre to a stand alone investment, I think giving him 35% of AB Peformance for £50k is not a bad deal for the Dragon, and I think he knew it.
I wish him all the best though, hopefully the Dragon can get him so huge exposure and take it to the next level.
Edited by Furyblade_Lee on Tuesday 6th September 11:41
Edited by Furyblade_Lee on Tuesday 6th September 11:48
Furyblade_Lee said:
One thing he showed me was the fact the chassis was to use identical uprights on all 4 corners unlike many rivals. This gave the advantage of only having to carry 1 spare uright which will fit any corner. Little details like that impressed, saving money and time.
We do that with the uprights and wishbones on the customer cars, as you say, benefit is you can fix any corner with a single spare, but it does mean you have to compromise the performance of the suspension - our own cars don't run the same system for that reason. Just watched on iplayer and thought he did extremely well - kept his cool, well reasoned - just generally impressive. Would certainly make me think he's someone I'd confidently buy from if I was in the market.
TBH the Sabre did nothing for me - another Radical/MK/XTR2 clone in my eyes - but who cares, I'm not his customer base. I sincerely hope he get's a great return from Peter's input - all power to him!
TBH the Sabre did nothing for me - another Radical/MK/XTR2 clone in my eyes - but who cares, I'm not his customer base. I sincerely hope he get's a great return from Peter's input - all power to him!
i have no idea what you are talking about.
Andy, if your reading this, i googled "sabre car" and dont get anything untill about the third page that resembles a kit/sports car. Borland racing in OZ make a good formula V called the Sabre.....there are other cars out there as well with the same name.
if i google "AB sabre" it comes up.
Andy, if your reading this, i googled "sabre car" and dont get anything untill about the third page that resembles a kit/sports car. Borland racing in OZ make a good formula V called the Sabre.....there are other cars out there as well with the same name.
if i google "AB sabre" it comes up.
Furyblade_Lee said:
Having just watched it for the first time, I think he should not have taken that investment. His AB performance workshop is his bread and butter income, the Sabre is a side project with potential to be profitable if they can shift enough units. Say it takes off and he becomes the next Radical, and is shifting 10 road cars, 20 race cars for his own championship per year, and all the parts / servicing / repairs of the vehicles. Great.
If Sabre does not take off as intended, then he has just given away 35% of his existing garage business, which I think he will struggle to survive on 65% of his existing income. £50K is not a monstrous amount, would probobly just cover the build of 2 quality demonstrators to the levels of say Radical, road and trackday versions. I'd have not gone above 20% ideally. In fact, ideally seperated out the Sabre to a stand alone investment, I think giving him 35% of AB Peformance for £50k is not a bad deal for the Dragon, and I think he knew it.
I wish him all the best though, hopefully the Dragon can get him so huge exposure and take it to the next level.
Lee, this must be a first - I agree with you! If Sabre does not take off as intended, then he has just given away 35% of his existing garage business, which I think he will struggle to survive on 65% of his existing income. £50K is not a monstrous amount, would probobly just cover the build of 2 quality demonstrators to the levels of say Radical, road and trackday versions. I'd have not gone above 20% ideally. In fact, ideally seperated out the Sabre to a stand alone investment, I think giving him 35% of AB Peformance for £50k is not a bad deal for the Dragon, and I think he knew it.
I wish him all the best though, hopefully the Dragon can get him so huge exposure and take it to the next level.
Edited by Furyblade_Lee on Tuesday 6th September 11:41
Edited by Furyblade_Lee on Tuesday 6th September 11:48
However, having a Dragon on board could obviously open up all sorts of publicity opportunities, not least the possibility of an appearance on Top Gear given his connections. I guess one of the biggest changes with this sort of thing is the publics perception of the vehicle, general public perception of kitcars in general is not good & if the vehicle becomes more "acceptable" due to a "celebrity" having involvement this could well have sufficient weight to carry the whole project past its tipping point where suddenly everything becomes much more mainstream & you can do everything in house removing supplier problems, quality inconsistancies & bottlenecks. Whatever happens I wish Andy all the best with it!Fantastic to see kit cars exposed on a high profile programme. I was delighted to see Andy professionally deliver his points whilst still maintaining his clear enthusiasm. A perfect balance. I even pressed the red button to see the extra part of the prog. Peter clearly has a few ideas. He mentioned "a range" of vehicles under the Sabre brand and also mentioned a utility vehicle. Not sure if that is what Andy has in mind but it is brilliant to see that he captured the imagination of a well known blue chip investor.
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