Kitcars, SVA, Catalytic converter
Discussion
hi. can anybody explain me why (and how) it is possible to registrate a car after 1992 in uk without any catalytic converter? background: i live in germany and i have been always interested in kitcars. here kitcars are the same like cars, which means that from beginning of 1993, every car registrated later than this date, must have a catalytic converter fitted. so most of the kits imported from uk cannot be legaly registrated (ok, there are some, but nobody really knows how the owners have done it..some "undertable" money for the mot-tester might have helped).
In the UK a kitcar can be registered as a new vehicle provided everything on it is new with the exception that one assembly can be 're-manufactured'.
My Ultima has a re-manufactured engine. As the block is pre 1973 then the emissions testing requirement is 'visual smoke' which even as a test is somewhat subjective.
An additional benefit is that having no CO2 rating it does not fall into the new tax classes introduced for cars registered after 2001. Instead it is rated at 'vehicles above 1549cc' with a tax of £175. As a 6700cc V8 it goes without saying that it would otherwise fall into the highest CO2 rating at £210 tax.
Steve
My Ultima has a re-manufactured engine. As the block is pre 1973 then the emissions testing requirement is 'visual smoke' which even as a test is somewhat subjective.
An additional benefit is that having no CO2 rating it does not fall into the new tax classes introduced for cars registered after 2001. Instead it is rated at 'vehicles above 1549cc' with a tax of £175. As a 6700cc V8 it goes without saying that it would otherwise fall into the highest CO2 rating at £210 tax.
Steve
You can get aftermarket Catalytic converters, some made specifically for Kit cars, although I'd get a car with EFI that supports the use of a CAT. If the engine age is a big problem, it may be more beneficial to by a part built kit and fit the engine Cat etc you need to meet the regulations.
Over here the same problem applies , all engines at the moment have to meet EU3, soon to be EU4, here a modern wreck (usually the current year) is used to supply the engine , ECU etc. the vehicle must use the ECU from that model vehicle. it also must fit a KW/Ton ratio (to stop "overpowered' sportscars being built) and the injection system must be unaltered. The Vehicle must also fit a chassis beam & torsion test, pass a driving test(bump steer etc.) and you have to get a ministers approval to start the build. It is basically tested & treated as a new vehicle and tested to such levels.The rule books come on a number of CD's and you have to fit all their rules (no matter how stupid).
To put things in perspective you can get cats to fit these cars for less than 100 quid which look ok and you can get performance cats for more money which also don't reduce power that much. The major benefit of choosing a newer engine over a really old one is that a lot more power is available together with efficiency improved by technology. Although it goes slightly against the grain a cat is a relatively small price to pay for the benefits that can be gained from a modern engine. You can also by pass the cat and run a different map for track work too.
SVA requirement is for emissions test not weather you have a cat or not. If you can meet the emisions target for your year engine without a cat then thats o.k. Most modern EFI engines will come close to the latest but might need a bit of help and a low back pressure sports cat will do the job without much of a performance hit and needn't cost a fortune. Got mine (3" bore as fitted to Subaru 555 team rally cars) for under £100 from www.catsandpipes.co.uk/
Web site is nothing more than a phone number and email address but well worth talking to.
Web site is nothing more than a phone number and email address but well worth talking to.
kenmorton said:
SVA requirement is for emissions test not weather you have a cat or not. If you can meet the emisions target for your year engine without a cat then thats o.k.........
I thought if the engine was post 1993 it had to have a cat. Can't quote you any legislation backing that up through.
Steve
an aftermarket cat will not sort out the problem here in germany, as all cars after 1992 must pass certain emmision laws like Eu2 or EU3, so only fully controlled injection/cat systems will make it...and i have never seen cars like that offered in UK.
the intense of my basic question was, that i cannot understand that we live in the EU and all countries should be the same, but certain kitcars registrated in uk cannot be registrated here or another example is france.
the intense of my basic question was, that i cannot understand that we live in the EU and all countries should be the same, but certain kitcars registrated in uk cannot be registrated here or another example is france.
Don't know if this is of any help but what would happen if you bought a UK registered car and imported it ? would this get you around the problems you talk about ? I recently sold UK registered a Bike engined kit too a guy from Holland as it was the only way he could get around the legislation he had too deal with and have the type of car/engine combination he wanted.
micha said:
the intense of my basic question was, that i cannot understand that we live in the EU and all countries should be the same, but certain kitcars registrated in uk cannot be registrated here or another example is france.
Thankfully we are not all the same and long may it stay that way. Micha, Germany should come into line with us that way you could build what you want (within certain limits).
@john ison: thats why i asked, even a former uk-registrated kit, later than 1992, cannot be officially registrated here.
in netherland it might be differnt.
in france even harder than here.
the only way is to buy cars from 1992 or earlier....
picked-up yesterday a 1990 westfield in uk, with DHOC lotus big-valve engine and drove it home through in rain and the cold (no hood)....nice toy!!!
in netherland it might be differnt.
in france even harder than here.
the only way is to buy cars from 1992 or earlier....
picked-up yesterday a 1990 westfield in uk, with DHOC lotus big-valve engine and drove it home through in rain and the cold (no hood)....nice toy!!!
Micha, I've never really understood this "European" thing either - not that I'm complaining! Over here, the car is supposed to meet (depending on the age of its engine) European limits but our government were quite clever with the wording of the regulations.
Suppose we have a 1994 car (or a car with a 1994 engine). In Germany, I think you would have to meet Euro III emissions. Over here, the car would too BUT once it is registered, the annual "roadworthiness" test (the "MOT" test in the UK) allows it to be tested to much less stringent limits than in the type approval test - on the assumption that it is not a brand new engine and it is therefore not fair to make it meet the same standards as when it was brand new. Also, a full EU III test would be extremely expensive (about £600) to carry out each year!
So because the engines in kit cars are often not "new", they are tested at SVA to the "in service" limits that the UK government demands of Euro III engines and not the limits that would have been required of them in their type approval test when they were new.
Also, I think the absolute latest date that EC Whole VEhicle Type Approval became mandatory for existing types of vehicle was 1996? We can use engines manufactured up to the end of July 1995 without a cat because up until then, each EC Member State could impose its own type approval requriements.
Suppose we have a 1994 car (or a car with a 1994 engine). In Germany, I think you would have to meet Euro III emissions. Over here, the car would too BUT once it is registered, the annual "roadworthiness" test (the "MOT" test in the UK) allows it to be tested to much less stringent limits than in the type approval test - on the assumption that it is not a brand new engine and it is therefore not fair to make it meet the same standards as when it was brand new. Also, a full EU III test would be extremely expensive (about £600) to carry out each year!
So because the engines in kit cars are often not "new", they are tested at SVA to the "in service" limits that the UK government demands of Euro III engines and not the limits that would have been required of them in their type approval test when they were new.
Also, I think the absolute latest date that EC Whole VEhicle Type Approval became mandatory for existing types of vehicle was 1996? We can use engines manufactured up to the end of July 1995 without a cat because up until then, each EC Member State could impose its own type approval requriements.
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